Growing trend in PR Servers since .05

[=CDU=Junkoe]

I see your argument about how it changes the game and yeah it does. So does installing a mod for BF2 it changes the game. I just like playing a different way then most of you and apparently so do some other people.

There are good points from a lot of you purists but could some of you please stop with the it's a REALISM MOD thing or GTFO nilla heads. For starters I hate BF2 stock it bores me to tears so without PR with lower spawn times I won't go back to BF2 vanilla. I just won't play BF2 until I found some other mod I enjoy more on it.

Also the it's a realism mod I just don't get, it may be a realism mod but it's just that. A mod to an arcade FPS game. You want pure realism you are gonna want something like no respawn, no minimap, no nametags ever, etc etc. I don't see how spawn times have anything to do with it being realistic or not as long as you can respawn at all.

[General_J0k3r]

There is something about this thread that reminds me of an earlier one where it was argued that the officer kit should not be needed to lay down a rally point because rally points were not commonly being laid down with the system as implemented. As I recall the thread was officially put to bed with (more or less) ‘the officer kit-rally point system will not be changing’. Great…but less than24 hours later another developer opened thread appeared saying that (more or less) ‘it has been noticed that squad leaders are not all they could be so we will be running educational training sessions on how to be a good SL…sign up here’.

SLs that refuse to take an officer kit and set up rally points should not be SL imho. nothing more useful than a rally point when suddenly a tank pops up in front of ur squad .

edit:

I see your argument about how it changes the game and yeah it does. So does installing a mod for BF2 it changes the game. I just like playing a different way then most of you and apparently so do some other people.

There are good points from a lot of you purists but could some of you please stop with the it's a REALISM MOD thing or GTFO nilla heads. For starters I hate BF2 stock it bores me to tears so without PR with lower spawn times I won't go back to BF2 I just won't play BF2 until I found some other mod I enjoy more on it.

Also the it's a realism mod I just don't get, it may be a realism mod but it's just that. A mod to an arcade FPS game. You want pure realism you are gonna want something like no respawn, no minimap, no nametags ever, etc etc. I don't see how spawn times have anything to do with it being realistic or not as long as you can respawn at all.

how many ppl did invade basrah IRL? 32? that's the technological max for this engine, so the respawn could be interpreted as a "simulation" of more troops hanging round.

[Master Shake]

I still think messing with these settings totally changes the game and that just shouldn't be possible. Its Project Reality, a realism mod. RE-AL-ISM.

Realism says you never re-spawn....cause your dead,......you play one round and you die once, you can never play realism again?

The "reality" of the situation is the people playing on short spawn time servers love the mod, they just don't like sitting idle for 7 minutes a round while there dead. I don't have much time to play and I love the mod, but if I get in a round with homebase spawn campers or I get tked over and over again because of A-10 whores I ussually jump out of the game in frustration. Not so much in a 15 second spawn server.

Just for a bit of backround aside from a tough fire figthing round or a round like I mentioned above im ussualy 2-3 or more to 1 with my kill to death ratio.

I do understand why the 30sec spawn was created, but I don't think the rest of the game has caught up with that concept nor do I think the majority of the players have as well.
It's almost like the cart before the horse,....

I will play this mod to its fullest either way and I have nothing but respect and appriciation for the Devs working on this thing,....we will see where it goes and I will be there reguardless, but currently the 30 sec spawn time turns me off a bit.......but when I see the true benifit of it now or in the future I will embrace it whole heartedly.

[=CDU=Junkoe]

Thx joker, at least that makes some sense. I don't necessarily agree with it but at least it has more meat to it then the it's a realism mod thing.

[maxnik]

So… if the servers are better then why are they not full instead? Seriously? The answer is that the definition of ‘better’ varies and that you (and me for that matter since I don’t like short spawn) are in the minority. That’s all that can be said. You might ‘believe’ that people should be allowed to play however they want but what you are actually alluding to here is much more than simply making certain that they don’t play how they want to, its making sure that they play the way YOU want them to on the servers YOU want them to play on….if they play at all.

Personally I have no problems with the current state of servers. I don’t know what the fuss is about. If the argument is that fast spawn/loose PR pollutes the gamespace and causes noobs to play on ‘pure’ PR servers I have to say that we were all noobs coming over to PR from BF2 noob space at one time. People sample and if they like what they find they stay, otherwise they exit. Not a big deal.

What disturbs me is this.. flavour of arrogance in the thread… The ‘play it this way or go back to vanilla’ attitude. That attitude does not build a community; it poisons it and leaves it stunted, exclusive and smug.

I totally agree. with TheOldDog.

Reading through the thread I pretty much do not feel like playing this game anymore.

Can you guys imagine that there are people out there who have real lives, like going to work, taking care of their kids, but who still want to have a chance to play the game? Yes, I'm a noob..., at least in your understanding. Yes I die a lot, and yes maybe once a night I shoot a teammate. Most of the nights I get only 30-60 mins to play, if any. Do I want to play on a full server? Or on a server with 3 people... Do I want to wait super long time to spawn?

A lot of people in OSF community are in the same situation, as I am. That's why we VOTE on certain settings for OUR servers.

If developers do not want us to host PR server, stop releasing the game to public.
Or you are welcome to ask us to stop hosting the server with the settings that WE want. Just come and post on our forum.

[Master Shake]

Maybe its all just a case of "Server Envy"???

I had to try and bring a little levity in here....

[bosco_]

Concerning the so called elitist attitude... it's better to have a small community of serious and realism orientated gamers then a big one full of players who don't want to play the mod how it should be played ( also concerning limited kits and so on)
PS: Not beeing able to play more then one hour or so is IMO no excuse... just don't die every minute and you won't spend most of the time waiting

[IronTaxi]

anyway someone please lock adn delete this thread its not doing much good me thinks...

