jets overpowered / anti-air underpowered

CAS_117 · Post by **CAS_117** » 2007-07-27 20:51

3===SPECTER===3 wrote:I think the turning on the F-16s and Migs in ridiculous! u pull a turn at that speed your bound to pass out from Gs.

Not just passing out, but the speeds that these turns are made insane. The kinds of turns that are done by PR fighters all the time could only be pulled of for a few seconds IRL. If they were at corner velocity, they could make max G turns for a small amount of time, speed would be lost, and it would become a slow pig. Sharp turns in jets should be very limited by the flight model. Slow, efficient turns should be encouraged.

Wolfe · Post by **Wolfe** » 2007-07-27 20:55

R-Dev Fuzzhead wrote: What none of the pilots are really aware is max ceiling goes up to 5000!

But with the cloud cover so low, nobody uses the full 5000. That, and why bother going high if you can hardly be shot down from the ground.

Pvt_Parts · Post by **Pvt_Parts** » 2007-07-28 00:13

Wolfe wrote:As for jets not being overpowered; I think they are overpowered just by the nature of their insane maneuverability. IRL the Frog/A10 fly under 200 mph and turn very slowly but in-game they are much faster and can out-turn a fighter.

I agree and disagree. I read an operations manual for the A-10 (don't worry, its not classified), I believe the link was over at fas.org Military Analysis Network, it said that they should maintain speeds above 200knots during maneuvers. Of course, that is training.

Another problem is going slow makes you an easier target.

That being said, in Falcon 4.0 with the Super Falcon or Free Falcon mod, I would awkwardly engage ground troops in a hog often. If the target lacked AA ability I would dive to a final approach below 600ft, reduce to 200knots (I could never hit more than ~320knots ever), once they were in visual, I'd deploy partial air brakes, set full flaps, and slowly nose down and slowly rake back up again. Retracting brakes and reseting the flaps I'd then hit full speed and exit at a diagnal climb. Even in the realism mods for Falcon 4 (which F-16 falcons said were as real as their training simulators) the A-10's main gun seemed somewhat underpowered compared to its reputation... But I was also a lousy gunenr.

My favorite missions would be to ingress in a F-16 at <100ft above the ground (without ground follwing radar), pop up and destroy a building/bridge/etc, and then bugger out.

At least you can use the A-10 rudder for lift when in a turn, unlike most sims. (I've been told that is how it is in real life).

A similar forum topic about jets being unbalanced is here.

Post by **Mongolian_dude** » 2007-07-28 00:17

WNxKenwayy wrote:The AA vs Aircraft is all balanced out by the utter suckage of all but like 2 PR pilots. All aircraft crash within 2 minutes of take off anyways, so who cares.

Actualy, thats realistic.
This film proves it.
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=umSlYj0Tt1o

It looks like vBF2 was realistic. F-35s have a life expentency of about 112seconds.

...mongol...

101 bassdrive · Post by **101 bassdrive** » 2007-07-28 00:25

'[R-MOD wrote:Mongolian_dude']

It looks like vBF2 was realistic. F-35s have a life expentency of about 112seconds.

I laughed so hard. even hollywood flames on that silly 'look at me I can do hover uwee' plane.

Wolfe · Post by **Wolfe** » 2007-07-28 02:39

Ali G · Post by **Ali G** » 2007-07-28 04:17

^^LOL!!

But yea, SAMs and ATAMs are nothing a waste of system resources. Fix them quick, or don't make them at all!

CAS_117 · Post by **CAS_117** » 2007-07-28 06:38

I like how the guy launching the stinger is saying "missed" before the rocket has left the tube.

Post by **eggman** » 2007-07-28 07:43

Wolfe wrote:

Briloliant lol. That's pretty much exactly how it's working atm

On Kashan the intent was that the Fighters Jets spawn much faster than the attack jets, so any side that is lacking fighter escort for it's attack jets will not be able to keep the attack jets in the air for very long.

Additionally the SA weapons were supposed to be such that you really would be forced above the cloud layer if there was SA weapons active.

We need to work on the AA and SA combat dynamics.

