Project Reality Forums

The new (or actually old)RP-System is just terrible for teamplay... as already mentioned before it gives everyone the ability to spawn nearly everywhere without much efford. It makes trans squads and fobs simply useless(except for the beginning) and it supports unreal tactics.
My suggestion is to use the rp only for a quick spawn for dead dead sm. It should last for 30 sec, be reloadable at fobs, be unable to get overrunned and gives 2 or 3 squadmates the ability to spawn in and gets destroyed after 3 players have spawned

Na 30 seconds is way to short, respawn time sometimes is longer and than people have to wait another time, and it should be possible to spawn your entire squad in there, otherwise "you you and you spawn, rest wait for 15 minutes on dead dead screen or try to make it alone) It should promote playing with your Squad and not split it up. It only should not be an constant respawn point like vanilla (Its even worse than vanilla, there the squadleader needs to stay alive)

My Opinion:

<Rant removed>

Revert the RP to the 0.98 one.

OR

Put in the ARMA2 Beta Rally Point with limited spawns and dependecy on a fob in the perimeter.

Fixed the post for ya, Birnd. Show some more respect. - Spec

I'm happy to see so many people posting feedback but please try to be constructive.
I understand some people don't like the change but at least you could stay polite.

After playing some more I had a change of heart. The rally point system requires some limitations. Unlimited spawns from closeby for an 8-man squad is a colossal waste of tickets and it lessens the value of a player's life.

Adding a time limit for rallies or making them harder to set up close to enemies would probably make them less over-powering for attacking squads.

Morbo provided some very good points earlier in the thread.

Bluedrake42 wrote: So ultimately there is no strategy anymore, the best tactic is rushing. There is little to no penalty for making a wrong move, in fact is almost better to give away your position, because once the enemy fires on you, you can respawn at a safe secured location where you can return fire on their now exposed position...

AKA Red Orchestra 2.

You're wrong on this one, bru.

Souls Of Mischief wrote:You're wrong on this one, bru.

No, you're wrong on this one, bru. It's not only his opinion that RO2 is a casual(and broken) game.
Send him a PM or something don't discuss it here, okay?

Can we just get a voting pool on this?

I can see why Rally Points are unexpirable. It's to promote more players and give more action, and it also makes the enemy aware of where they are spawning from so it gives off more of a role in finding Rally Points whereas before they expired.

I'm not so sure if I like or dislike the changes. The PR 0.97 made rally's seem so important, but this update makes it so that it doesn't matter if you die, as long as you stay hidden you can spawn over again.

Personally, I am not bothered by it. I like it.

[R-DEV]BloodyDeed wrote:I'm happy to see so many people posting feedback but please try to be constructive.
I understand some people don't like the change but at least you could stay polite.

Please stay civil here guys. Its not feedback anymore, you just argue here all the time, leaving statments without any screenshots or ingame stories to back up your pros and cons.
That is not constructive.

I played 30 min Ramiel up to now as American. We had 1 known to attack and a FOB 400m to the south of the cache. I noticed only a few rallys, all far away of the cache. All rallys closer to the cache got overun shortly after they where placed.
I guess the ARF had some effective rallys up but the problem here wasnt the infinit spawning of the enemy. The squads where simply not working together (many new players, old players want to test new stuff and dont play like they normaly would etc.)
And that was with all peopel spawning on the same fob, or driving with vehicles in the main entrance like you did in 0.98.

If the squads here would have communicate with each other it would have been possible to take out the cache, despite a mass of ARF troops in the area.

A mortar squad to bomb known positions of enemys, Cas doing constant strafing runs while the Inf or humvees move into the city, Inf encircle the cache position and overun all rallys on their way.
Teamwork is the Fix.

Coconut wrote:Action Wing Vs. Tactical Wing

Action Wing changes:

-> 100 Player Servers ( even on 2km maps )
-> New RP System


Tactical Wing changes:

-> None !


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Rally Points:

IMO, as I posted before, there is no reality in Rally Points at all...but I do accept that some people want them and I understand, that it makes sense in some way due to internet connection issues, consistant player flow on puplic servers, etc. I think you should go back to the 0.98 system!!! That would be a compromise for the tactical orientated players in PR because of the 100 Player change!

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Boring as hell:

For me, running around through forests isn't boring at all. The first time I played PR I was amazed by walking around with my squad for about 5-10 min. and not having enemy contact at all. THATs what got me into PR !!!
If running around is boring for some of you guys I don't understand why your are not complaining about the big map sizes and non steady Spawn Points in bases, like in BF2 Vanilla? I really don't get the shout out for more and more action...

