The I lead I gun syndrom

[Brainlaag]

A big advantage of being a SL driver is the driver assist points stacking up. On a good round the driver might have up to 4000 points!

YES POINTS ARE THE MOST IMPORTANT FACTOR HERE.....really?

Anyway I also think the 3rd position should get optics and actually work as commander role. Sometimes the driver has to focus on other more important stuff (like checking the rear and the surroundings while the gunner is engaging) to ensure his survivability.

I mean as its now, the 3rd position in a MBT is virtually useless (exposed, targets usually too far away to effectively engage) unless you are playing Insurgency.

[Cassius]

Yeah thats an awfull mentality. I prefer to drive the combat vehicles. Lets face it, the Gunner is just the monkey on the trigger and a script would most likely do a better job.

Because that's how MBTs work. Commander commands the vehicle, not the driver. It would add realism and I'd like to think it'd be more fun.

And if you don't want it, you could always skip the third seat and have the driver be SL.

You know that 360 camera the driver gets when he cycles view? Yeah thats the tank commander seat.

[Asystole]

YES POINTS ARE THE MOST IMPORTANT FACTOR HERE.....really?

Please quote me a sentence where he said something like that. He just stated a mere fact.

[Brainlaag]

Please quote me a sentence where he said something like that. He just stated a mere fact.

You surely don' have the right mentality by using sentences like "You can get up to 4000 points or "I actually have noticed that sometimes the driver of the tank gets more points at the end of the round than the gunner." or do you? Just to man a vehicle in the intent to get points is plain stupid and wont lead to the success of your team.

[Nehil]

Yeah thats an awfull mentality. I prefer to drive the combat vehicles. Lets face it, the Gunner is just the monkey on the trigger and a script would most likely do a better job.



You know that 360 camera the driver gets when he cycles view? Yeah thats the tank commander seat.

Yeah I know.

All I wanted was a useful third seat on tanks

As it is now the third seat is only useful in very few instances (practically) and that guy can do much more as infantery.

[Asystole]

You surely don' have the right mentality by using sentences like "You can get up to 4000 points or "I actually have noticed that sometimes the driver of the tank gets more points at the end of the round than the gunner." or do you? Just to man a vehicle in the intent to get points is plain stupid and wont lead to the success of your team.

There's nothing wrong with my mentality. When I said "I actually have noticed that sometimes the driver of the tank gets more points at the end of the round than the gunner", it was just an objective view to the subject.

Just to man a vehicle in the intent to get points is plain stupid and wont lead to the success of your team

Then why would anyone man armor in the first place if you're not after points(kills)? Points are a side effect of your actions and reflect your total performance.Your success is your entire teams success and vice versa.Right?

[TheComedian]

Please don't flame each other and cool off. I will confess that having top score is a great feeling for me. If you have a top score in a vehicle, it means that you contributed with a lot of kills, flag caps and intelligence points.

[Triggerfinger]

It's all about wasting ten minutes to build a FOB, instantly die while running in the middle of the street with your retarted squad-mates, to spawn again and do the same thing over and over again like lemmings.

Like somebody already mentioned; it's obviously common sense and logical.
Of course you have to find a decent shooter, but that's a real problem as not many people really volunteer to take a seat in a valuable armoured vehicle and to take a big responsibility, but of course there are idiots.

If it wouldn't be about points, then there would be no point system, the only difference with PR and other shooters is; PR is not always about points, though the restribution is really strange sometimes.

[Asystole]

Please don't flame each other and cool off.

I don't think anyone flamed each other, it's just a debate.

If it wouldn't be about points, then there would be no point system, the only difference with PR and other shooters is; PR is not always about points, though the restribution is really strange sometimes.

Agreed.

[BlazeDBe3]

No offense, but most stupid idea ever..

You get more new people finding PR and don't know what they are 100% doing. Plus, I dont give a **** who drives or guns. SL is just a SL issuing orders. Plus if your in a tank battle, not like hes gonna lead much.. You two will be talking to each other finding targets.

Sorry, sounds dumb and not needed. Plus if I see PR put this in as SL can only drive, ill uninstall. This mod is already far from realistic on many things due to its A GAME. So your idea is already out the window.

A gunner will be scanning for targets and calling them out. I much rather be a SL and gun and be able to put a marker right where i see a guy with my turret, mark it and fire.

[Web_cole]

Speaking for those of us who are vehicularly inept, I think you're all failing to take into account situations where the SL is a terrible driver

Also there ain't nothin' wrong with point whorin'. How else am I supposed to know that I iz King of the Teamworkz!?

[Rudd]

No offense, but most stupid idea ever..

Please sir, don't take hyperbole and make it a useless writing tool; please use hyperbole in a responsible manner, or the tool will lose its potency

Please think of the hyperbole...

