Project Reality Forums

LtSoucy its already in v0.6 on all soldiers but in v0.7 it is just more refined, easier to see too.

SINGLE TANK


DRIVER
- SL
- tank commander
- dicides EVERYTHING.

GUNNER
- just shoots.

If you're a gunner, don't yell "STOP!" or "BACKBACKBACK!" - you're not the one to make that decision. The only thing you can do is to say "Visual on enemy truck *easy target*... visual on three enemy tanks *aiming at us*..."
This is how it goes...

SOP
driver: (scans the battlefield using periscope)
driver: "Tank spotted, marked"
gunner: "Sabot ready"
driver: "Moving to the position" (moves forward)
gunner: "Visual on the target"
driver: (stops) "Fire"
gunner: "TAKING THE SHOT..."
gunner: "Round off / hit / kill"
driver: (moves back)
gunner: "Sabot ready"

then repeat from the beginning...

When I say "Target marked", that means he is using the ATTACK marker to show the target for gunner. (you could add info on what is that tank doing, and why do you think it's a good thing to attack it right now, like "He's not looking at us!", "Only one guy in the tank, and he's moving!")
"Sabot ready" means gunner IS listening and he's ready (sometimes your gunner is eating piza or drinking beer, so by saying this, gunner is saying "yes, I'm with you man, let's do this")
By saying "Fire", driver is making a statement he's not gonna move till the gunner shoots. You don't have to say "Fire", anything like "Take the shot" or "Stopped" is ok... yet "Fire" is probably the best thing to say... plus it sounds cool.
NOW THIS IS IMPORTANT - when I'm the gunner, I always say that "TAKING THE SHOT...". Why? Cos by that, I'm pointing I'll shoot in next 2 seconds, NO MATTER WHAT HAPPENS. If driver decides he has to move - fine - I'll take the shot anyway (miss or hit). It is vital that driver knows you're about to shoot, cos sometimes he can ruin the shot with a *I'll just turn the tank front toward the target* move.
Now it's up to the driver to decide if it's better to move when the gunner is just about to shoot or not. If he moves, and I miss - he can't blame me, and I can't blame him. You said you're gonna shoot, and he is the commander (SL).
Again, never yell "movemovemove" as a gunner, cos you're just confusing the guy, making it more dificult for him to make a good decision. If he feels like moving, he'll move. If he thinks it's better to stay, then ok... you don't like it - ask him to switch positions - then you can call the shots.
Remember, VOIP is late *a lot*. So by the time he hears your "MOVEMOVEMOVE!" and make the move, you're probably like one second from having another sabot ready.
Even worse, by the time he does anything, you'll be yelling "OK OK, STOP STOP STOP!"
That sucks. Better keep quiet.



TWO/THREE TANKS (Tank squad)
Now this is so freaking confusing.
Too much chat going on... first, you have to name your tanks different, so that when you say "Round off!" you know it's your gunner saying that.
I played with fuzzhead twice as a Tank squad member, and I couldn't tell who is saying what.

This is what I learned
At the beginning, I was naming tanks like "Tank1", "Tank2", etc.
Then, I realised ppl tend to forget who is tank1... so I came up with a simple solution - I let every crew to find a cool name for their tank, and it has to be a wild animal, cat family.
You can pick any of these names: Tiger, Puma, Leopard, Jaguar, Lion, Panther, etc...

So now it goes like "Tiger, sabot ready"... "Tiger moving"... "Tiger, visual on the garget"... "Panthter is damaged"... "Rgr, Panther"... "Tiger, fire!"... "Panther, pulling back"... "Tiger, aiming..."... "Panther repairing... "Tiger, round off... that's a kill!"

People seem to like this. It sounds cool, and it's a game, ppl like cool things.
I saw excellent results and good communication within squad, cos when I let two guys to name their tank "WILDCAT" I just can't stop them saying "Wildcat this" or "Wildcat that".
Makes them proud of saying that, I guess...

ONE MORE THING TO CONSIDER
Muting feels... rude.
Yet, I would recommend all the gunners in a Tank squad to mute everybody except their driver.
Also, Sl should mute other gunners (not his own, of course).
Other drivers should talk/listen only to theirs gunners and SL.

