Project Reality Forums

Ahahah... no, I'd recommend it; it was a great day. Shimmied up a flagpole with my mate at the beach. Just wish I hadn't started hitting on that old lady with the tiny dog. Truth is, last time I replied I was just awake, and right now I'm half dead from a impromptu training session, so plz bear with meh~ .~If you've got a cheaper model of the vid card, that's doubly good, because the one I tracked down was cheap because it was XFX. Think everything's a step up from that, isn't it? I didn't mistake the currency though; the initial estimate came at 990$, not euro or GBP, and this one's 1180$ in spite of the fact that you changed, so far as I can tell, just a 150$ graphics card for a 250$ one. So 90$ was lost somewhere. I just looked up a little about SSDs though, and since the idea is to make frequently accessed data more readily available, doesn't that mean I'll need to specificaly designate frequently accessed data to it, by partitioning my disk or something? Because I can't remember how to do that. _.

Missing $90 is probably from power supply I forgot to add at first place.

To make it fit you can then forget on SSD, and you can look for cheaper HDD or Power Supply.

Hard Disk - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6822136513 = $120

And you just saved $30 and your PC costs now $990 without SSD drive, monitor, burners etc...

Now go shopping.

Alright, I threw in ALL the parts and it came to just above 920euros. Seemed like a good deal, since a fair bit of it is reduced, and what with the rebates and all. There was just one problem; the 6950 card that you linked me wasn't available, and it said it might not be restocked, so I found a different one.

Newegg.com - XFX Double D HD-695X-CDFC Radeon HD 6950 2GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.1 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card with Eyefinity

As you can see, it's a 2gig card, but costs 40$ more. Is the extra gig worth 40$?

Oh, quick edit: what about the operating system?

If you can find 1gb ( the old 6950 ) which can be unlocked to 6970 it would be great. But I guess its very hard to find those now. -
WRONG INFO DISREGARD.

If not go with that one. Additional 1gb of VRAM will help you run your games at very high resolutions.

Is this Psykogundmans brother?

Th3Exiled wrote:Actually, it's the 2GiB models that were originally released and can be unlocked to a 6970.

Oh yeah, youre right I dont know how that one slipped trough.

I wouldn't use the Caviar green as a primary hard drive. If he isn't going for a SSD then he should try to find a fast hard drive.

This would probably be better
Newegg.com - Seagate Barracuda ST500DM002 500GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive




Yes, the size of the cache is only 16MiB compared to the 64MiB on the above listed one, however, according to some reviews I read previously there is a negligible difference currently above 16MiB of cache. Capacity is down to 500GB, though that should be more than enough for most people, you'll have to decide if that is the case for you. It also makes it a bit cheaper. Rotational speed is up to 7200RPM (from 5400) which should improve read speed. Platter density is the same on both drives as the samsung features a single 500GB platter while the western digital has three, this means that latency should be similar. Since the samsung has less platters, acoustics, heat and power draw may in fact be lower, despite running at the higher spindle speed.

So youre telling him to spend $85 on 500GB HDD versus $120 1500GB?

I always used WD Green drives and comparing those two is bollox. Performance impact is neglectable, although I might agree he might not be needing that much space, but that's what I thought when I was buying mine 500Gb drive, and now I'm bitching how I'm low on space.

And youre wrong. Size of cache does matters on large hard drives ( 500GB+ ). Sata 3 also bollox. Its just marketing nothing more and maybe future friendly, but thats why hes got mainboard that has sata 3 ports. Thing is that neither of HDD's on the market will sustain that speed, not even close. So sata 2 or 3 it really doesn't matter, only size and price. Higher performance HDD's cost a lot more and currently SSD is better solution if you want more speed. If you want storage then HDD. If you want both, you're either crazy or enthusiast, cause you're gonna be needing 10k SAS drives in raid with dedicated raid controllers, which will cost you almost as this complete build if not more.

[R-CON]Wicca wrote:Is this Psykogundmans brother?