Anyway, a driver with a superior viewpoint to the gunner that is capable of placing markers for a maximum of 3 gunners (64 player server ofc) is superior to a gunner with a more limited viewpoint, placing markers for a max of 2 other gunners. Drivers don't have a huge amount going for them funtimewise, but no1 can deny that they are in the superior position (ingame at least, due to teh driver/commander combo camera) to have situational awareness; and therefore in a superior position to be squad leader in a vehicluar squad.

Such a position would be considered logical Jim.

[Brainlaag]

No offense, but most stupid idea ever..

You get more new people finding PR and don't know what they are 100% doing. Plus, I dont give a **** who drives or guns. SL is just a SL issuing orders. Plus if your in a tank battle, not like hes gonna lead much.. You two will be talking to each other finding targets.

Sorry, sounds dumb and not needed. Plus if I see PR put this in as SL can only drive, ill uninstall. This mod is already far from realistic on many things due to its A GAME. So your idea is already out the window.

A gunner will be scanning for targets and calling them out. I much rather be a SL and gun and be able to put a marker right where i see a guy with my turret, mark it and fire.

Are we playing the same game?

[Zoddom]

the issue I find is with asset squad rules, the person making the squad for the asset is sometimes doing it to get the chance to gun a vehicle

ths is the problem. i often thought about how much better this would be if there were premade squads. as in BFBC2.
2 inf squads 2 armour squads 2 air squads 2 sniper etc squads and one whatever squad.

but i think this isnt possible with the engine :I

[Hotrod525]

Because that's how MBTs work. Commander commands the vehicle, not the driver. It would add realism and I'd like to think it'd be more fun.

And if you don't want it, you could always skip the third seat and have the driver be SL.

Dont start me on that, please. For gameplay concern, R-Dev already states that they can't afford Driver+Gunner+Loader+C.C. crews. So a squad can represent a tank troop of 3 MBTs/AFV. So it save precious Squad slot Just imagine the CC is giving order to hes driver like IRL without all the actual bla bla He just have to get a grip on he's gunner then.

Depends on the map and the crew, really. If you need to be moving around a lot then the SL should be gunning so that the driver can watch the road ahead and take the time to stop the engine and look around periodically, whilst the gunner watches around the high-risk corners and otherwise can watch the map to get some better situational awareness & automatically know what to shoot at if something pops up on thermals. Only during prolonged stationary gunning does it make sense for the SL to be driving.

Both parts have their 'critical' and their 'rest' periods, the SL should be in the position with a lot more of the 'rest' periods.

Also, if the SL is **** at driving then they should avoid it if at all possible. A gunner who misses the infantry target isn't as bad as the driver who takes the vehicle into a trap.

All the task you describe invole SLding'... Gunner should focus on gunning, and squad leader should put he's pants on and crewcommand the vehicle and the reste of the vehicles. So he can focus on map while the gunner keep on scanning for hostile.

[Murphy]

A gunner will be scanning for targets and calling them out. I much rather be a SL and gun and be able to put a marker right where i see a guy with my turret, mark it and fire.

Why do you need to mark it if you're already engaging the target?

A lot of times I will fix my gun on a specific baring marked by the driver (normally from an engines off listen), and I really don't want to be watching my *** when that enemy armour rolls over the hill where the mark is. If I'm fixed on my hill anticipating the enemy my driver will be the one scanning 360 to ensure there is no one sneaking up on our flanks, and if there is spinning around to a mark is a hell of a lot simpler then having him verbally direct me. Sure that would make things realistic but your opponents most likely won't be doing the same.

SL gunner only make sense if there are multiple crews in the squad, in this case he may be the most experienced leader in the group so he will have the easiest time co-ordinating.

[Hotrod525]

Why do you need to mark it if you're already engaging the target?

A lot of times I will fix my gun on a specific baring marked by the driver (normally from an engines off listen), and I really don't want to be watching my *** when that enemy armour rolls over the hill where the mark is. If I'm fixed on my hill anticipating the enemy my driver will be the one scanning 360 to ensure there is no one sneaking up on our flanks, and if there is spinning around to a mark is a hell of a lot simpler then having him verbally direct me. Sure that would make things realistic but your opponents most likely won't be doing the same.

SL gunner only make sense if there are multiple crews in the squad, in this case he may be the most experienced leader in the group so he will have the easiest time co-ordinating.

Well, if you have to lead the squad and and everything, then you should even more be in the TC seat...

[Brainlaag]

Dont start me on that, please. For gameplay concern, R-Dev already states that they can't afford Driver+Gunner+Loader+C.C. crews. So a squad can represent a tank troop of 3 MBTs/AFV. So it save precious Squad slot Just imagine the CC is giving order to hes driver like IRL without all the actual bla bla He just have to get a grip on he's gunner then.

Thats why we have...128 HERP DERP

[TheComedian]

Thats why we have...128 HERP DERP

T-90 *cough* autoloader *cough*.