Required Spotter kit to request sniper kit

[obpmgmua]

I no longer see snipers as a problem. I do appreciate the intel that snipers gather and the HVTs that they kill ingame. My biggest problem is when someone joins a squad, gets sniper kit and leaves or sticks around and lonewolfs ignoring the sqauds welfare for their own sake.


I want to reaffirm a point I made earlier.

Sniper Kit should be for Squad Leaders only. If a squad's purpose is to Snipe than that squad's leader must set the precedent by being a Sniper SL. Here's how I see it being done;

1. Sniper Kit is now Sniper Officer. The only difference being that Sniper Officer has a Sniper Rifle instead of an Assault Rifle and Regular Smoke grenades instead of frag grenades. Yes Sniper Officer should retain the ability to request FOBs and such if needed. Sniper Officer is unspawnable and only obtainable by request.

2. Spotter kit can only be requested by a player who's SL is Sniper Officer.

3. To alleviate some Issues with lack of Binocs for regular kits. Give the Marksman back his Binoculars.

[obpmgmua]

I disagree. Transport squads greatest assets are pocket breacher, pocket LAT and pocket Combat engy.

Breacher for Caches, Fobs, and other enemy assets
LAT for helping take down other APCs
Engy for field repairs and blowing enemy FOBs/Setting up traps.

[MuffinMunchies]

I no longer see snipers as a problem. I do appreciate the intel that snipers gather and the HVTs that they kill ingame. My biggest problem is when someone joins a squad, gets sniper kit and leaves or sticks around and lonewolfs ignoring the sqauds welfare for their own sake.

I thought of a possible solution for this that doesn't require having to mess with the kits themselves. It's waiting for a forum mod to approve the thread to become visible. In essence, we already require people to be in a squad to request a limited kit, I went one further and suggested we also give people a "you cannot use this weapon" followed by the black-screen death if they leave a squad and don't either drop the kit or join another squad in time. This prevents kit stealing as well as those stupid "free kit" squads that never help the team (and are often against server rules for that reason).

*This would apply to number-limited kits such as the HAT kits, Grenadiers (8 total IIRC), Marksmans, etc. AFAIK, Breachers and a few other limited kits aren't number-limited across the team, and shouldn't be included if possible.

Making it an automated "punishing" process as opposed to requiring server admins to deal with it is always a good thing, and it also gets rid of something that really isn't intended to be part of a game whose biggest feature is teamwork play, as evidenced by the fact that you cannot get the kit without being in a squad in the first place.

Instituting this would eliminate a large portion of the "lone-wolfing" problem without having to nerf or alter the sniper kit to make it less useful for its real roles.

[obpmgmua]

What if you get kicked from a squad?
What if there's max squads/locked squads?

I was rolling as Pocket Breacher on Basrah for an APC squad, they kicked me to make room for their clan mate. I couldn't join a squad in time and got kicked after 60 seconds.

And the whole black screen of death/you can't use this weapons is already frustrating enough. Sometimes I can't request to drop my kit fast enough before being punished. Other times I really want to use an enemy weapon because either I'm out of ammo or it's just better overall.

In Insurgency pre .9 as blufor I loved stealing enemy AK kits and blending in, and Vice Versa as opfor I loved getting the scoped weaponry and other heavier weapons. Taking and using an enemy's kit against them is the ultimate reward for you and humiliation for them.

[MuffinMunchies]

What if you get kicked from a squad?
What if there's max squads/locked squads?

That's not a game problem, but a server problem, the admins should step in if the squad slots are full and all locked. I have seen this pretty well enforced. Not to mention is highly unlikely to be in a round where ALL the squad spots are used up and every squad is full. But again; Server problem, not game problem.

As for getting kicked, that's a situation in which a person should be required to get rid of their limited kit. Why? Because as long as they have it, the squad from which they were kicked from can't get it. So if someone joins a squad for marksman kit and either leaves or gets kicked, the people in that squad cannot get another marksman kit for as long as that person is alive + the kit respawn after he dies. Since some people like to lone-wolf camp on maps after kit stealing, that could leave your squad missing a vital kit for the entire round. I have run into this problem repeatedly personally.

I was rolling as Pocket Breacher on Basrah for an APC squad, they kicked me to make room for their clan mate. I couldn't join a squad in time and got kicked after 60 seconds.

The kick after 60 seconds is a server thing, it's not mod-side. As for the breacher kit being required to drop, yeah. Go get a riflemen kit.

In Insurgency pre .9 as blufor I loved stealing enemy AK kits and blending in, and Vice Versa as opfor I loved getting the scoped weaponry and other heavier weapons. Taking and using an enemy's kit against them is the ultimate reward for you and humiliation for them.

It was highly unbalanced, there is a reason it was removed. Picture the Taliban in Fallujah able to pick up all the US scoped M4s lying around. It'd be like having two conventional forces, but the Insurgents have a hidden cache and can make FOBs anyway, the US can't.

Khamisiyah Ins is having to be rebalanced for this specific reason, conventional forces on even footing is unbalanced if one is insurgent and the other isn't.

@Death; I imagine it probably is possible, but also an unnecessary addition to the work involved. It's easier to just require people to drop their kit and exchange for a non-limited kit, which is easy to do if near a FOB or in main.

[MuffinMunchies]

Your suggestion can't work.

The possibility of all squads being locked off and unable to join a squad is real

If by real, you mean something I haven't seen happen once beyond the first 2 minutes of a round, since I began playing PR, then okay. Real.