[Hauler]

Guys everyone can play the way they want to play. Its that easy. I love the realism and junkoes wants to speed it up I really dont understand who this is hurting?? Stop saying there ruining the game cause there not. I have fun playing on TG and just about 15 mins ago I had a great game with a great squad. You can play without having tards in it. Just go to a server that caters to your needs this isnt the army things can be different. Seriously if your playing on a 24/7 basra then yes your going to get the tards just like on 24/7 kark. Put yourself in the situation you want and stop worrying about what other people want to do with THERE time and money. Please do close this.

[General_J0k3r]

positive thing might also be: vanilla style players go to short spawn servers and the "real" PR servers get only dedicated teamplayers

[foodmaniac2003]

eggman']I have to say we didn't anticipate so many server admins butchering up the mod heh. Having 1 or 2 servers that deviate... that's totally cool imo .. different strokes for different folks... but to see the majority of the servers with some sort of odd and awful configuration hack is not acceptable to us.

Things like spawn timers and attrition spawning .. like it or not .. are part of the design of the mod. How can the Insurgents be balanced when their advantage is varying from server to server? How are we supposed to take feedback from players on vehicle dynamics when server admins are having tanks respawn in 2 minutes??

And as for ABR .. well WE control the criterion for ABR ranked servers, so we'll probably be disabling some servers from ABR if they go outside of acceptable configuration parameters.

I think we'll probably have a "recruit" setting and a PROS setting... something like that... but right now the mod is being hacked up so badly by server admins that I can't even recognise it and it attracts the wrong sort of player. There will be other mods / games out there for folks to play if they don't like what we do with restricting PR configuration changes.

Im all for this! Even in BF1942 and its mods Server Side Modding was looked down on. For example, some servers would put 1943-45 weapons in 1939 maps. It's total lack of disrespect for:
A) Devs
B) Mappers
C) The community

I support SSM for bugs, but not to totally change a map and its gameplay, that is, unless that is what the SSM improves on

[Hauler]

positive thing might also be: vanilla style players go to short spawn servers and the "real" PR servers get only dedicated teamplayers

Excatly servers cater to members. Man how hard is that. Please figure it out guys. Tards go to point A, Realism people go to point B. It is that simple no need to bash anyone here if anything were driving people away with this ****.

[AfterDune]

Guys everyone can play the way they want to play. Its that easy. I love ...... time and money. Please do close this.

But what you're saying is like this (perhaps not entirely the same situation, but you get the point);

A group of people invented a new kind of family car. Others start to like the car too and buy and drive it. Everybody happy.

Then, more people start driving the car, but it's not exactly what they want. This "new group" wants the car to be more like a pick-up truck, so they take off the roof, take out some chairs 'n stuff, there, a new pick-up truck. The "new group" is okay with it, 'cause it now is what they want it to be, a pick-up truck.

The "original group" thinks it's a load of ****, 'cause the "new group" is abusing the car: it is in no way intended to be a pick-up truck.

Situation now is, both "groups" have let each other know what they think. It is now up to the devs (the inventors of the car) to change the rules (or not).

[Freshmeat]

What are we actually Arguing about here? time?? if u ask me theres never anuf time

[bosco_]

We are arguing about the respawn times of soldiers, tanks and limited kits (and the number of them).

[=CDU=Junkoe]

I see your analogy afterdune but the way I look at it is a little different. Instead of the car designers which are the makers of BF2 and mod developers.

What we do at =CDU= is more like what a custom car shop would do. Sure there are plenty of people happy with a car the way it comes but then there are those people that bring that car to our shop to get it modified. They bought the car because they like the engine or the way it handles but don't really dig the way it looks stock. So we chop thier roofs and give em spinners whatever and they leave with thier own unique car. Which at it's base is the same car that that majority likes but now our customers are just as happy with it as those who love it stock.

[maxnik]

We are arguing about the respawn times of soldiers, tanks and limited kits (and the number of them).

no, i have to disagree here. It's about allowing communities, who support the mod by hosting servers(with everything that it involves), have settings for the game that their members want and vote on.

[Hauler]

It like the 1950's all over again. Who is going to be Rosa Parks and who will be MLK? Will the Government (Devs) vote for fair treatment or shall we plunge into darkness and resentment time will tell.

[[BFD]Ells]

I've got no problem with clans changing server settings as long it is identified somehow in the server name or loading screen.

We all have a choice here - play on full PR servers or modded servers.

Maybe a post in these forums stating which servers are 'full PR' and which are modded with what has changed.

This will then give players a choice.

I too have limited time to play and get a little tired of waiting to spawn, and if I only have 30 mins to play, will probably load 2142 (for my sins) or PoE.

As much as I love PR, if time is tight, 'full PR' is not my choice, so I would chose a modded server.

If I have time, I will play 'full PR' and still enjoy the gameplay just as much.

What the devs have to discuss between them is what is more important to them - few players on an original game mode concept, or open to the masses.

I like the idea of an official PR 0.6 release and a PR 0.6 'lite' release with a few options disabled for people that love the mod, but may not have a lot of time to play it.

As a mod leader, this is a harsh choice I have had to make with my mod team - do we stick to our original concept and have a few dedicate players, or release 2 versions of the mod to spread the word.

[Doc.Canis]

The long spawn time is part of what makes PR better. The tendency to Rambo-rush is decreased with longer spawn. When you wipe out a squad it takes longer for them to get back into fights.

Short spawn time is lame and leaning towards the arcade gameplay style.