Fools Road

[Kain888]

MORE FEEDBACK MORE THREADS GOGOGOGO!

This is like the only good map feedback thread in ages, need MOAR!

Yeah good feedback threads are good, but I think nothing is that good as valid, solid data used in statistical inference. ^^

[Rudd]

yeah, and as AF said - we are working on something behind the scenes....

so unless you want to run around personally trying to find out which side won every single game, I would appreciate it if you would back up you critic post with some actual feedback in a different appropriately named thread so this one doesnt get anymore derailed

[Predator.v2]

In my opinion with the last nerfs on spandrel brdms and the brdm sliding issues (even with exited driver) and the new thermal view on GB assets (making it easy to spot an hidding, sliding, not rdy to fire brdm in the woods) and the fact that GB got 1 skimi, 2 tanks and like 3 apcs (?) against 1 spandrel and 1 spg techi (oho!) and the nerfed rpg (militia hat), you should consider giving the militias 2 spandrels again.
After all they got nerfed hard and whenever i play this map, the militias are getting asset rolled.

Ah i just remembered. I have also tried to make any use of the new "camping" spandrel, but with the addition of "setup" time, you have to plan your ambushes very well and have to stay quite long at one place. This however makes you vulnerable to counterattacks by brits infantry. Several times we got spotted by enemy inf and either took a lat or hat hit.

[Nixy23]

and the nerfed rpg (militia hat),

The PG-7 Tandem Warheads (HATs) did not get nerfed. Only the regular PG-7 LAT rounds did. And as Militia you're better off taking the RPG-26 as LAT. At least I think it is the 26?

Also,

MORE FEEDBACK MORE THREADS GOGOGOGO!

This is like the only good map feedback thread in ages, need MOAR!

Don't tempt me, good Sir.

In all honesty though, providing accurate feedback regarding map balance is really hard (without the use of some super tracking tool). The 'human' factor is too big when it comes to that. In my experience I can perceive the GB team to always win on a certain map, while in effect it's closer to 50/50. It depends on the server, the timezone and the players..

As for Fools Road, from my perspective anyway: The GB team wins most rounds when I play the map. The main reason for that is the GB armour superiority and the BRDM-Spandrel not being able to effectively take out the Challenger-2s. This due to aforementioned sliding issues, which I posted a thread about as well in the vehicle feedback forum.

Another issue, which is due to the 'human' factor again, is that the Spandrel is seen by many people as a mobile head-on weapon platform. They rush the roads, run into a tank or APC, get blown to bits and then moan they couldn't fire at all and that the vehicle is clearly bugged.

The balance of SPG-9 technical vs Warriors/Scimitar is quite alright on that map. The technical has great maneuverability and is able to stage hit-and-run attacks, as I've done plenty of times.

The addition of the UAV (although back and white) to the Militia team is brilliant as well on that map, although often underused due to limited effectiveness in the woods.

I guess one of the main issues with any of the 'road lanes' in the AASv4 mode is that the British armour pieces have too much leeway in terms of movement. If the GB team is organized properly, they will send a Challenger-2 and one Warrior with an infantry unit in its belly to the third flag on that lane. They will be able to hold that flag (leaving one flag + militia fortress for the Militia team) until the rest of the team cap the other two flags without any resistance. The presence of the Challenger-2 usually prevents the Militia from pressing on themselves.

If the Spandrel has to come from the Militia main (which it does at the start of the round), it does not have a chance to set up properly to engage the enemy armour. Once all the flags are captured, and the Militia is pushed back to the Fortress, all the GB team has to do is set up mortars and shell it into oblivion, with our without added artillery after 45 minutes. The battle is lost, right that instant.

[Rudd]

In all honesty though, providing accurate feedback regarding map balance is really hard (without the use of some super tracking tool). The 'human' factor is too big when it comes to that. In my experience I can perceive the GB team to always win on a certain map, while in effect it's closer to 50/50. It depends on the server, the timezone and the players..

we know this, but if 300 people gave feedback on a map, then at least we'd have a representative sample

no feedback at all means we mappers are walking into a GPO with a blindfold on.

[Bufl4x]

Removing the ammo technicals was a mistake in my opinion. A mobile ambush team is the best way for the militia to counter all the british armor.
Sure, the spandy and spg techie is still there, but the first is basically a tow you can move every now and then, and the second is not enough.

Brits have too much armor anyway, i think the militia needs more counter for that. As much as i love the big toys, i'd suggest more light AT vehicles insead of a BMP for them. Just get rid of the spandrel and replace it with an spg and ammo techie, and maybe additional fieldguns.
I would also love to see a panther instead of a warrior/scimi, it's a great recon vehicle but sadly very rare.

Firepower for the british, high mobility for the militia.


And a Hind of course

[Nixy23]

Removing the ammo technicals was a mistake in my opinion. A mobile ambush team is the best way for the militia to counter all the british armor.
Sure, the spandy and spg techie is still there, but the first is basically a tow you can move every now and then, and the second is not enough.