KingKong.CCCP wrote:Yet, I would recommend all the gunners in a Tank squad to mute everybody except their driver.
Also, Sl should mute other gunners (not his own, of course).
Other drivers should talk/listen only to theirs gunners and SL.

This is an excellent suggestion! I'd go a step further and set up some whispers, so that TC to driver comms were on a whisper, that way the SL can still talk to all hands over the general channel, but in-tank comms were via the whisper. The TC needs to set a whisper to the gunner and the SL. Whispers take a little time to set up, and a little practice to use them effectively, so don't do it the first time in a battle. Muting has one major draw back, should you end up not in a tank (long spawn time, loss of tank spawn) you won't have to alt-tab out to unmute the rest of your squad.

Moo

AWESOME KINGKONG!!!!!

Best idea Ive read for tank crew communication without the hassle

Me and sealights are invinsible with armor: APC and Tank. Everytime we play armor we get like 80 kills and 0 deaths. Its fun

How the heck do you mute someone on VoIP? Is it even possible?

Go to the scoreboard 'Organization' tab and check the mic icon on the right of their name.

^ or "manage" as the non-german versions say.
Thing is, its un-muted each time you die.

awesome strats there kingkong, i like the naming thing and i think the mute option (for gunners anyways) would be a great way to keep communication relevant and not overwhelm the gunners

I definitely like your VoIP ideas kingkong. Cutting down on chatter and knowing who is responsible for what in the tank makes you much more effective than enemy tanks. Definitely like the idea of gunners being responsible only for gunning, with drivers communicating, spotting, and moving.

I've noticed mute option don't last for long time. bjoffe said it unmutes every time you die... that's why I placed it under "ONE MORE THING TO CONSIDER"...
Let's just say, if there is a driver/gunner in other tank that has similar voice to your crewmember, or some guy in squad talking too much, mute him.

I got used to mute people. Everytime when there is a guy in the squad giving me more headache then useful info, I mute him. Sometimes I first say "You talk too much", but that sounds rude, and nobody want's to be hushed, specialy in a virtual reality video game. So now, if that guy is not paying attention on what others are saying, I just mute him, and he doesn't even realize that.

Also having a third guy in the tank, wich can go a bit in front and use binoculars to look for targets without showing the tank, then the tank just pulls out and fires, and backs away again.
And the third just jumps in as mg when moving longer distances

Can be useful, and prolong the life of the tank

Awesome tank communication idea KingKong, i gonna suggest it to my clan leader!

the main problems that hinder tank success rates are the drivers want to be going somwhere all the time. drivers whould stop a heck of a lot sooner than they think they should because they rarely consider enemy tank flank movements.(for instance if the crew thought the tank would be on the center of the flag cap location, when the enemy tank is actually watching the flag from a few hundred meters out) This is why qinling can be difficult to master, because of all the trees blocking your vision its not hard to mix up a tank chassis with a circular bush which has the same type of coloration from a distance. Mainly a tank should look for a place where they can fire THROUGH cover and not over or around it, which is pretty rare in PR.

Hairysteed wrote:I've found out that commands used in the tank sim Steel Beasts work quite well in PR. These are also the commands used by the US Army tank crewmen

When either the TC or the gunner spots an enemy unit he/she immediately shouts:

"Tank!" - Main battle tank
"PC!" - IFVs, APCs, Armored cars, vehicles with light armor
"Troop!" - Infantry
"Truck!" - Wheeled soft-skinned vehicles. Jeeps fall into this category

As the TC calls a target he/she overrides the turret control and slews the gun to bear, making it clear to the gunner what the TC wants the gunner to engage. This is not possible in PR, so the gunner will have to use direction pointers such as:
"Tank, two o' clock!"
To point out the general direction of the target. Usually the gunner can find the target with just that, but if he's off the TC can fine-tune with "Traverse Right/Left!".

Having seen the target the gunner calls "Identified!". In real tanks this is the cue for the TC to relieve the turret control back to the gunner. If the Gunner cannot see the target, or it's unclear what the TC wants him to engage he'll say "Cannot identify!"

