[Map] Phu Nguoi (2km) [WIP] (PR:V)

[matty1053]

Finally!!!! This looks better then the other PR:V maps. (I just hope it isn't a rapefest like CP)

[Nightingale]

I realized that it just looked silly to use almond trees. I decided to go back to the original Overgrowth setup, but now the battle is set during a period of very low-lying fog:


(in-editor screenshot, so it has weird issues displaying the grass in this photo, but it looks better in-game)

Ideally, I would like to make my own material type so that vehicles will get stuck in the mud if they try to drive over these swampy puddles, but I'm guessing that's a bit much for a first-timer to be doing on his first map.

I think I'll probably also end up photoshopping a foggier sky because it doesn't look all that believable right now.

Finally!!!! This looks better then the other PR:V maps. (I just hope it isn't a rapefest like CP)

I think the gameplay will probably be similar to Hill 488 or Tad Sae. Phu Nguoi will not have aircraft of any sort. Both teams spawn in the jungle and must travel via land to meet the enemy, so it really won't be comparable at all to Charlie's Point.

[Nightingale]

Overview of map, without foliage or fog


Caves!

Currently, I have 12 caves in the map. All of them are in the mountainous region.

Current Plans for Gameplay Layers (very rough)

STD
+ morning, dense fog
+ 7 capzones, all neutral
+ US Army vs NVA
ALT
+ midnight
+ US begins with 5 out of 7 capzones, NVA begins with none
+ US Marines defensive
INS
+ morning, dense fog
+ caches will spawn in bushes, caves, shacks
+ it's insurgency in Vietnam!


I'm currently debating whether the NVA should spawn at sea level (just like the US forces), or if they should spawn up in the mountains. I know it's not really something I need to decide at this point--just having fun playing around with ideas for this map.

[mries]

Current Plans for Gameplay Layers (very rough)

STD
+ morning, dense fog
+ 7 capzones, all neutral
+ US Army vs NVA
ALT
+ midnight
+ US begins with 5 out of 7 capzones, NVA begins with none
+ US Marines defensive
INS
+ morning, dense fog
+ caches will spawn in bushes, caves, shacks
+ it's insurgency in Vietnam!

Interesting plans for the layouts! I like it that the NVA will attack at night, gives the impression of the tet offensive or the later stages of the Vietnam war.
How is progress going?

[Nightingale]

Hi mries,

Sorry but there hasn't been actual progress since the last post. I have been working on a complete re-design of this map's layout. When I started adding in the caves, I realized that there were better ways of doing what I had done before, and that I was wasting map space by doing certain things in this map.

I don't know if it's allowed in this forum, since I will be no longer following the original map concept in the OP, but this new map will replace the current one if I find that it works the way I want it to. It will be a totally different map layout, but it will have the same kinds of features and overall "feel" as the current design.

Thanks for taking interest in my map mries.

I had a fun match on Hill 488 the other day which made me really get motivated to work on this map at my old pace.

[Insanitypays]

Exciting. I'm looking forward to see what you turn out

[Arab]

Amazing work, man! I really like how this is turning out, getting better and better

[Nightingale]

Thanks for all the encouragement guys.

I'll leave a quick screenshot of what I have in the editor right now, since it has been a long time since I posted any pics of anything:


A canyon cuts through the jungle, and there's a river in it. There will 3 bridges wide enough for vehicles to cross, and about 7-8 foot bridges just for infantry. And also boats, because boats are cool.

If a moderator wants me to make a new thread for this new map, just close this current thread and let me know.

[Amok@ndy]

no need for a new thread if you just start from scratch we can reame the thread etc

though i dont think the canyons are very realistic in such a flat area i dont think the water would have the power to create such canyons

[B2P1]

It depends more on the type of soil, but it looks a bit unreal I must admit.

[Nightingale]

Hmm, well that's not good then. I want my map to be believable, even if it's fictional.

If I made the canyons very shallow (only 10m high at most), would it be more believable? The river would have enough strength to cut a shallow canyon like that, I think.

Though, if I made the canyon more shallow then I'd have to take the caves out.

Or would making the terrain more rough and mountainous help make the canyons more believable?

[Arc_Shielder]

It's not that unrealistic based on a curious (and yet quick) research I did.

Canyons and Caves of Vietnam and Laos ? We Love Canyons!