Brits have too much armor anyway, i think the militia needs more counter for that. As much as i love the big toys, i'd suggest more light AT vehicles insead of a BMP for them. Just get rid of the spandrel and replace it with an spg and ammo techie, and maybe additional fieldguns.
I would also love to see a panther instead of a warrior/scimi, it's a great recon vehicle but sadly very rare.

Firepower for the british, high mobility for the militia.


And a Hind of course

What you're suggesting is leaving the Militia almost completely unable to destroy the British tanks. Two HAT kits (and a shot from a field gun, if the Militia is very lucky) will not be enough. Also, a Hind? I don't think it's the right map for any sort of air vehicles..

[Bufl4x]

I'd take 2 ammo techies and 2 rpg techies over a spandrel any day. Also don't forget the combat engineers with an arty IED.

[PLODDITHANLEY]

IMHO:

For Militia to have a chance of victory they need a very good team as the outcome depends on the skills of 6/7 players with AT equipment at any one time.

If these guys are in the wrong places, lack patience and/or experience and miss their opportunity to reduce the quantity of Brit armour then it's lost.


As with many maps on a teamwork mumble using server at peak times its fun, mid afternoon with no teamwork it's not.

I support an 'easier' militia layer, I also support two spandrels again - many times they're hardly used anyway because of the skills and patience needed to get results.

[Murphy]

This map has the best name, as Militia can easily deny/ambush any GB forces that are foolish enough to take a main artery. The armor has little to no choice on the matter, sure the warriors can get up the hills but once in the forest it's quite easy to stumble into enemy AT fire with all the dead ground on the map. I believe the strategies employed by the Militia team ultimately wins/loses the battle, GB side has fewer options leaving them somewhat predictable.

If the Militia team handles it as a standard AAS Mec vs Blufor affair they will most likely suffer a lot of casualties and fail to gain any ground, making it an unorthodox map and disagreeable to some players tastes.

It's one of my preferred maps to play as infantry, and I am kind of apprehensive towards adding more assets. Sure it's a bit of a pain hiking over the hills and through the woods, but the firefights are always quite impressive in the forest.

I would like to point out the fact that many players misuse many assets on many different maps and that is poor grounds for a rebalance. I have found much success with the spandy on this map and it would be a shame to deprive Militia of this bad boy.

[Zrix]

This map has the best name, as Militia can easily deny/ambush any GB forces that are foolish enough to take a main artery.

IIRC, back in the day when the loading screens had map descriptions, it said that it got the name because of just that.

[Stealthgato]

I'm hoping for one BMP at the very least.

Or remove everything and put in a fleet of Hinds. Yes, more Hinds.

[tankninja1]

Actually i think this map is quite fair, a good Milita team can kill Brit armor like crazy you just have to be hiding in the right place with the right equipment and ammo, scopes dont serve as much of an importance becuase visual range in normaly around 100m. Although some heavier Militia armor would be awsome.

[PFunk]

If they screw up Fool's Road with too many assets I'll be sad. This map is the height of infantry excitement after they took out OGT. Dense forest battles and just enough assets to make it interesting without sapping the main population of infantry.

It is fine how it is. When will you people give up on trying to ruin good maps!

[40mmrain]

ive never won as miltia on fools road, and regularly do a lot of damage with the challengers as british.

Even when I build SPGs, have AT in my squad, among other countermeasures, my team is always overpowered by armour and superior small arms (the skorpion that the HAT receives leaves him next to worthless in a fire fight).

BMPs, t-55s, another spandrel, or something to favour the militia is warranted IMO

[Headless86]

West Ridge Flag on Fools Road should may be taken out of the pool imo. Theres only 2 ways to get on flagrange, both ways can easily be camped by inf squads (Northern way can also be watched from south of militia main base). Also you can place around 3 fobs in the area to make sure Brits cant take out all of them. This Plateau kind of area is just too big, deadzones wont allow you to come from somewhere else or do something unexpected. Its just a pain to fight at this flag. Would be nice if we could share some other oppinnions.

Edit: Dont know, may be some people like the fact that its impossibe to be taken. But i personally dont like this sitting on one spot for 2 hours kind of gameplay. Smartest thing to do with this layout as brits is sitting on defense flag for several hours and wait for militia to come. Everything else is just ticketwaste. I do like flags like the tunnels on Kozelsk though. Its very difficult to cap but possible imo.
Anyway, what do other people think?



Edit: Thanks for repositioning my post.

[Kerryburgerking]

Why do Militia get a desert camoflagued BMP-2 on Lrg instead of a green one?

[Rudd]

ah...that looks like a bug. The MEC BMP is being used accidentally

[Daxt2]

Fools Road is a great map, it's a shame it's underplayed by a lot of servers. I remember I had some very good times on it

[Death!]

The Fortress area still with bad FPS.