Project Reality Forums

Posted: **2005-09-15 11:58**

Okay one last time, in the lost posts I had asked whether it was possible to rotate the turret with the joystick, It was established that it is not and it is unlikely it can be modded as so.

My question that never got answered is, is it possible to set the mod so it thinks the tank turret is a helicopter, allowing it to use joystick input?

Posted: **2005-09-15 20:26**

thats a possibility i think, but im no coder

Posted: **2005-09-16 08:09**

Psycho_Sam wrote: According to those videos on the link, the turret rotates 360 degrees in about 36 seconds. I think those are all challenger tanks so I assume the time will be different for all other tanks.

The video was probably not made in the intention of show how fast the turret can traverse, so it is safe to assume the turret wasn't traversing at full speed.

I did a full 360 in ten seconds in an Abrams both in Steel Beasts and M1 Tank Platoon II. I suppose any tank simulation is fairly accurate to compare to when making a mod for a BF

Posted: **2005-09-16 08:37**

Wonder wrote:The video was probably not made in the intention of show how fast the turret can traverse, so it is safe to assume the turret wasn't traversing at full speed.

I did a full 360 in ten seconds in an Abrams both in Steel Beasts and M1 Tank Platoon II. I suppose any tank simulation is fairly accurate to compare to when making a mod for a BF

That is just about right. The maximum rate of power traverse for an Abrams is roughly 40 degrees/second. Keep in mind, when tracking a target in the sights, it moves about 10 times slower to keep it in the reticle. The maximum rate is probably used to slew the gun onto the next target after the tank commander has acquired it in his own independent sight.

Posted: **2005-09-17 13:27**

Ok cool

Is there anyway that PR can alter the control mapping system thingy? I thought that would be hard coded or something into the game. Using the Joystick to control the turret would be excellent!

Posted: **2005-09-19 17:13**

could you not code the turret component of the tank, due to my fidling with BF2Editor, i know thats where its rotation speed and the gun characteristics are found. would it be possible to make the turret think its a helicopter and move like you suggest above but of course with no power for its Z axis movement? im guessin you can't code the turret to be something else as its tied to the tank which would make it a road vehicle, but maybe this is possible?

Posted: **2005-09-19 18:14**

You'd have to use the Z axis, cause X axis is roll, if you were trying to control the turret like that it would be like flying a stationary airplane.

You could then bind the joystick's X axis to the games Z axis, which would give you a proper joystick effect. The downside would be it would ruin your helicopter controls.

Posted: **2005-09-19 18:57**

Ok, one thing I think people are overlooking here is that forcing realistic turret speeds will force you to use realistic tactics when in a tank.

First of all, your tank shouldn't act as a heavily armored jeep or something. You're not supposed to drive around a map at full speed, running people over, stopping next to a flag and taking it by yourself.

Here's a visual example (I'm no tanker, by the way, so I may be wrong). I'm just trying to emphasize the point that things need to slown down a bit. If infantry have to move carefully, so do tanks and everything else.

Posted: **2005-09-21 03:25**

worst 3 wrote:they dont move that slow in real life, but there has to be a reason that tanks dont shoot down halicopters in real life. can the tank canon shoot at such a high angle? i dond think it should be slower but harder to hit a healocopter some how

if you played steel beasts, you'd understand. you need to lase a target, then fire. if the target is moving, you need to lase and fire quickly or you = screwed

Posted: **2005-09-22 06:19**

Tanks can shoot down helicopters IRL, Well tanks with 100/120/125mm cannons can, as they are capable of firing Guided Missiles out from them. Using the APFSDS rounds, Most tanks can fire at helicopters flying under 3000ft from about 2KMs away. The only problem is that Helicopters dont fly that close to tanks IRL.

Posted: **2005-09-22 11:05**

How about making a tank require multiple occupants for maximum efficiency. In reality one man could operate a tank, however the fact that he is acting as Driver, Gunner and Commander should reduce the efficiency of the unit. Would it be possible to create a third position who controls the turret independently of the driver or coax gunner, this would if possible allow the reload and turret times to be altered dependent on how many crew are manning the tank. Basicaly with only a driver you can move and fire the main gun, just not at the same time, reload speeds could be 2X for 1 man crew, 1.5 for 2 and 1 for 3, this means a commander must consider how best to use the tank and increases the kill value for a fully manned unit. It also puts a dampner on using Tanks, as one man put it, as armored jeeps. Choppers are only efficient with the proper crew it would be nice to see tanks get the treatment. The velocity of the projectile seems reasonable at the moment, the main problem with tanks currently, in my opinion is the ease of use, it's more like strapping on battle armor and charging of to fight. With these changes one man can use it, but he will not be shooting down enemy aircraft with it, whereas 3 men properly versed and fighting together regularly should stand a chance considering it is possible to do in real life, if somewhat improbable.

