Project Reality Forums

007.SirBond wrote:I'm not watching the entire 20 mins of footage that probably doesn't exist. I have concluded that you are probably bad at aiming and want the game to reduce deviation so it can become much easier for yourself to play.

Is it even possible to be bad at putting a crosshair at the target? PR has no wind and no bulletdrop (Ok, it has, but it's not noticeable at close range firefights). Yes, of course i want the game to reduce deviation, i want to measure it in MOA, not in miles. After all, this is project REALITY, isn't it?

Henrique_Dalben wrote:Is it even possible to be bad at putting a crosshair at the target? PR has no wind and no bulletdrop (Ok, it has, but it's not noticeable at close range firefights). Yes, of course i want the game to reduce deviation, i want to measure it in MOA, not in miles. After all, this is project REALITY, isn't it?

This is the BF2 engine, deviation is the closet we have to implementing any kind of realism for shooting and moving.

Go play Arma if you want something closer to realistic aiming, and even their system isn't 100 percent realistic.

Yesterday I tried to create a thread in a PR:BF2 Suggestions but it wasn't approved for some reason, ok then.
Militia kits need some reworking, kinda pointless to have an AK74 with 45 round mag as a main Officer gun and AKS74U as alternative one?
So here is my list as an example of how to make it better:

militia officer:
main - AK74 with a RPK74 magazine
alt - AK74 with any optics and a standard mag(or G3/FN FAL with optics. Militia is already using an M60 MG so there will be no troubles with ammo unification I guess).
That way there will be a real choice = weapon for long ranges or weapon for cqc.

militia medic:
main - AKS74U
alt - SKS
Just like it was before.

militia marksman:
main - SVD
alt - AK74 with PSO-1(or G3/FN FAL with optics)

While marksman kit is irrelevant, at least I hope that the medic and officer kits are gonna be fixed, if not how I suggested then somehow different.
And few other notes:
Mosin-nagant(without scope) looks kinda strange in the hands of a well-equiped Militia forces. You can still see that gun in a Syria for example, but much more rare than you will see in PR. HAT is not a rare kit at all.
ARF medic kit is also kinda broken, who's gonna take a MAT-49 instead of AK-47?
One of the ARF kits(LAT I think) is getting either AK-47 or AKS-47, what's the point? We can't see the stock anyway, so he should have FN FAL instead or something.
And why militia spotter have an AK74 with a PSO-1 scope? Becouse of that people is taking that kit just for regular combat, not for spotting.

I still think the deployed mode on the Auto Riflemen is too powerful.

Unhealed wrote:Snip...

While I wouldn't call this a suggestion, but more of feedback(so it's in the right place IMO), if the mods don't approve your suggestion then you shouldn't go and post it somewhere else They probably have a good reason not to approve it or just haven't gotten the time yet to deal with it.

MineralWouter wrote:While I wouldn't call this a suggestion, but more of feedback(so it's in the right place IMO), if the mods don't approve your suggestion then you shouldn't go and post it somewhere else They probably have a good reason not to approve it or just haven't gotten the time yet to deal with it.

I have waited 24 hours, and Open Beta is already over, I was worried that this thread might be closed soon.

Henrique_Dalben wrote:I give up. I can't argue with people who think aiming IRL is something as retarded as it is in PR. Go to a range, rent a gun, shoot a couple mags and come back. Then we'll talk.

Souls Of Mischief wrote:Last time I was on a range, I didn't have 50 kg's of gear while having patrolled through rugged terrain for 3 hours in 38C degree heat.


Interesting.

Henrique_Dalben wrote:I also don't remember the last time i patrolled on foot for 3 hours in PR.

Souls Of Mischief wrote:What does PR has to do with what I said?

Oh yeah, nothing.

Henrique_Dalben wrote:Oh, sorry, i though this was the Project Reality forum, in the feedback section. Apparently this is the Off-topic section.

You deviated from the topic harder than my rounds in 0.98.

Suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuure.

Shooting at a range =/= shooting for in a combat environment. Guess what PR weapon handling simulates...

If you had so much problems with deviaton in 0.98, I can only imagine how you felt in 0.8.

Souls Of Mischief wrote:[/B]











Suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuure.

Shooting at a range =/= shooting for in a combat environment. Guess what PR weapon handling simulates...

If you had so much problems with deviaton in 0.98, I can only imagine how you felt in 0.8.

Yes, PR simulates a combat environment. No, combat isn't patrolling on foot for 3 hours all day everyday. You can't even run a mile in PR, there's no way a soldier supposed to be in shape will be unable to aim after a 50m sprint. To put it bluntly, you fight like you train, you train like you fight. If you can't hit jack shit after a sprint, please leave the army, you're endangering those around you.

