Project Reality Forums

K_Rivers wrote:I was referring to just the directional waypoint markers to be in the 3D environment, plus, you could make them visible at say
200m range perhaps

Yeah but imagine the SL using the markers to mark enemy position around an appartment block for exemple, you would see in 3D all the enemies' locations ??:

I like the idea. It's like a tool to quickly tell everyone where to go. Say you set up an assault, you put markers down the path you want to assault, where you want your support team to cover from, and if it goes wrong, where you want to fall back to..

Then when assaulting it's easy to order people to move to say point A. And the plan is out there on the map for the squad to look at if they forget.. Such a system could go beyond just Alphabetical waypoints, you could add a small list of icons to point out different things to your squad, much like the commander currently can for the whole team.

As for making them visible in 3d, I think that isn't going to add anything. You should think of it more as a planning tool, you can then use the current 3d squad marker to help you guide down the path you set out and to point at enemy positions ect.

I think it would help squad leaders, getting everyone on the same page and setting up plans like that with a sense of realism. I understand that not everyone plays or will play like that, but providing the tools, if not too hard to implement into the mod, it think it makes the job of the squad leader easier, which is never a bad thing, especially with the bigger player numbers on maps and in squads in the future.

DenvH wrote:I like the idea. It's like a tool to quickly tell everyone where to go. Say you set up an assault, you put markers down the path you want to assault, where you want your support team to cover from, and if it goes wrong, where you want to fall back to..

Then when assaulting it's easy to order people to move to say point A. And the plan is out there on the map for the squad to look at if they forget.. Such a system could go beyond just Alphabetical waypoints, you could add a small list of icons to point out different things to your squad, much like the commander currently can for the whole team.

As for making them visible in 3d, I think that isn't going to add anything. You should think of it more as a planning tool, you can then use the current 3d squad marker to help you guide down the path you set out and to point at enemy positions ect.

I think it would help squad leaders, getting everyone on the same page and setting up plans like that with a sense of realism. I understand that not everyone plays or will play like that, but providing the tools, if not too hard to implement into the mod, it think it makes the job of the squad leader easier, which is never a bad thing, especially with the bigger player numbers on maps and in squads in the future.

I agree with mostly everything that youve said apart from the 3D markers not bringing anything to the table.
They would bring plenty to the table considering the resolution and detail in the mini map is shocking. If you were trying to move a branch of your squad remotely to an area that had to be quite specific, it wouldn't work, the map is too general. It all depends on your squad leading style to a degree aswell. But if you wanted the LMG on the ridge of a hill in a really specific place due to fire and covert reasons, you would have the ability to indicate that with ease using 3d markers.
I like the idea of having icon specific symbols for different role aspects of the squad, but at the same time it would make it more simple if the SL could say... 'jimmy set the LMG up on waypoint E' for instance. Saying that it what may work instead of the alphabet would be primary colours perhaps, for example a red circle above the arrow or a blue circle, so on. But this would limit the amount of waypoint you could essentially use

K_Rivers wrote:I agree with mostly everything that youve said apart from the 3D markers not bringing anything to the table.
They would bring plenty to the table considering the resolution and detail in the mini map is shocking. If you were trying to move a branch of your squad remotely to an area that had to be quite specific, it wouldn't work, the map is too general. It all depends on your squad leading style to a degree aswell. But if you wanted the LMG on the ridge of a hill in a really specific place due to fire and covert reasons, you would have the ability to indicate that with ease using 3d markers.
I like the idea of having icon specific symbols for different role aspects of the squad, but at the same time it would make it more simple if the SL could say... 'jimmy set the LMG up on waypoint E' for instance. Saying that it what may work instead of the alphabet would be primary colours perhaps, for example a red circle above the arrow or a blue circle, so on. But this would limit the amount of waypoint you could essentially use

I understand the problem with the map resolution and why a 3d marker could help in that situation. But like said above, there is a possibility to exploit that.

You could see the 2d marker more as a rough indication of where to go. And then you either let the soldiers decide what's the best spot, or you tell them the exact location as you're planning it.

I like to give my soldiers a bit of freedom when it comes to that, I don't like to go in and micro manage it to such a level. Lets say I expect them to find cover near the marker rather then being precisely on it.