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Play ARMA !

And no, I will not play ARMA, because for me, it's too buggy and not so well playable!

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Losing Players

PR is "losing" players because BF2 in general is losing players. The engine and the graphics are getting old compared to new blockbuster games. And for many people graphics are very very important, so they switch. It's normal and was always like that and will be! And I predict that PR will lose even more players in future, due to the fact, that a new console generation is coming and there will be a bigger jump in graphics than in the last couple of years!

Nailed it! Exactly my opinion!

Agreed on every single point! Damn we are like soulmates, we should marry or something.

Regarding Boring as hell:

Thats exactly what I like about PR aswell. The calm before the storm. Either when defending or when moving our for an offensive. The adrenalin keeps rising with every minute that passes without any contacts. Cause you know they will come at some point.

Just like yesterday. I was leading 7 fellow clan mates and a clan APC on Saaremaa and we took our time to engage Radio Relay as russians. We marched from the roundstart, starting in main, seperated in 2 fireteams, in shifted formations, followed by the APC about 200m behind between us. We went all around the south of the island, meanwhile build 2 FOBS and killed an enemy one. While marching we enjoyed the scenery and the silence around us. Only the distant firefights in the north were hearable through the woods, interrupted by several thundering CAS attacks far away. We went all the way south west of Radio Relay while our other squads just did not manage to get the enemy out of there. Constantly spawning and rushing in there but not being able to secure it. We seperated the fireteams north and south of the south western mainstreet going to Radio Relay. The fireteams themselves spread out in a big line creating a line of 4 men on each side of the road in the forest and the APC inbetween them on the road. When we moved out, Fireteam 2 was on the southern side of the road and stopped south of Radio Relay, engaging and distracting it with heavy MG fire and small arms. We kept going until we reached the western part of the objective and just before we moved out of the woods to cross the road and rush the objective from behind, our CAS did an awesome timed massive attack inside the Relay giving us the perfect advantage for assault. While F2 kept covering us from south, F1 and the APC rushed the objective, cleared and secured it.

We had zero casualties, managed to take over the objective what our team was desperately trying for about 30 minutes since roundstart and fought back several counter attacks including multiple enemy CAS attacks without any losses until half of the server CTDed.

We did not use the RP once and managed to overrun the enemy just by taking us some time and using tactics and very cautious movements.

The enemy and our team did not..why? because those RPs encourage not to do that but instead play BF3 style. We were only successful to withstand the counter attacks because it was probably only one squad doing that, most of the enemy team kept spawning on their RPs somewhere further east on the other objective. With 2 or 3 enemy RPs in the back we would have never held that against the brainless hords of US soldiers rushing towards us.

tl;dr

I think the rally point in 1.0 is worse than in the previous version. Now that the maximum player number got increased and fobs are harder to take down i dont see why rally points got changed to how they work now.

Indeed, with FOBs harder to take down and increased player count this terrible rally point system is justified even less.

What I'm noticing happening (and what was very predictable to be honest) is squads just spamming themselves at objectives/enemy positions over and over, coming back in 30 seconds with the advantage of already knowing where the enemy is from previous 'lives' and managing to win without any proper tactical thought or skill.

Just revert the rallies back to 0.98, maybe increase the duration from 60 to 120 seconds and that's it.

I really dislike the new rally points, it results in constant swarming by enemies, a long duration I think would be fine, but permanent is way too much.

ShaddyDaShadow wrote:I really dislike the new rally points, it results in constant swarming by enemies, a long duration I think would be fine, but permanent is way too much.

Swarming doesnt always help.


made the pic 5 min before I left. We where defending this cache for 30 mins without getting a single US close to it. RPs got rarely used and I was testing IEDs, so couldnt made any.
As you see there isnt a single RP on ARF side, still we where holding out really good.
If someone had RPs then it was the US but obviously the RPs didnt really helped them.

Also They cant swarm you permanent if you destroy their RPs. You need just a few guys doing a envelopment maneuver on the assumed RP Position and your save.