Henrique_Dalben wrote:Yes, PR simulates a combat environment. No, combat isn't patrolling on foot for 3 hours all day everyday. You can't even run a mile in PR, there's no way a soldier supposed to be in shape will be unable to aim after a 50m sprint. To put it bluntly, you fight like you train, you train like you fight. If you can't hit jack shit after a sprint, please leave the army, you're endangering those around you.

What are your credentials? Where have you been deployed? How many tours did you serve?

Henrique_Dalben, thank you for your feedback. Arguing amongst yourselves won't do much good in terms of swaying the dev team's mind, as a lot of thought and tweaking goes into these decisions already.

Your feelings are noted, and I hope you can enjoy the final decisions made for 1.0

To hit a target you need to have the rifle in pretty accurate direction towards the target. In combat environment you will be carrying equipment and constantly moving. If you honestly think that hopping about from cover to cover, up and down doesn't take a toll you clearly have never done it. Elevated heartbeat alone causes movement in your aim, added to that is irregular breathing and the twitching of muscles caused by adrenaline and tiredness. But even then, missing targets at <200m by meters is pretty ridiculous, however hitting directly central mass can be difficult.

Henrique_Dalben wrote:Yes, PR simulates a combat environment. No, combat isn't patrolling on foot for 3 hours all day everyday. You can't even run a mile in PR, there's no way a soldier supposed to be in shape will be unable to aim after a 50m sprint. To put it bluntly, you fight like you train, you train like you fight. If you can't hit jack shit after a sprint, please leave the army, you're endangering those around you.

Lol you a soldier? If no then please dont say shit like that. Try to stand up with (only) 30 Kilo additonal weight from a lying positon, do a full speed 50m sprint and then shoot. You will most likely still hit spot on with your first shot. Now you do this 10 times in 6 min. You will be exhausted.
We had a fun small parcour when we were training with our new equipment. Was only 200m with 4 sprints, some obstacles and some targets. I was exhausted like hell and hitting the target needed much more concentration (and time). You can NEVER compare shooting range to real firefight.

BTW you cant patrol 3 hours anymore with that much gear in Afghanistan. You would most likely collapse.

But even then, missing targets at <200m by meters is pretty ridiculous, however hitting directly central mass can be difficult.

Its easy to miss even below 100m you just have to press the trigger at the wrong moment or trying to shoot to fast.

"You can NEVER compare shooting range to real firefight."

And you can never compare PR to either.

I'm talking entirely from a gameplay standpoint and not comparison to real life, when I say deviation's a bit too tight. I like being able to hit my targets yes, but sprinting and stance changes (Including from Stand to crouch) should have more/longer effect on aiming. The first round I played on 1.0, as US on Ramiel my squad was getting its arse kicked, they all disconnected a bit later, and I fought my way basically through a cache, right up to the next one killing ARF as I went, it was the absence of ammo that got me in the end - So the current deviation promotes personal skill rather than teamwork, I experienced that first hand. Those with scopes also seem to have a huge advantage now, where in previous versions scopes v ironsights seemed relatively well balanced within limits ofc.

I'm giving my feedback a bit late, but better late than never, eh?

First of all, allow me to give praise! You (PR devs) have done an amazing job with the beta! It was a pleasure to play and the weapons were indeed greatly enhanced!

Now, I don't have anything to complain about yet, only one question;
Where's my DMR? The USMC (according to wikipedia and research) uses 4 different marksman rifles. Why not put two different ones in the kit selection with the current primary / alternative selection?
List: M110, M39, Mk12 and M14DMR - Don't restrict us only to some poor 5.56, give us some 7.62 NATO love.

Metpox wrote:I'm giving my feedback a bit late, but better late than never, eh?

First of all, allow me to give praise! You (PR devs) have done an amazing job with the beta! It was a pleasure to play and the weapons were indeed greatly enhanced!

Now, I don't have anything to complain about yet, only one question;
Where's my DMR? The USMC (according to wikipedia and research) uses 4 different marksman rifles. Why not put two different ones in the kit selection with the current primary / alternative selection?
List: M110, M39, Mk12 and M14DMR - Don't restrict us only to some poor 5.56, give us some 7.62 NATO love.

Suggestions go in the suggestions forum. And they are taken more seriously if they were phrased as suggestions or requests rather than the commands you come across as giving. But equipment suggestions for certain factions are not accepted.

