Alternative Insurgency

[badmojo420]

So I had another idea of how we could combine the AAS and INS game modes.

Basically you're playing AAS at the start of the match. 5(or more) Flags are placed all over the map, with random placement, so no two matches would be the same route. All the flags start off in the hands of the insurgents. When Blufor cap a flag, it can never be re-capped by the INS. And once blufor caps a flag, it spawns one or two caches in the area. And then the normal INS intel gathering and cache marker system happens. Blufor looks for caches, insurgents scramble to stop them or get as many kills as they can. And then the blufor proceed to the next flag to enable the next couple caches to spawn.

Some things that a system like this would allow, is insurgent emplacements and pre-placed hideouts could be around each flag they own. And the emplacements could replace themselves(after a duration) if blufor destroys one, for example a hideout beside a flag that isn't in play yet, would rebuild itself 5 minutes after blufor destroys it.

Also this would give the insurgents more of a chance to "dig in and hold an area" rather than sitting directly on top of a cache. They would still have to defend the cache when the area becomes overrun and the flag turns(and caches spawn), but there would be less chances of a couple blufor making a suicidal dash for the cache with C4 while the whole INS team is still in the area. It would force the blufor to actually clear the area before conducting their cache clearance mission.

The mapper placed items would be a nice addition. Think, stock piles of ammo, PKMs in windows, hideouts, sandbag barriers, etc. They would be everywhere at the start of the round and as the blufor make progress, there would be less and less. With random flag orders, the mapper could setup enough variation so that people don't always know where they would be.

If people on both sides simply ignored the caches and attacked & defended the flags, once all the flags are blufor, they would still need to go back and clear the caches, except now the insurgents would have 10 caches to rearm and spawn on. And on the flip side, the blufor would be more likely to stumble upon an undefended cache.

There are a lot of other things to consider, like rewarding blufor with tickets for capturing flags, the dreaded "too many networkable objects", should cache spawning be disabled, what happens if insurgents hold up in an amazing position and can't be cleared, etc. But, I think a system like this could really improve the insurgency gameplay. It would give the OP what he wants (alternate objectives) while keeping the spirit of the game mode alive and kicking. And I'm 90% sure that everything in this idea would work with just minor map tweaking.

Thoughts?

[Cassius]

I dont think thats necessarry. To win as insurgency the insurgent team needs to be decently organised. The lack of flags is to show that there is indeed an assymetrical warfare going on and the unlimited tickets reflects that the insurgents are not under the same pressure as ISAF as far as casulity count goes and have far more manpower.

Basically its an attempt at changing players. There are plenty of tools avaiable for well coordinated teamplay. I have seen insurgent teams do it. If players cant be assed they cant be assed.

[Bob of Mage]

If you want to add more to Insurgency you have to think of what the real life BLUFORs are trying to do besides kill people. In real life they are trying to do things like build schools , dams, or sewer systems. Things like these can be added to PR with a little work.

A way I see it working is to use a mix of the CSB and FOB systems. A new kind of truck, much like the supply trucks we have now, would have to be moved to a certain perset point. At that point the truck would lay a foundation for what is to be built. As an example I'll use a school which would be one of the larger options (each build site is only for one type of building just like each CSB point). Once the school's foundation is layed BLUFOR has to build it up like a FOB, but unlike a FOB there is no need for such a fast building deacy (if the INS are lazy and only kill the builders BLUFOR can still finsh the school). Also something as large as a smal school is far more work than a foxhole so it would a target while being built (and require many "targets" with their backs turned digging). When the school is finshed the BLUFOR gets it's a shift in it's ticket bleed to show that locals and people back home are more happy with the job they are doing. If the BLUFOR has nothing built they would have a much heavier ticket bleed, but if they some how manage to build everthing they can they might get a inflow of tickets (this would only be a small flow but it would mean that the INS team has little to no chance of winning as long as all the BLUFOR works stand). When the school is built the BLUFOR could get some tickets and lose some if it gets razed.

These idea could fit into Insurgency as it stands, be a new gamemode or both. The thing is it would bring more to the table than just killing the "bad guys".

[CommunistComma]

Well I'm going to throw my 2 cents in, not because I think anybody will care, but because I've got time to kill.
My vision of a rethought Iraqi insurgency would take the focus off the caches, placing it instead on these capture zones. The caches, with maybe 3-4 spawned on map at a particular time, would serve not as objectives but as, just that, caches. They would be sources for insurgent heavy weaponry and spawn points, perhaps with a small ticket loss for the insurgents.
Capture areas under the new AAS protocols would be the objective. The foreign invaders would come in from whatever out of city location they're attacking from (hopefully eventually there'll be another carrier based map insurgency) and the insurgents would rush to defend the points, which would be relatively easily capable for the blufor. The insurgents would spawn on the caches & grab their 40 year old RPGs and rush off to attack. If the cache happens to be close to the contested area, the blufor could trace it back to it's location via the never ending stream of angry arabs and destroy it, denying a spawn point. If the insurgents lack a spawn anywhere near the area of operation, it would promote teamwork due to the need for transportation.

The capture points could originally belong to the insurgents, and the blufor slowly and inevitably takes the field while the insurgents do all possible to bleed them for tickets.

The cache system is undeniably flawed and often quite unentertaining for the insurgents. Or rage inducing when CAS runs destroy 6 caches. Or C4ing thru walls. Or ghosting. This suggested system would localize combat, increase the amount of pew pew, speed up gameplay and all that great stuff. A better description is AAS with an insurgent twist instead of vice versa.

Badmojo may have suggested something similar, but I don't fully follow his train of thought, as you, the reader, won't follow mine.

[badmojo420]

Badmojo may have suggested something similar, but I don't fully follow his train of thought, as you, the reader, won't follow mine.

Your idea is different than mine. My idea still retains the caches as the ultimate objectives. The flags in my idea serve as another form of intelligence denial. If the insurgents can stop them from taking the flags, the caches won't spawn.

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I wanted to illustrate my idea for better understanding because I'm sure Communist isn't the only one confused by my rambling.



In that picture the red circled areas would be flags, they all start out in the hands of the insurgents. And cannot be recaptured after the blufor take them.

The green dots represent mapper placed hideouts. When a flag is capped by blufor, the hideouts get removed, and caches spawn(blue dots). They should not be in the same location of the hideouts, for obvious reasons.

Flags would be captured like in AAS, with a specific route having to be followed. The arrow indicates the next flag in play. So the blufor would have to decide if they want to maintain there presence in their captured flag, or if it's safe, they could proceed to the next flag, leaving only a few guys behind to dispose of the newly spawned caches.

Also, the insurgents would have to decide if they should stay on the defend flag, or ambush the blufor as they hunt for caches at their captured flag.

Hopefully this is a bit clearer.

[tommytgun]

Wasn't something like this in versions of pr waaay back? (i forget what version) i remember on Korengal, before the US main was moved, the Outpost (current US main) was a cap-able flag. and on Al Basrah the VCP was a flag too

[killonsight95]

yeah they were capable.... but they only gave the US an extra couple of assets