By the way what you describe is what we have with 0.98.
Team A has a Fob 200m east of the flag and Team B has a fob 200m west of the flag.
They will constantly swarm to the flag, until one Fob gets overrun.

for every example you give of players not effectively abusing the new system, Ill give you 10 where they do

Bluedrake42 wrote:for every example you give of players not effectively abusing the new system, Ill give you 10 where they do

MADsqirrel wrote:As you see there isnt a single RP on ARF side, still we where holding out really good.

Especially when giving an example of an irregular faction that
a) Has two fixed spawns in the city
b) Doesn't need supplies in order to build a forward outpost and
c) can spawn on the cache anyway ....

MADsqirrel wrote:Swarming doesnt always help.


made the pic 5 min before I left. We where defending this cache for 30 mins without getting a single US close to it. RPs got rarely used and I was testing IEDs, so couldnt made any.
As you see there isnt a single RP on ARF side, still we where holding out really good.
If someone had RPs then it was the US but obviously the RPs didnt really helped them.

Also They cant swarm you permanent if you destroy their RPs. You need just a few guys doing a envelopment maneuver on the assumed RP Position and your save.

By the way what you describe is what we have with 0.98.
Team A has a Fob 200m east of the flag and Team B has a fob 200m west of the flag.
They will constantly swarm to the flag, until one Fob gets overrun.

First of all that was on Ramiel where ARF have spawn points all over the city with the mosques and main, which are already a problem, especially in AAS which makes it pretty much impossible for US to win, All games of Ramiel AAS I have played ARF has won with over 500 tickets left.

Also another problem of the Rally points are that they get replenished in like just a minute, which is a huge problem. Obviously rally points arent that much of a problem on a small map like Ramiel especially if played inside the city, since ARF patrols and spawn all around the city and removes them, but on a 4km map where the radius is now 100 M they can still be used so easy and good if placed right, where as if an enemy would manage to get close and destroy it you can just immediately put another one down as long as you have your 2 squad members by you, it makes FOB's less important and since they made FOB's harder to overrun and destroy that doesn't really make much sense.

I also really dislike the minimum amount of people near an enemy fob to deactivate respawning, too many times have I seen now countless of enemy respawning in front of me, even tho my squad is not at all far away, but I happened to encounter the FOB first and alone, so I had to kill like 10 guys over and over respawning constantly.

Coconut wrote:1. I totally agree with Spooks' argumentation!!!

2. I'm asking myself, why are Rally Points in the gameplay of PR at all? This question occured to me first yesterday, as I was pretty frustrated of thinking, that somewhere "there" in the woods is a RP that can't be even seen, because it is so small and randomly placed.
Wouldn't it make things much easier and realistic, if they were not in it? Nobody had to think about some new (some strange) rules, etc....

For me, the "slowness" (compared to other FPS) of PR makes it so interesting! For a fact, I didn't really liked FPS before I found PR!!! It doesn't help the gameplay if there is a massacre like in BF3/COD! For people who want more and more action, maybe this game isn't the right adress...


FOBS in contrast to Rally Points:

In my opinion, FOBS can be seen as "realistic". It's like a mini base. You have to bring things for a construction (crates), then place it in a good spot and then squad-/teammates have to dig it. And after this teamplay event your team has the benefit of spawning there.
In contrast to that, a RP just needs to be placed by a single click and it's done. I don't know how realistic in any way this is?! 8 new Players can spawn repeatedly. Multiplicated of course by other mini FOBS of other squads...

Another Point is, that I liked the fact of going hunting for an enemy FOB and that it was not impossible to spot it because of its size. In contrast again, finding and overrunning a RP is just a Jeopardy...!
Also I found it always weird that SL's could check, if they had enemys around, by trying to place a RP...!


So please DEVS, kill that feature totally, or at least, reset it on the point of 0.98. Otherwise it will kill the gameplay, that so many of us love on PR.



Thanks for all the hard work you put in 1.0

I like the action. But I agree with this guy. I think either not having the rally points to make it more realistic would be fun or either support the extra action provided.

I enjoy both ways. But in between you have an unrealistic spawn system that decreases realism and doesn't add much to action.

Bluedrake42 wrote:for every example you give of players not effectively abusing the new system, Ill give you 10 where they do

Then please do.

Especially when giving an example of an irregular faction that
a) Has two fixed spawns in the city
b) Doesn't need supplies in order to build a forward outpost and
c) can spawn on the cache anyway ....

a) true but not important in this situation (more effective to spawn on the cache)
b)was also this way in 0.98
c) see b)

really theres no difference to 0.98 here, except that we have 100 players know. Nothing to do with RPs.