Question is if there were any battles going on in such places. If yes, then all you have to do is to change the name accordingly.

[salaminl]

Liking your map so far! Perhaps this is a good reference for the river/canyon.

[Amok@ndy]

Arc_Shielder;2043802']It's not that unrealistic based on a curious (and yet quick) research I did.

Canyons and Caves of Vietnam and Laos ? We Love Canyons!

Question is if there were any battles going on in such places. If yes, then all you have to do is to change the name accordingly.

as you can see in the pictures you need some mountainous area to speed the water up so it has enough power to get such hard canyons, also they do not look very good ingame as you are limited in detail even on a 2km map

[Rhino]

Very basic video that doesn't go into much detail but that is the typical type of river formations. There are also U shaped valleys to the traditional V shaped valleys which is caused by glacial erosion, high up in mountains etc where you get or had glaciers.

[Nightingale]

I've made a few changes to the river canyons. They're more eroded, thinner, and the terrain around it slopes down more steeply than before. It's not really a 'V' shape as in the reference pictures, because I still want to retain the cliff-style canyons, but do you guys think it looks more believable now?




Does it make it less believable that these rivers are less than 16m wide? Do thinner rivers have less erosion ability than wide rivers?


============

Is there an additional set of colour-maps that PR mappers typically download to use on their maps? Does each mapper just use his own set? I've noticed on a lot of the v1.2 maps that there are plenty of places with no corresponding colourmap in the editor.

[Rhino]

Forgetting the geography and just talking about gameplay, those steep cliffs are going to be pretty frustrating if you fall in and aren't able to get out without swimming for ages down river to the nearest spot you can... So if your going to have these "river cliffs", I would try to have quite a few places along the way where you can climb out of them.

You also should really take into account the terrain morphing, even on a 2km map, with those steep cliffs its going to be really bad: https://www.realitymod.com/forum/f189-m ... s-2km.html

From a geography POV, it doesn't look at all realistic still tbh. To get the kinda terrain your looking for you should be aiming for much more of an early stage of the river, which would work for these small rivers and in a few places, these deep channels but really requires more hills, a water basin and a few waterfalls etc.

[Microwaife]

I would make it less steep.
Like have the height of the terrain going down a bit and then a river in that so to say "small valley".
Do you have any reference pics for these canyons being there?

Spoiler for Formation of canyons:

Most canyons were formed by a process of long-time erosion from a plateau or table-land level. The cliffs form because harder rock strata that are resistant to erosion and weathering remain exposed on the valley walls.
Canyons are much more common in arid than in wet areas because physical weathering has a more localized effect in arid zones. The wind and water from the river combine to erode and cut away less resistant materials such as shales. The freezing and expansion of water also serves to help form canyons. Water seeps into cracks between the rocks and freezes, pushing the rocks apart and eventually causing large chunks to break off the canyon walls, in a process known as frost wedging.[2] Canyon walls are often formed of resistant sandstones or granite. Submarine canyons form underwater, generally at the mouths of rivers.
Sometimes large rivers run through canyons as the result of gradual geological uplift. These are called entrenched rivers, because they are unable to easily alter their course. The Colorado River in the Southwest and the Snake River in the Northwest are two examples of tectonic uplift.
Canyons often form in areas of limestone rock. As limestone is soluble to a certain extent, cave systems form in the rock. When these collapse, a canyon is left, as in the Mendip Hills in Somerset and Yorkshire Dales in Yorkshire, England.
Source: Wikipedia

[Nightingale]

No, there's no pics. I just made the map based on my imagination, which is why it's not very realistic.

Anyways, I've concluded that I'll have to remove these steep cliffs from the map. As others have pointed out, the cliffs aren't realistic in terms of geography and they'll also cause morphing problems and infantry will get stuck swimming forever in them.

The whole point of the cliffs for me was to make it so that vehicles have to use the bridges to cross. If you drive into the river, then you should get stuck and have to abandon your jeep or whatever. But since I won't do it with cliffs anymore, I'll go for this kind of eroded river bank:

That way, infantry can get out but jeeps and APCs can't (or at least it'll take a lot of effort).

[Rhino]

Best way to stop vehicles from crossing rivers is just to make them deep and wide, other than amphibious vehicles ofc which can swim over them.

As for your pic, to me that looks like a River Cliff on the outside of a meander where the water is moving the fastest round the corner, creating more erosion, creating the cliff.