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The TOW is now a better crew served weapon, although having the reload bar return would be nice. The SPG-9 on the other hand has become very unuseable, especially given the nerf to resupplying ammo technicals.

It seems to take 30 seconds per small ammo crate resupplied, which means that the ammo technical takes 90 to resupply 6 SPG-9 rockets, not considering the time required to drive back and forth.

The spg-9 technical on the other hand resupplies much more quickly for some reason, so is now always a better option, which is a bit silly..

One person manning an spg-9 technical, parking it somewhere and shooting from stationary >> full squad manning and resupplying spg-9.

(and yes, I've ran several squads attempting to do the latter).

Nate. wrote:on the other hand, TOWs are now faster to shovel, have a shorter firing delay and also reload quicker.

From changelog:
Updated with reduced reload time of deployable ATGM by 5 seconds.
Updated with reduced delay to use of deployable ATGM by 5 seconds.
Updated with reduced time to shovel deployable ATGM.

The big problem is that the SPG-9 did not seem to have gotten this change. (I haven't tested exact timing, so I might be wrong, but it feels slower that the ATGM's).

axytho wrote:It seems to take 30 seconds per small ammo crate resupplied, which means that the ammo technical takes 90 to resupply 6 SPG-9 rockets, not considering the time required to drive back and forth.

Why would you wait for ammo technical, when you can rearm from hideout? Now, I would guess that rearm speed from hideout is similar to small ammo crate, so feedback from that side stands.

InfantryGamer42 wrote:Why would you wait from ammo technical, when you can rearm from hideout? Now, I would guess that rearm speed from hideout is similar to small ammo crate, so feedback from that side stands.

Yes but that's kinda the point: my main base should be better at resupplying than a random tunnel dug into the ground. The main base should be where these spg-9 rockets are stored, and they only weigh 4.5 kg a piece, so it really should not take longer to load 6 of them into a truck than reloading an entire T-62.

axytho wrote:Yes but that's kinda the point: my main base should be better at resupplying than a random tunnel dug into the ground. The main base should be where these spg-9 rockets are stored, and they only weigh 4.5 kg a piece, so it really should not take longer to load 6 of them into a truck than reloading an entire T-62.

You are forgetting that we are talking about insurgency factions. Main base for those doesn't exist in same sense as for regular militaries. Hideout ammo ability is really nice way to represent decentralized nature of insurgency logistics.

InfantryGamer42 wrote:You are forgetting that we are talking about insurgency factions. Main base for those doesn't exist in same sense as for regular militaries. Hideout ammo ability is really nice way to represent decentralized nature of insurgency logistics.

Yes, but there is usually still some main supply point, maybe an abandoned military warehouse, where you can supply your forces from. Else, how are repeatedly creating those bomb trucks? Clearly we're storing a lot of explosives in these places.

My point is that it shouldn't be easier to resupply an spg-9 vehicle than a stationary spg-9. At the current point, the RPG-7 is a better option against both infantry and vehicles at all but the most extreme ranges.

For the SPG emplacement itself reloading in seconds from a personal test

9.41/rnd (Round)

8.2/ht (Heat)
11.8/frg (Frag)

2 ab (ammobags) to refill the SPG fully

Refill ur ammo bag from the boxes or crate in sec

6.88/Ab (ammobox)


11.21/Ac (ammocrate)

MOSES!! wrote:For the SPG emplacement itself reloading in seconds from a personal test

9.41/rnd (Round)

8.2/ht (Heat)
11.8/frg (Frag)

2 ab (ammobags) to refill the SPG fully

Refill ur ammo bag from the boxes or crate in sec

6.88/Ab (ammobox)


11.21/Ac (ammocrate)

Thanks for testing. These values hover around ten seconds, which is the same value provided by Wikipedia so the reload speed is good, and I'm not complaining about it any more.

I guess I'll just have to get used to the pain of insurgent logistics.

axytho wrote:The TOW is now a better crew served weapon, although having the reload bar return would be nice. The SPG-9 on the other hand has become very unuseable, especially given the nerf to resupplying ammo technicals.