Post by **Dunehunter** » 2007-07-28 07:51

I've been practicing for when that day comes. I am starting to get pretty decent at diving below the cloudcover, engaging something, then pulling back up and escaping back in my private realm. Feels good, even though there's no real need for it yet.

Ali G · Post by **Ali G** » 2007-07-28 17:13

'[R-DEV wrote:eggman']We need to work on the AA and SA combat dynamics.

BIG TIME

Guerra · Post by **Guerra** » 2007-07-28 23:45

You know, I love AA. If you know how to use it, it can really just massacre air units. Mobile AA (vehicles) and hand held AA launchers are very effective against fighter jets, attack planes and choppers of all variety.

Some brief and simple tips:

Do not shoot until you have a full lock on tone.

Wait until the opponent deploys flares, and aim just slightly above your target, so it keeps a lock on aircraft instead of the flares.

Do not shoot if the aircraft is flying towards you, only fire when it is flying AWAY from you.

If using hand held AA, team up with a rifleman for ammo and a 2nd AA gunner, 2 shots will take out anything. One will just inconvenience the pilot.

But in terms of Air Superiority fighters not being able to take out the A10 and other attack planes, I totally agree. A10 is the best at dogfighting with the nose cannon, this should not be. The ordinance this beast fires is too large and heavy to hit fast moving flying targets, it would drop a bit and miss quite often.

So, with respects to air to air dogfights, the attack planes are just so much better than jet fighters, if both pilots are of the same skill.

agentscar · Post by **agentscar** » 2007-07-29 00:27

The LAV-25,and Bradley IFV/CFV (WTF,I swear Bradley shouldn't be AA,even if it is the Linebacker version.) have the same Bushmaster cannon,yet the LAV-25 in PR/BF2 does lots more damage.I think that the Bradley Linebacker version should be replaced with the LAV-AD,like brought up earlier,and the Bradley should just be an IFV/CFV (calvary fighting vehicle).Also,Hopefully the 7.62 machinegun on the Bradley will get enabled sometime.And,there should be the available 6 passenger seats in the back of the Bradley.But I understand the Bradley in the U.S. ARMY edition of PR,will have that,along with TOW missle pods instead on stingers,WOOT!And the Bradley shouldn't be able to take out so easily...

Wolfe · Post by **Wolfe** » 2007-07-29 01:48

agentscar wrote:I think that the Bradley Linebacker version should be replaced with the LAV-AD.

If the U.S. gets the LAV-AD, then MEC should get...

...except it won't be made out of legos.

.
.
.

Post by **Bob_Marley** » 2007-07-29 01:58

Isn't/hasn't the LAV-AD being/been phased out, along with the linebacker.

so the US AAV should be what, the Avenger?

Guerra · Post by **Guerra** » 2007-07-29 09:19

fish, when I install 0.6, I challenge you to a dogfight. I get the A10, you get the mig, and you'll see how the A10 is the ultimate in air to air dogfighting.

agentscar · Post by **agentscar** » 2007-07-29 14:13

The M1 Tunguska,is really good in PR/BF2,and don't complain that it needs more armor,cuz it's a very old vehicle.And unless the Frogfoot,or A-10 have really good pilots,they don't stand a chance against an f-15,or Mig,not that they'd ever battle an f-15.And yea,I think the linebacker has been phased out due to the fact that,the U.S. doesn't really need ground to air defense from a variant of a Bradley...But I don't know about LAV-AD,and when you speak of the avenger,do you mean the M1097 Avenger?Cuz that is the U.S. primary land to air defense vehicle.
M1097 Avenger below:

Metis-M · Post by **Metis-M** » 2007-07-29 14:19

Fishwork is known as baseraper, he wait behind/over ur airfield until u start then shoot you or he try shoot u on the ground.

Bonsai · Post by **Bonsai** » 2007-07-29 14:47

Guerra wrote:fish, when I install 0.6, I challenge you to a dogfight. I get the A10, you get the mig, and you'll see how the A10 is the ultimate in air to air dogfighting.

Can you invite me to that show, please!