If you go page or two back it will refresh your RAM. Psyko

I dont have an article about that, despite the fact there are numerous to find on the net. Some say its not that important some say it is. It all depends how and for what are you using your HDD. Id say for gaming and multitasking it does matter.

What I have prepared for you is a small test with three different drives.


1) ExcelStor Technology J8160S, SATA-II, 152627 MB, buffer/cache 7376 KB (Dual Ported, Read Ahead)

Crystal Disk Mark test 3 passes, all tests





2) Hitachi HDS721050CLA362, SATA-II, 476940 MB, buffer/cache 14111 KB (Dual Ported, Read Ahead)


Crystal Disk Mark test 3 passes, all tests




3) WDC WD800JD-00LSA5, SATA-II, 76319 MB, buffer/cache 8 MB


Crystal Disk Mark test 3 passes, all tests





Compare that and see what it tells you.

Thing is that I dont need to read articles on the net to get the knowledge. No offense I got long mileage with this. Modern drives with large capacity must have larger cache sizes or they will bottleneck and R/W operations will suffer. With memory chips becoming cheap most of manufacturers are adding more cache size so they can improve drives performance.

When I was buying this Hitachi I tested I went to buy WD Black 640GB model which had 64Mb of cache. I was late 10 minutes. And I was pissed, very much cause that series was the best and still is. Since I really needed a new drive I had to go with this one. It not bad, but WD is much more faster than this one.

This can turn to neverending debate, so I suggest we stop here. You can read a lot of articles and lots of forum post about this, and you will see different opinions everywhere.

What is important for OP here is whether he needs a lot of HDD space or not. So either he will pay $120 for 1,5TB drive or he will get 500GB HDD for $85. If he wants to solve dilemma for us he can buy both drives and test them

Just to point out.. Cache size won't affect the speed of read/writes for random tests... This is because the cache only serves as a quick storage system.

Think of the way a HDD writes and reads as:

(IF Cache has data)
Processor request -> Cache -> Data back to Processor

IF Cache does not have requested Data
Processor request -> Cache -> HDD -> Cache -> Processor

(Technically there are many more steps in this, including the processors own cache, and main memory etc.., but this is bypassing those to make a simpler model )

So as you can see the cache will only store data after its been retrieved once, which is why it can help in most real life applications, so a larger cache can store more data and therefore increasing the probability of data being in the cache than on the HDD. However this is all probability based, as the HDD never really knows what to put in the cache. So it is all dependant on what you are doing, and mostly its only programs that iterate the same values in a loop that will benefit.

I know off topic from original, just thought I'd try and explain cache and why it doesn't matter really

Thats why I said this can go to neverending discussion. Its so much complicated and has a lot of scenarios.

Anyways after doing a bit of researching I find this drive to be the best among 500GB line.

Newegg.com - Samsung by Seagate Spinpoint F3 HD502HJ/ST500DM005 500GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive - $85

Yes, I'm Psyko's brother. I'm also finding all this confusing as all hell-read everything since my last comment just now-but the debate's been edifying so far. If you still believe there's merit to the smaller drives apart from the price, Exiled, please go on. How much data can a SSD hold anyway? I mean, would that add to the 500gb to make up a respectable sum, or would it be like, 500gb 65megs?> _< I'm thinking of getting an SSD in a few weeks and going without it in the interim, since this thing's going way over budget so far, but justly. By the way, what's all this about unlocking a 6950 to make it a 6970? And btw, I think you made the partitioning sound more complicated than I did> .<

Aaaaaand they don't ship to Ireland on newegg- .-

You know Akai, I did mention that to Psyko at least twice in the last month.

People use newegg.com on this forum because it is the most extensive online retailer of PC parts in the English speaking world. Good point of reference for everyone.

I've been busy, how about a recap on what you decided to buy on newegg before you realised newegg wouldnt sell you anything.