It seems to take 30 seconds per small ammo crate resupplied, which means that the ammo technical takes 90 to resupply 6 SPG-9 rockets, not considering the time required to drive back and forth.

The spg-9 technical on the other hand resupplies much more quickly for some reason, so is now always a better option, which is a bit silly..

One person manning an spg-9 technical, parking it somewhere and shooting from stationary >> full squad manning and resupplying spg-9.

(and yes, I've ran several squads attempting to do the latter).



The big problem is that the SPG-9 did not seem to have gotten this change. (I haven't tested exact timing, so I might be wrong, but it feels slower that the ATGM's).

My major issue is with the SPG emplacement and re-supplying it from hideouts.

The SPG has a very slow traverse and limited elevation so is best suited to covering a specific area. It's usually up against vehicles with thermals and/or high zoom weapons. You usually build the hideout in the most covered and hidden position that allows covered/concealed access to the nearby cache. But the spg emplacement is usually away from there with open ground between it and the cache position so it can have an actually useful field of vision.

Sometimes it is literally impossible to build it somewhere with a useful field of vision and for guys running ammo to cross the open ground to that location due to APC and the abundance of blufor scoped automatic rifles. So you can build it, then never get ammo to it.

The only time you can actually build and use one now is right on top of a cache or hideout, which are in bad firing positions usually, or build the hideout in a bad reinforcement position but a good fov.

PBAsydney wrote:Good, that was the intended purpose.

Do you want to be that guy that carries ammo for a whole game? Im tired of screaming to my squad mates to carry ammo or being screamed at to carry ammo by someone.

Even the goddamn machineguns.

Yes, in the past you still occasionally had to drop some ammo off if you kept camping for a long while. But it was staggered. Not everything was out of ammo at the same time. Like I haven´t tried all the emplacements yet so maybe it doesn´t work like this for all BLUFOR stuff but for the insurgents you start with 0 on the machineguns and + on the SPG. Thats a whole lot of ammo running to get shit done.

And you basically have 3 people having all the fun , shooting guns, and 3 mules running around feeding ammo from the first second.

Hell no. I dont care if it was done for "balance reasons". Things worked for 10 years, stop touching it with your sweaty palms. If you have to, nerf the TOW, nerf the SPG, increase reload time, decrease explosion radious. Its a game, and nobody likes carrying little bags back and forth like a good doggie.

Nate. wrote:on the other hand, TOWs are now faster to shovel, have a shorter firing delay and also reload quicker.

From changelog:
Updated with reduced reload time of deployable ATGM by 5 seconds.
Updated with reduced delay to use of deployable ATGM by 5 seconds.
Updated with reduced time to shovel deployable ATGM.

This is so dumb. The issue with them was if anything that they were overpowered. Now if you have a "well oiled" squad of squad members who like to roleplay a fucking ammo-carrier then you´ll do even better. If you´re a more casual player, or basically don´t enjoy running back and forth for 5 minutes every time a FoB has been built, you´re tough out of luck.

And frankly I don´t want to demand anything from my squadmates I despise doing myself when Im leading a squad, so here I am in a pickle.

Half the time I end up filling the goddamn **** myself as a SQL because I Feel like shit asking someone to do it while the rest of us enjoy target practice.

Geko wrote:This is solved by either having a competent squad with the leader assigning someone to co-operate with the one taking the TOW, or just playing with more experienced players that are more aware of their surroundings and do the right thing without having to be told what to do.

I do agree that some glitches regarding ammo bags not resupplying the assets needs to be fixed and a certain nerf is also needed in regards to the time it takes to get the resupplies necessary.

The change embraces teamwork a lot more and makes or breaks the satisfaction from having a competent co-operating squad to a bunch of lone-wolfers.

"its solved" by your arbtrary demands into the ether, for a community that has become more casual and more divided into "regulars" and "I dont even have a mic but I want to play" people for years. With servers now allowing that.

On one side these developers are churning out videos to "introduce new players" to the game, on the other side they are pumping out changes like this that are so extremely user-unfriendly no modern game would ever consider them.