When the gunner has identified the target the TC can then issue the order "Fire!". This, however, is not the order to fire the gun straight away, but rather an authorization to destroy the target.

When the gunner is confident he has a clear shot and is about to fire he tells the TC "On the way!". This is to let the TC know he's about to take the shot and is the cue for the commander to stop the vehicle.

The TC will observe the flight of the projectile and tell the gunner where it landed with "Over!/Short!/Left!/Right!/Target!, so that the gunner can readjust the aim accordingly if needed.

Example:

"PC, eleven o'clock!"
-"Identified!"
-"Fire!"
-"On the way!"
-"Target!"

This is the best example yet. At least this is what u learn @ Ft. Knox but like posted earlier in the heat of the moment it comes out a little jumbled. That's perfect for gunnery though. Man I miss Table VIII. Anyway back to the game I don't think we have to say exact fire commands as long as you identify the target's location and fire that is all. As for the driver just have him practice with his crew so that he knows all of the action on drills before time so that the TC and gunner can just focus on enemy contact. If need be give him some direction but a crew (TC) shouldn't have to control their driver....that's in or out of the game. Hope I was of some help.

It's all good except for the adjusting fire part because the driver often see the shots as a miss when it hits or vice versa.

OiSkout wrote:Hehe you should simply make communications a general 'guide.'

We have one, i compiled it. Some great information here, i will be compiling all the suggestions here into a guide soon, with all the contributing comments credited if you lot would like.

Strange,

I never heard bearing in clock format, always in degrees ( i.e. "Contact, Tank, 220°!"). Much better to orientate with the BF2 player interface.

Also, one thing which worked very well in tank squads I commanded or played with: one of the MG gunner in the tank squads can be designated to take over text communications with the other squads. This way, You will stay up to date what is going on with the team and You can coordinate greatly with Your infantry and air force.

This is for background information only and purely for interest. Just a collection of British tank comms used commonly inside the turret on engagements, most of the guys of my clan [ABA] who are tanks crews use them and they work almost as well in game as IRL.

Firstly there is a difference between Commander initiated fire orders and Gunner initiated, where the commander has given authority to fire to the gunner so he can comcentrate on other things.

Commander InitiatedExample

1.Ammunition Nature to be fired.
HESH, Fin (APFSDS) etc.
Coax - Machine Gun.

2.Target.
Tank - Tank
BMP - BMP/IFV.
APC - Anything armoured below a tank in the pecking order of things, ie, Recce vehicles, APC's etc.
Transport - Sodt skinned vehicles of any kind.
Heli - Rotary winged aircraft.

3.Executive Order.
Fire - Shoot thet baddy.
Wait - Hang on till i say Fire

There are a few other but those are the basics.

So an example of a Fire Order could be something like.

"HESH, BMP, FIRE"
or
FIN, TANK, FIRE
or
COAX, MEN, FIRE

Whilst the commender is laying the gunner onto the rough area of the target the gunner acquires the target in his sight picture and states "ON"
He then carries out the engagement provided the commander has said "FIRE" at the end of his Fire Order.

The only difference with the gunner carrying out his own engagement is he carries out all the vocals himself to inform the commader of what is happening should he be doing something else.

Target acquisition is obviously the tricky bit in PR, but there are ways to simplify it. The same can be done on PR as can be done IRL, whereby one crewman scans in high magnification and one scans in low magnification, from left to right so your arcs constantly cross one another and eliminating blind spots where possible.

The guy on the roof in the game is very useful not only for area defence but for helping acquire targets.

References in the game are easily given using the compass at the bottom as you are all on the same vehicle with the same directions. But the gun and hull can also be used as a quick reference. The hull is good for the clock-ray method so for exapmple "1 oclock of the hull" lets people know instantly where to look. With regards to the gun it is a learned skill but to give 1/4, 1/2 and 3/4 left and right references from the position of the gun are very fast and generally accurate and i will come up with a picture later as a picture paints a thousand words

We always do well in armoured battles i expect a lot of it is second nature but it also helps to try and practice with the same guys in the same jobs all the time, this speeds things up and improves reaction times massively. You also get to know how each other thinks which helps even more.

Hope its useful.

Undies I have to go in a tank with you sometime!