M14 DMR (depicted in ARMA2) has been phased out of service. It, the M110 and M39 are not (and were never) in use by line rifle company/smaller unit designated marksmen. M110 and sometimes M39 EMR are used by Scout-Snipers, and the M39 is used by Marine Corps Security Forces designated marksmen (including FAST Company), Embassy Security Group Detachment designated marksmen and Military Police Special Response Team Marksman/Obervers. M110 will likely replace the M39 in those units, eventually. It has already replaced the Mk-11 (from which it is derived; M110 is used in USSOCOM under the designation Mk-11, Mod 2), which was acquired as another tool in the box for Scout-Snipers for a few years.

carmikaze wrote:Anyone else noticed that even after some settle time, the SVD and SR-25 (EBR too, i guess) are not "zeroed in"? Was really frustrating sometimes when i aimed directly at the head, waited a bit, shot, and the bullet missed the target by a few inches, always to the left.

That happened to me with the Mk.3 sniper rifle as well. At least 8 seconds of settle time (normal .98 settle time for snipers) at a target 50-75m away, shot way left. I wasn't a happy camper

I too find deviation too tight, the patient guys have far less advantage then the run n gun brigade.

TBH I preffered the .981 deviation probably because:

I don't and never have played alot of computer games so my eye mouse co ordination is probably slow.

I play with a horrible +200 ping.

Eddie Baker wrote:Suggestions go in the suggestions forum. And they are taken more seriously if they were phrased as suggestions or requests rather than the commands you come across as giving. But equipment suggestions for certain factions are not accepted.

M14 DMR (depicted in ARMA2) has been phased out of service. It, the M110 and M39 are not (and were never) in use by line rifle company/smaller unit designated marksmen. M110 and sometimes M39 EMR are used by Scout-Snipers, and the M39 is used by Marine Corps Security Forces designated marksmen (including FAST Company), Embassy Security Group Detachment designated marksmen and Military Police Special Response Team Marksman/Obervers. M110 will likely replace the M39 in those units, eventually. It has already replaced the Mk-11 (from which it is derived; M110 is used in USSOCOM under the designation Mk-11, Mod 2), which was acquired as another tool in the box for Scout-Snipers for a few years.

This might be going off-topic, but replies are best given in the threads where they were started. If someone considers this an inappropriate post to the thread, feel free to delete it.

To be truthful, I personally feel quite offended by how your reply started. Now, moving on to my reply...


My apologies, I never meant any disrespect and I certainly had no intention of giving "commands". My post was a question, not a suggestion.

Now, to your post. Due to not having such knowledge, I can return to my first line and say that it was a question. Questions are asked to gain knowledge, which you have provided, thank you.

Perhaps Wikipedia is just wrong, since M39 is quoted "The EMR is primarily used by a designated marksman, to provide precision fire for units that do not rate a Scout Sniper" and as you said "The EMR is also used by Marine Scout Snipers... and by Marine Corps Explosive Ordnance Disposal teams."

Remember, I'm not arguing or suggesting that there should be other weapons, I'm only asking - because when looked from outside, the US military is quite a mess and it's nice to get clear answers to Project Reality related questions.

Metpox wrote:To be truthful, I personally feel quite offended by how your reply started. Now, moving on to my reply...

My apologies, I never meant any disrespect and I certainly had no intention of giving "commands". My post was a question, not a suggestion.

Apology accepted. But, you asked "Where's my DMR?," made a list of them, said "Why not put two different ones in the kit selection with the current primary / alternative selection?" And then said this:

Don't restrict us only to some poor 5.56, give us some 7.62 NATO love.

Sorry, but all of those are what made it a suggestion. And without a "please" or a question mark, that last part looks a lot like a demand. How offensive do you think a DEV who works for free finds that last part of your post? Especially after seeing many more like it from people who lack the social graces that you seem to possess in your reply to me?

There is also a suggestions forum that is moderated; something that, again, people quite often try to avoid by disguising or blatantly posting one in another forum. My statement about equipment suggestions for certain factions not being accepted is also clearly stated in a sticky thread about the rules of that forum.

Metpox wrote:Now, to your post. Due to not having such knowledge, I can return to my first line and say that it was a question. Questions are asked to gain knowledge, which you have provided, thank you.

You're welcome.

Metpox wrote:Perhaps Wikipedia is just wrong, since M39 is quoted "The EMR is primarily used by a designated marksman, to provide precision fire for units that do not rate a Scout Sniper" and as you said "The EMR is also used by Marine Scout Snipers... and by Marine Corps Explosive Ordnance Disposal teams."

No, they are partially correct; their information is just incomplete. Also, senior MP SRT Marksman/Observers can attend the Scout-Sniper Basic Course at any one of its locations, so those units sometimes do rate a Scout-Sniper. But I'm sure it's not easy to get a slot as Scout-Sniper Platoons of infantry battalions (no, you don't need to have gone to the school to get into one), Recon and MARSOC units probably have top priority, especially since the first two have authorized billets for Scout-Snipers (not sure about MARSOC).