Project Reality Forums

How about the DEV's could un-FUBAR the Iraqy Insurgent faction?

Mike, you are correct, there is at present a lack of decent communication and teamwork for the insurgents, but that same problem exists for blufor; they are simply able to win crushing victories without it, due to an extreme advantage in firepower. Yes, such a disparity is realistic, but no, it does not contribute to enjoyable gameplay. You say that the way to sidestep this firepower is to 'avoid straight roads'? Very few streets in Fallujah are not straight and wide. Yes, more revives and grappling hooks can help, but when there are enough blufor laser-rifles to keep eyes down every long, unbending road in Fallujah, even cautious back-field movements are disrupted. Ultimately, it is the huge increase in manpower in such a limited area that causes these problems, I think. Insurgents simply do not have the resources to hold out a conventional defense, so they should be able to rely on ambushes outside the cache area. As it is now, Insurgents are unable to even move into positions for this. They must wait in or very near the cache building, and wait to die.

Again, with so many blufor teeming on the map, they overrun most hideouts without any notion of their presence, regardless of how cleverly they are hidden, or how far-flung they are built.

Perhaps hideouts should have a much smaller overrun radius, and at the current range, some sort of map indicator would warn of nearby enemies. Would there not be combatants in such hideouts, and informants or lookouts covering them? Having a chance to defend the spawn points, especially in the absence of rallies, would certainly help.

Played US last night on FW and we were steam rolling insurgents they had no hope at one point the US had 110 kills to 28. We destroyed all cahces in about 50 minutes with around 180 tickets to spare, we had a good couple of inf squads and I do think the insurgents had a decent team too but we just had more firepower available.

Would be interesting to see insurgents to get back their mortars on this map! I think this might help balance a few things out too.

I still see the main problem in the weaponry the insurgents get, the lack of bigger weapons (PKM, RPK, RPG) and the lack of artillery IEDs are in my opinion one of the biggest factors why the BLUFOR has easy rounds on maps like Fallujah, Basrah, Karbala.

I often lead squads on insurgency and I will lead them like an average BLUFOR squad, however me and my squad always suffers from a lack of proper equipment. Getting a PKM is almost impossible, getting more than 1 RPG is also impossible. Getting an SVD is also almost impossible, same thing with the engineer kits. This means that even though we communicate properly, and use tactics that are adapted to our weaponry. Still we get pushed back. The only thing holding the infantry up are the IEDs. There is no proper anti-vehicle IED, but the victim operated IED is pretty useful. But that's not enough.

I think some more PKMs, RPKs, scoped weapons (Like a scoped G3) and a better anti-vehicle IED could really balance things out. Maybe the insurgents aren't meant to win, but at least give them a proper chance to put up a defense and give them a chance to do something.

Bring back the super powerful arti ied, the mine ied doesn't have a big enough splash damage while the current arti ied is useless against armour.

Just create a squad a round start and build max hideouts, this helps make rounds so much closer. If your not doing this and 90% of you aren't, you have no business talking about balance because your not even using what you already have.

Bad placed hideouts ar another problem. Many people build hideouts directly on the cache instead some hideouts around it, but thats another story.

Sure the chances with more hideouts are better, but its not all about the hideouts.

Vicious302 wrote:Just create a squad a round start and build max hideouts, this helps make rounds so much closer. If your not doing this and 90% of you aren't, you have no business talking about balance because your not even using what you already have.

I do this.. so now please shut up and leave. Everyone thinks that everyone is retarded, well it's not the case.

Riflewizard wrote: sure the bolt actions are a good weapon, but they are not nearly as utilitarian and are nearly useless in CQB.

First time I played 1.0 was on barash I took a enfield, biked to VCP and killed a squad in close quarters by myself. I thought the gun was a 1 shot kill thing which balanced out the fact that it was a bolt action. Turns out later I was wrong which really sucks.

Then again they were a pretty dopey squad only 1 of them shot at me and he went prone before he started shooting :L

it left me abit concerned about it's deviation though when I started shooting at people 50m away...

4 APCs is way too many. They're always a pain in the *** and almost impossible to kill with the no100msight RPG 7

A couple things to make Insurgents more powerful IMO
A) Give the RPG kit more than one rocket (maybe 2 or 3)?

B) Give all of the "Insurgent" kits ammo bags/frags.

C) Idk if it's possible, but maybe a few randomly spawned kits hidden in bushes/buildings/on rooftops. AFAIK insurgents like to hide things around

Rolling_Ruedo wrote:A couple things to make Insurgents more powerful IMO
A) Give the RPG kit more than one rocket (maybe 2 or 3)?

The RPG already have 3 rockets

I agree though that the standard layout of Fallujah is extremely unbalanced to a point where the US just need minimal teamwork to win the game.

To start with they get a Bradley and an Amtrack and later on they get another Amtrack and an LAV. That's potentially 4 vehicles with thermals and armor, not to mention the Up-armored Humvee that can take the same amount of hits as an APC.

This "imbalanced" game mode is not as fun as it used to be since you really do feel like a BOT only spawned to satisfy the Bluefor's killing addiction. When I have been playing as bluefor I feel like I'm stealing kid's candy.

I think The ARF and Militia is a good example of what insurgents should be like. They seem to have more firepower and Ramiel is a very good map to hide in.

If PR had been Battlefield 5 then Bluefor would have extreme firepower and armor and the insurgents would have agility and stealth to counter it. Unfortunately stealth (camouflage) doesn't work at all in BF2. Especially not when there is so many vehicles with thermals.

Yes, absolutely. The blufor heavy assets are completely overpowered now, imo.