And about your last point; I would stick to the alphabet, or digits, as colours are not the same to everyone and can therefore be confusing.. You can even combine the shapes and digits and set out multiple routes, but that all gets a bit to complicated.. Having the role specific icons is an extra as you said; you can be just as clear with the alphabetic markers. I just thought it might be easier to understand when you have specific images showing what should happen, like an LZ image, one to rally up, ect. Kind of like the markers you have in Arma2.

great idea will diversify the tactical capability of squads.

i really like this idea as a tool for planning, for example setting up an ambush or frontal assault, you can mark flanks and rally points, exfil points.. could be extremely useful. i dislike the idea of the 3d markers because as said before it would make it cluttered and way too 'tacticool' looking HUD-wise in my opinion. although i could live with it if the render distance for it is <50m, and where would you put it comma-rose wise?

paul161616 wrote:i really like this idea as a tool for planning, for example setting up an ambush or frontal assault, you can mark flanks and rally points, exfil points.. could be extremely useful. i dislike the idea of the 3d markers because as said before it would make it cluttered and way too 'tacticool' looking HUD-wise in my opinion. although i could live with it if the render distance for it is <50m, and where would you put it comma-rose wise?

Maybe using 3d markers might be a another step towards the unrealistic, but limiting the viewable distance of the markers to a short range I agree is a better idea, then you would have to navigate using the compass as normal, but it would let you know your in the right place when your in the close vicinity of your destination.

I know in FH2 instead of using 3D markers they actually use 3D objects, such as a smoke grenades that mark the area where move orders have been made, and these are only viewable to you're team.
With this idea in mind we could implement a vertically small low profile flag, containing the letter of the waypoint that is stuck in the ground, so it's not too visually intrusive, but still informative.

I don't think we're talking 3d markers here, but the 2d ones on the map.

paul161616 wrote:...and where would you put it comma-rose wise?

Most likely, it should go under the right mouse click for the squad leader when he's viewing his map pressing Caps Lock.. (I guess it's called the squad screen) You right click, pick the icon you want and it should appear where you clicked..

I don't know how much of that could work code wise, I do not have that knowledge but it seems to be the most logical place for it to implement.

doop-de-doo wrote:I don't think we're talking 3d markers here, but the 2d ones on the map.

Yes, I think they understand that. But I could see why some may prefer both a 2d and a 3d marker as the 2d marker alone may not be precise enough for some. In my eyes that extra precision with the 3d marker isn't necessary though, I can imagine it being more work as well, if it's possible in the first place..

If 3D markers be, they should only appear at like 10 - 15 meters.

3D markers break my immersion

People have to always look at the map anyway, so they might as well be only in the map. Like, SL: "Now open your map, gents. Here's what we're gonna do..." *marks things*

DenvH wrote:Most likely, it should go under the right mouse click for the squad leader when he's viewing his map pressing Caps Lock.. (I guess it's called the squad screen) You right click, pick the icon you want and it should appear where you clicked..

yea i meant for marking from first person if there would be 3d markers, kinda defeats the point of accuracy if you can only mark from map anyways. i would prefer for the markers to stick to the map, as in real life you would mark important points on an actual map rather than run out to the point and stick a flag in the ground, run back and say "okay theres the enemy position" also it would probably be somewhat inaccurate anyways, intel in real life is certainly not always spot on

I think people should be given the option. And I guess that's why you have the ability to turn the 3D markers on and off in the current system

If that's the case then doesn't the current 3D markers destroy the immersion?


Cheers Rivers

i agree that the example given above is exactly how NOT to do it. but as others have described above, the waypoint markers would only be visible within a 20-50m radius, and if used to plot directional walking waypoints then you would only see one at a time in close proximity, obviously notifying you that you have reach the waypoint/objective without taking your eye of the game by looking at a map.
if anything, realism would dictate that the only people with maps in a real life situation would be that of an officer, not the grunts.
this idea all depends on how it would be implemented to whether or not it was visually intrusive and would distract from the game plays realistic and immersive elements, hence why i suggested not using floating waypoint marker similar to the move/observe hud currently implemented, but to use less distracting
small flags that blend with the terrain but are still visible, example an actual 3d object.

ill stated that im not for or against these markers, but i do recognise it as a benefit to the gameplay in my opinion and im simply trying to be objective without ruling out a possible decent new aspect to the game.

Sounds like a ok idea could be helpful, if only that squad could see them just have to change the colour i recommand green same as the squad colour leaving the cammanders waypoints yellow. Just to add something else to this discussion i want to add being a cammander on INS waypoints are used for intel, When the enemy cross it the cammander recieves a warning saying enemy are in that area i was thinking would the SL on INS possese such capabilties as to also recieve intel from the waypoints the SL puts down ?

I love this Idea. As Arnoldio said, the waypoint paths could certainly be useful for assaults, but I think the original post was simply suggesting independent markers on the map, exactly like commander waypoints. These would be invaluable for setting quick, easily communicable reference points when defending or attacking a location, or simply remembering where a vehicle is parked.

Also, this might introduce too much map screen clutter, but would it be possible to have the grid of the markers printed next to them on the map, just in shorthand (H12-5 for example)? Just to make communicating with other SLs about activity on your squad's markers a little more fluid.