Posted: **2005-09-22 11:42**

Actually the original reason behind using a cupola mounted machine gun was for anti-aircraft. Just these days they're eithe way too fast or too far away to hit. That's why most tanks have a .50 on top, which was originally designed as an AA round anyway in WW1.

What you're describing sounds like the system in Operation Flashpoint. With a driver, gunner and commander who can look all around the tank and say where to go and what to shoot and so on. I know from experience in said game that one man operating a tank is VERY difficult. Unless you're a lucky git and aren't seen, or the enemy has no effective means to get rid of you you're pretty fecked haha.

Posted: **2005-09-22 11:55**

I'm torn on the mutli-crewed tanks myself, I like the idea but I'm really afraid it will tie up too much of the server's aircraft, as it is the infantry to vehical ratio is off. However maybe with tank respawns lowered so they are more valuable it will off-set, that said I don't think more then 2 people (driver/gunner) should be required to operate at max.

Posted: **2005-09-22 12:15**

I'm not all too fond of the driver/gunner idea for tanks.

Commonly, if a battle ensues, tanks will not drive around like formula1 racecars.

If you have a good view down a street, you might as well keep your distance and use the big guns, keeping the street clear and your infantry out of harm's way.

If you have a driver/gunner type situation, the driver would have to sit around and pick his nose until its time to move again.

For example, a guy comes home from work, happy to play some BF2. He spends the majority of the next 1 hour sitting in an abrams tank, waiting for the go-ahead to keep moving from the great firing position that they have. No one would be that crazy, instead, you would see drivers fidgeting and moving around way to much.

In short... driving is no fun if you can't drive around -- and "driving around" isn't something tanks do unless they are in a rare tank battle.

I think it's a better alternative (check my post regarding what my father used to say in general discussion) to force tanks to act as they should in an engagement.

Posted: **2005-09-22 12:41**

Actually moving and shooting is a very common thing with modern tanks. I've seen tanks engage and HIT targets over 2km away whilst going top speed over bumpy terrain. Maybe if you could speed up the turret turning a tiny bit and make it more stable whilst moving that'd make up for the having to stop to shoot thing.

Posted: **2005-09-22 20:26**

Mad Max wrote:Actually moving and shooting is a very common thing with modern tanks. I've seen tanks engage and HIT targets over 2km away whilst going top speed over bumpy terrain. Maybe if you could speed up the turret turning a tiny bit and make it more stable whilst moving that'd make up for the having to stop to shoot thing.

That's different.

In Battlefield 2 there will not be maps that are 2km away.

The primary role of tanks is to support and protect infantry. When tanks were crossing the desert on the way to Baghdad at the start of the 2nd gulf war... yes... they were going at full speed. Not to mention, the Iraqis had no match for the abrams. Their targeting systems were less effective if the abrams were consistently on the move.

That entire point can be disregarded altogether because the egagements you can portray in Battlefield 2 sized maps are the type where tanks get strategically positioned as supporting fire.

Tanks do not storm objective areas. Infantry do.

Posted: **2005-09-22 22:34**

solodude23 wrote:I want tanks like DCR, but with better features.

Here it is:

I as well thingk an only driving position might even lead me to get bored (even thoguh I love realism)Therefore the Driver/Commander position should be combines, but with a seperate gunner, like DCR.

In that case, make it so the driver/commander spot also can "spot" targets for the gunner just by left-clicking, which would show the enemy on the enemy on the minimap, and if possible code it so where the driver/commander clicks theres also something that shows up on the 3D map for the gunner so he can easily know which way to turn and such for the current designated target. If you just have 2 positions where one drives and one shoots, it would simply be horrible. You need communication and teamwork in multiple seated tanks which requires good features added to the tank.

-Gunners have a "zoom" to engage targets from longer distances. You can replace "pop smoke" with zoom and give pop smoke to the commander/driver as right mouse since he knows more whats gonig on.

-Commander/Driver position has a full 360 degree view for easy spotting for better situational awareness for the tank.

-As I said above, when the commander/driver "spots" (left-mouse) it should show up on the minimap just like the current spotting feature, as well as the 3D map for the gunner only if ya can code it.

Hope you consider my ideas.

That would definitely offset the bordedom. Good ideas.

I really wish they could code something like on the 3d map.

Posted: **2005-09-27 16:15**

{GD}Snake13 wrote:Okay one last time, in the lost posts I had asked whether it was possible to rotate the turret with the joystick, It was established that it is not and it is unlikely it can be modded as so.

My question that never got answered is, is it possible to set the mod so it thinks the tank turret is a helicopter, allowing it to use joystick input?

Now THIS would increase realism AND fun!

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