You want new players and then you want to drive a wedge so deep they never recover and leave. Or they get bored because they never even try out all the features. You want to have the cake , and eat it.

The first recommended kit for a new player is the rifleman, its the standard kit. And you want that guy to be a mule. Think.

Stolt_Yugoslav wrote:This is so dumb. The issue with them was if anything that they were overpowered. Now if you have a "well oiled" squad of squad members who like to roleplay a fucking ammo-carrier then you´ll do even better. If you´re a more casual player, or basically don´t enjoy running back and forth for 5 minutes every time a FoB has been built, you´re tough out of luck.

And frankly I don´t want to demand anything from my squadmates I despise doing myself when Im leading a squad, so here I am in a pickle.

Half the time I end up filling the goddamn **** myself as a SQL because I Feel like shit asking someone to do it while the rest of us enjoy target practice.

.......

+1

Stolt_Yugoslav wrote:This is so dumb. The issue with them was if anything that they were overpowered. Now if you have a "well oiled" squad of squad members who like to roleplay a fucking ammo-carrier then you´ll do even better. If you´re a more casual player, or basically don´t enjoy running back and forth for 5 minutes every time a FoB has been built, you´re tough out of luck.

And frankly I don´t want to demand anything from my squadmates I despise doing myself when Im leading a squad, so here I am in a pickle.

Half the time I end up filling the goddamn **** myself as a SQL because I Feel like shit asking someone to do it while the rest of us enjoy target practice.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crew-serv ... efficiency.

crew-served weapon is any weapon system that is issued to a crew of two or more individuals performing the same or separate tasks to run at maximum operational efficiency, as opposed to an individual-service weapon, which only requires one person to run at maximum operational efficiency. The weight and bulk of the system often also necessitates multiple personnel for transportation.

Crew-served weapons operated by infantry include sniper rifles, anti-materiel rifles, machine guns, automatic grenade launchers, mortars, anti-tank guns, anti-aircraft guns, recoilless rifles, shoulder-launched missile weapons, and static anti-tank and anti-aircraft missiles.
Manual
Requesting a kit costs 200 supply points. Be aware that re-arming an ammo bag at for example an ammo box or light/heavy supply crate will cost as many points at it provides (200). The amount of supply points for the supply sources are:
From the manual
Ammo bags : 200 (will only count for 43 supply points when used by an asset emplacement like a TOW or mortar for example)
Ammo boxes : 450
Light supply crates : 1500
Heavy supply crates : 3000
Another thing to take notice is that resupplying is not instant but takes a few seconds, depending on the ammo source as well with the ammount of ammo you need to ressuply.

@Devs. After playing around a lot with the new stationary reload quantities: Thanks for increasing the amount that an ammo bag ressuplies!

This makes more sense (as previously you could carry multiple non-guided HAT's but not multiple TOW ammunitions) and it allows people who resupply stationaries some time to look around and help the TOW spot targets.

So thanks! Stationaries are a lot more fun now, and I haven't really felt (more) frustated playing against either as inf or as assets.

While the new emplacement system is less spammy. There is still one thing that still irks me.

There's not enough ammo. It used to be three total rockets for tows. Now it's down to two. I really want the ability to be able to 'bank' rockets for future use. I believe the tow rocket capacity should be increased back to three, possibly four rockets. Same with AA emplacement having two or three reloads.

P.S. Insurgent requestable ammo kit when?

dcm wrote:While the new emplacement system is less spammy. There is still one thing that still irks me.

There's not enough ammo. It used to be three total rockets for tows. Now it's down to two. I really want the ability to be able to 'bank' rockets for future use. I believe the tow rocket capacity should be increased back to three, possibly four rockets. Same with AA emplacement having two or three reloads.

P.S. Insurgent requestable ammo kit when?

Techically, you can still do it, by spamming as much as possible ammo bags on emplacement.

InfantryGamer42 wrote:Techically, you can still do it, by spamming as much as possible ammo bags on emplacement.

Yeah but, You can only drop one ammo bag at once. And most people are on autopilot and keep dropping ammo even when there's no need. Only further depleting crates.