Newegg.com - Computer Parts, PC Components, Laptop Computers, LED LCD TV, Digital Cameras and more!

Does Newegg.com ship internationally?
Newegg.com does not currently ship internationally; we only deliver to locations within the United States and to Puerto Rico.

Yeah might be wish breaker. But if you have anyone in US you can trust, go ahead and let him receive the parts, and send it to you in Ireland. But I dont know how Customs would be happy with all these in one package, and how much shipping plus tax will cost you.

Comes down to getting to local Ireland store with a printed list in your pocket and making a purchase. Or if you have any similar sites in Ireland or UK that can help.

@LITOralis:

Ok here you go

Processor - Newegg.com - Intel Core i5-2500K Sandy Bridge 3.3GHz (3.7GHz Turbo Boost) LGA 1155 95W Quad-Core Desktop Processor Intel HD Graphics 3000 BX80623I52500K = $220

Mainboard - Newegg.com - GIGABYTE GA-Z68XP-UD4 LGA 1155 Intel Z68 HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard = $210

Graphic card - Newegg.com - GIGABYTE GV-R695OC-1GD Radeon HD 6950 1GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.1 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card = $250

Memory - Newegg.com - CORSAIR Vengeance 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model CMZ8GX3M2A1600C9B = $50

Hard disk - Newegg.com - Western Digital AV-GP WD20EURS 2TB 64MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive = $150

SSD - Newegg.com - Crucial M4 CT128M4SSD2CCA 2.5" 128GB SATA III MLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD) with Transfer Kit = $160 optional

Case - Newegg.com - COOLER MASTER Elite 430 RC-430-KWN1 Black Steel / Plastic Computer Case = $50


Power Supply - Newegg.com - CORSAIR Enthusiast Series TX650 V2 650W ATX12V v2.31/ EPS12V v2.92 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Active PFC High Performance Power Supply = $90

This is the last setup posted to me in a list. The SSD and HD have been the subject of debate, but my chief problem right now is finding a good supplier. I've been fishing around online and I got talking to a salesman in town the other day... almost talked me into getting a video card I didn't want, the slippery *******. Essentially, unless I get a damn good supplier in my reigon this thing's going to be way out of my price range. And the specs posted to me so far were out of my originally posted price range to begin with. I'm dead set on getting the 6950GTX after reading up a bit of online material on it; and I can wait to get the SSD, so all I have to do is make sure the system will be able to integrate an SSD optimally when I can afford to pick one up. Right now, I need information on a reliable, cheap supplier. (Fyi, ordering through friends in America sounds dicey, since FEDEX charges heavily for even a small registered package.

CPU - Newegg.com - Intel Core i5-2500K Sandy Bridge 3.3GHz (3.7GHz Turbo Boost) LGA 1155 95W Quad-Core Desktop Processor Intel HD Graphics 3000 BX80623I52500K - $220

Mainboard - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813138344 - $110
< cheaper you save $90

Memory - Newegg.com - CORSAIR Vengeance 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model CMZ8GX3M2A1600C9B - $55 < price went up $5

HDD - Newegg.com - Samsung by Seagate Spinpoint F3 HD502HJ/ST500DM005 500GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive - $80 < 500GB excellent drive, all you need and got cheaper for $5

GPU - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6814102987 - $230 < 6950

CASE - Newegg.com - COOLER MASTER Elite 430 RC-430-KWN1 Black Steel / Plastic Computer Case - $50

PSU - Newegg.com - CORSAIR Enthusiast Series TX650 V2 650W ATX12V v2.31/ EPS12V v2.92 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Active PFC High Performance Power Supply - $90

_________________________________________________________

Total = $835 might get cheaper after rebates

As for supplier Im sorry but you cant solve everything from your cozy chair by asking around on forums and hoping people will solve everything for you. How are we supposed to know of a good supplier in Ireland? Thats your part of this job I'm afraid, or anyone else from Ireland that might know. Ask your brother where he bought it?