But it isn't just that I feel. The RPG feels a lot less useful then before: it feels powerless like you can't really even take out LAVs anymore, which you could before with some certainty. Ramiel has the same problem: I've seen a blufor stryker gunner rack up 120+ kills (!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) on a single round, losing only single vehicle in the process. They do this because they have nothing to fear anymore, not even rpgs really. The insurgent small arms have been really nerfed too I think. Yeah I understand some of the changes, like dividing up firepower between assault rifle kits and giving nades and ammo to less well equipped insurgents. But really, why do sappers have to carry pistols? Give them their sks back or something.

Also, now that insurgents have less caches, the cache locations need to be revamped on many maps. Still we have to defend caches in the middle of open fields: or in a shack in the middle of an open desert .... which you can't reinforce without getting mowed down by fifty cals and you can't really even build hideouts to support them---- I mean really? What's the fun in that?

Since 1.0 I have only seen the insurgents win on Korengal. Our cave cache was literally imposable to get at, they would have to rope up into it, before they could even get a rope up we rained grenades down the hole.

Well anyway, insurgents do not value their lives. They need more equipment to take advantage of this. More bomb cars, maybe even a suicide vest! You hold down a button and let go of it to explode, or get killed to explode!

Definitely bring back arty IED, I miss it so much.

Remove the ability to arrest via shotgun, it makes arresting too easy and breaches just run around with their shotgun having no fear of ROE penalties. (I know I do!) It creates more problems then it solves!
"B-BUT MUH CIVIES HIDING ON LADDERS!" Deal with it, I have never encountered a situation where I could not arrest a civilian with the restrainers, and if I did then I guess that's tough shit.
At the least create a special shotgun ammo type that arrests but does 0 damage. Hell, use slugs for this purpose nobody's gonna run around with slugs.
Harsher penalties for shooting civilians, vehicle crews just shoot them down all day long because they have to wait for their vehicle to respawn anyway so a longer spawn time is a non-issue to them.

Insurgents should respawn faster.

Improve cache placement, the #1 problem(with insurgency mode in general, not just Fallujah) is caches placed in terrible spots. What insurgent would put his cache right out in the open? There should ALWAYS be 3 walls and a roof around a cache.

Allow insurgents to build .50 and other things nests near caches. You say you could use them to block doorways but I want to see someone actually do that, I spent 20 minutes trying to build a foxhole in a small alleyway the other day and never managed to get it placed in a way that would block anything.

PS: How come the binoculars only have 1 working lens so its like your looking through a scope? Whats up with that?

Epicelite, I agree about the cache locations (and Artillery IED) at least. Fallujah isn't really a good example of this, but Al Basrah certainly is. The structure of the map makes having a majority of tenable caches hard to achieve. Beyond this, in 1.0, a cache was added in the far North-West area of the map, just south of the British main. The Brits very frequently build a FOB right on top of it, and every APC/Tank at the Queen's disposal can be on top of it in 10 seconds, and rearm/repair less than 400m away. Who on earth thought that was a positive addition? Surely the only motive there could have been to add another throw-away cache to give Blufor a freebie.

I think maybe there was a fear that with the release of 100 player servers, Insurgents would somehow benefit more than their aggressors. That notion has certainly been proven false by now.

I really hope we will get a hotfix for this soon. I belive we lost a lot of the new players that joined PR after 1.0 because they got annoyed too by the INS mode (and maybe even some old player).

epicelite wrote: Remove the ability to arrest via shotgun, it makes arresting too easy and breaches just run around with their shotgun having no fear of ROE penalties. (I know I do!) It creates more problems then it solves!
"B-BUT MUH CIVIES HIDING ON LADDERS!" Deal with it, I have never encountered a situation where I could not arrest a civilian with the restrainers, and if I did then I guess that's tough shit.
At the least create a special shotgun ammo type that arrests but does 0 damage. Hell, use slugs for this purpose nobody's gonna run around with slugs.
Harsher penalties for shooting civilians, vehicle crews just shoot them down all day long because they have to wait for their vehicle to respawn anyway so a longer spawn time is a non-issue to them.

All valid points except this. Sorry but Civilians are troll enough as it is, without the shotgun to keep them in check the absurd tactics will only get more and more retarded. You sound like you're still butt hurt from getting arrested by shotgun one too many times.

Murphy wrote:All valid points except this. Sorry but Civilians are troll enough as it is, without the shotgun to keep them in check the absurd tactics will only get more and more retarded. You sound like you're still butt hurt from getting arrested by shotgun one too many times.

nah. The shotgun-arresting should be removed.
It is a pain in the *** if you have to stare at your screen for 3mins. If you get arrested a second time you're allready watching the screen for 6mins!! <- which is the point where i rage quit.
It's not fun if the Brits camp at the VCP on al basrah, and you are watching them from 50m away and suddenly BAAM! You're lieing on the street, a message's telling you got arrest and the countdown says you have to wait 192secs to respawn....fuuuuuuuuuuuuu

That story kind of balances against the Blufor mortar guys who lost intel points because Civilians are running into fire. They get a nice long spawn screen as well, and all they did was fire on the targets given by infantry.

Best balance? Remove the kit.

Another thing to consider is that a Civi off on his own should get owned and have a huge spawn time, the kit is meant to support the teammates with weapons not go off on his own to troll an APC/IFV. If you are in fact working with your team there will almost always be someone to pick up the kit and revive you, thus giving you no spawn time and costing the enemy precious intel points.

I have seen a few smart civilians who use the kit to its potential, the rest are idiots trying to force the enemy to kill them which ruins the premise of civilian collaborators.

Sorry for off topic, I know there is a thread about this discussion and it's a better place to continue....but it's hard to just let one side of the story reign.

Murphy wrote:Best balance? Remove the kit.

Exactly. It never belonged in this game in the first place.