- squad leader leaves

Protip; The squad doesn't disband when the squad leader leaves. People aren't just suddenly ejected. Maybe don't leave the SL-less squad for a new one until you know there is a new one to join? Especially since someone in squad is likely to stand up to replace the old SL.

- leave and rejoin squad to rotate the squad leader

It's got a timer bud, it's not immediate death. You'd have 1-2 minutes, so this is not a concern at all.

- lame squad

What does this have to do with it?

- no mic

This is a squad problem, not a game or server problem. Find a better squad or make your own. This has nothing to do with kits, as this is something you'd have to deal with whether you've got a HAT or a rifleman kit.

- different language

Again, read above, this is completely irrelevant to the current situation.

- squad break down

Still irrelevant...

- form Sniper squad

Okay?

- join another squad that needs you

And the problem here is..?

- click on the wrong tab

Well there are only two tabs. Squad joining/leaving, and team tab. If you left on accident, rejoin. If you joined the wrong one, leave and join the right one. If you joined the wrong teamm, you're SOL anyway, so what do any of these have to do with my suggestion?

- blah blah blah blah blah blah blah....

Thank you for summarizing your post so I don't have to.

[Spectrium]

It's worse having snipers in "infantry" squads than having snipers in other squads. Because snipers slow and patient nature does not fit for fast and maneuverable infantry squads. Also there can be one more fire support in squads than useless snipers. Note: If you need long range shooter in your squad. It must be marksman not sniper.

On the other hand having limited squads (9) is the problem on 100p servers. I prefer to open "recon" squad but i know it will be problem for someone who decides to create a teamwork inf squad. If i join to another squad like "cas" my spotter will have lack of scouting abilities like identify the target (friend or foe) without marking, range estimating, lazer marking etc.

So here is my solution:


-Normally only squad leaders had ability to use radio for markings because before 1.0 there was only squad leader kit for this job and it was not limited by numbers. So if you just give same powers to spotters as they were squad leaders. The problem about lazer estimating and markings will gone. Also because of it's limit. There will be no mess and no need much squads for spottings.

-Second solve is for identify the targets faction or keypad sector. We recon squads use the squad leader position for using marks as identificator for faction and position of targets. If you give red markings only for spotters so they can identify the targets from far away without need to be squad leader. Also we can give accurate intel coordinates.

-Third problem is only important at some maps with huge view distance: Range estimation. I don't have any idea about it but only i can hope you fix lazer rangefinders. They are not working accurate.

-fourth thing is communication about intel. Spotter in another squad tells squad leader and squad leader give intel on squad to squad mumble.


These are fast ideas and there can be errors, mistakes on them. My wish is making spotters useful without being squad leaders. So we can stay in cas, mortar and maaaaaybe infantry squads. Also we can stay in trans, armor, apc squads that if we need to join somewhere and if there is useful squad slot for us.

Edit: This is just making spotters useful. If you want to stop lonewolfing the snipers. Just add more bullet drop and you gonna see the n00bz crying.

Thanks for reading. Sorry for bad grammar.

[camo]

Snipers in infantry squads can be very useful, just yesterday I was leading a squad on Lashkar and a pkm was about 250 metres away on top of a hill, with our standard optics we could not hit him without getting lucky so a sniper with us would have been perfect for the occasion.

[HAAN4]

I no longer see snipers as a problem. I do appreciate the intel that snipers gather and the HVTs that they kill ingame. My biggest problem is when someone joins a squad, gets sniper kit and leaves or sticks around and lonewolfs ignoring the sqauds welfare for their own sake.


I want to reaffirm a point I made earlier.

Sniper Kit should be for Squad Leaders only. If a squad's purpose is to Snipe than that squad's leader must set the precedent by being a Sniper SL. Here's how I see it being done;

1. Sniper Kit is now Sniper Officer. The only difference being that Sniper Officer has a Sniper Rifle instead of an Assault Rifle and Regular Smoke grenades instead of frag grenades. Yes Sniper Officer should retain the ability to request FOBs and such if needed. Sniper Officer is unspawnable and only obtainable by request.

2. Spotter kit can only be requested by a player who's SL is Sniper Officer.

3. To alleviate some Issues with lack of Binocs for regular kits. Give the Marksman back his Binoculars.

good point, and maybe a good sugestion,

[Heavy Death]

Snipers in infantry squads can be very useful, just yesterday I was leading a squad on Lashkar and a pkm was about 250 metres away on top of a hill, with our standard optics we could not hit him without getting lucky so a sniper with us would have been perfect for the occasion.

Your signature picture is tha answer to your problems. At the end of the day, an APC would be even deadlier than a sniper so yeah...

[Fir3w411]

Snipers in infantry squads can be very useful, just yesterday I was leading a squad on Lashkar and a pkm was about 250 metres away on top of a hill, with our standard optics we could not hit him without getting lucky so a sniper with us would have been perfect for the occasion.

It's true but SL's don't always agree with sniper kits...

[Not_able_to_kill]

Haha, oh god.

If any of these suggestions make it in-game, I am so going to stop playing.

Die if not in squad? Remove snipers? Remove fun?

Fuck that mate

[Brooklyn-Tech]

the spotter is a very useful kit in non-sniper squad situations. if you force the sniper kids to have the spotter kits as well, you prevent non-sniper squads from accessing the kit.

at the end of the day, snipers gonna snipe and teamworkers gonna teamwork....

[commander_sinbad]

last time i saw a spotter and sniper together i ran up to them and stabbed them to death, it might work