Project Reality Forums

i cant even really talk about how gross the G3 is in this game, it really shows that this new deviation and cone of fire type of game are like oil and water

VipersGhost wrote:I did that with Rico...didn't fraps it but he and I were taking screenshots while the shooter was shooting. The patterns were just like what you see here.

What I really want to do is have Rico go run out there as a medic and stand while I shoot him at 200-300yds as he heals himself. Nothing better than a live target. Either way I'm convinced about what I've seen and it works in-game for me at least.

A good fraps video would sure help alot of guys learn how to shoot in PR though I think.

Yeah, it's just that there's only 4-5 bullets in each screen so unless the farthest one from the center is the farthest one from the center that you shot, it's not really showing an accurate range of the deviation. I also just realized that it's kinda hard to get a perspective on how far apart the shots actually are really need some zoomed out screens so you can see how small those rectangles are.

The bullet holes disappear after a little bit so if you are shooting slow enough for good accuracy you won't get many bullet holes. Nedlands #'s show them as having the same deviation except for the G3...so it's kind of a collective (don't be so picky, shit how much do you need to see? lol). I also know that its hard to get a feel for the size of the pattern due to being zoomed in. I attached a photo of exactly what I was shooting at but still hard to tell I think....the deviations are more to show you how relative they are to each other. Eitherway nothings perfect but it should give a good idea that yes at a 100m's it's quite easy to hit a stationary target in the center mass even with the G3 *GASP*.


][/URL]

Much obliged *tips hat*.

NickO wrote:
The whole reason for having a 7.62 × 51 mm round is for ACCURACY.

One of the main reasons they even started looking at a smaller caliber round in the first place(ended up as the 5.56) was to increase practical accuracy - less recoil, flatter shooting. I don't see why a G3 would be inherently more accurate than an M16 series weapon.

And Johnny and others - shorter barrels down to a point are inherently more accurate, not less, being stiffer, although not by any amount the average shooter is likely to notice. They do of course give you less velocity and often a lousy sight radius.

I just played my first round of this tonight - one hour long. No issues adapting to the mod; everthing I shot at died, from 2m to half way across the city. If it doesn't die, shoot it some more.

Devs - good work.

boltcatch wrote:And Johnny and others - shorter barrels down to a point are inherently more accurate, not less, being stiffer, although not by any amount the average shooter is likely to notice. They do of course give you less velocity and often a lousy sight radius.

I'm fairly sure that is true if you take barrels of the same OD. However, I believe that in real life, they tend to beef up the OD with barrel length to prevent just that.

To clarify: OD = outer diameter not overdose in this context

EDIT: Boltcatch I think the reason the G3A3 could be considered a more accurate rifle is because of tight German tolerances. Not sure how much of a difference there would be between an M16A4 and a G3A3 though. The G3A3 is also the basis for the PSG-1 and MSG-90 sniper rifles so to begin with it must have been inherently accurate.

I looked for about 5 mins and couldn't find any basic google info on a standard mass produced G3A3's MOA. From some of the stuff out there it seems that the G3 is indeed quite accurate. It's limitations seem to be that it and it's ammo are much heavier than 5.56 variants...also the great recoil that it has. It might not be a bad idea to give the G3 the same accuracy as the M16/L85 and leave it's recoil as it is.

I also think the ironsites should have their recoil set down to the same level as their scoped counter-parts. It's not like people are destroying everyone with Iron-sites...on the contrary they could use a small boost in popularity. As of now the scoped versions have 60% of the recoil that ironsites do. If the scoped recoil seems to much I say lower the ironsites and make them equal to the scoped versions.

This is pretty interesting reading. I am aware of the skill of those posting test results, as they have proven in the past their mathematics knowledge and ability to locate accurate reference data.

I stopped playing this game for a few months, and just came back yesterday when I read 0.7 was finally out. I am coming back to find a lot of wonderful updates, and look foward to seeing more as usual.

In regards to this topic and the last few posts, the G3 series are actually pretty accurate rifles. I like the feel of the weapons, although they do take some getting the hang of when you are used to M16/M4 models. They also have a little more recoil than that of an M16. But firing the weapons in semi-automatic had good results, what I would say is about equal to the M16. At distance (250-350m) I felt I was not as accurate with the G3 as I was with the M16, but that could be because of limited experience with the iron sights. I have used the MP5 series quite a bit while working with LE, but usually used some form of optics with those weapons.

When firing the G3 variants in automatic mode, the whole story changes though. As an AR I am perfectly used to operating LMG's and heavier weapons, but for a battle rifle the G3 had a bit of kick to it that caused more muzzle flip. It reminded me of the AK variants. I would only recommend auto mode with a G3 if in a CQB environment or if you were engaging light vehicles or air units. Rapid semi-automatic fire seemed better suited for suppressive fire, as it kept more rounds near the target area thereby better keeping them pinned.

Overall, I'd say that in real life the G3 in semi mode will be slightly LESS accurate than a 5.56mm or similar caliber weapon. In PR it should be the same, but I have yet to test it myself as I have had limited play time since installing the latest update.

Ninja the G3 is a bit less accurate in-game than the 5.56 family. I don't have any experience with the gun nor can I find any definitive results other than most seem to agree that it's accuracy is pretty on par with the M16 if not better (a few thought so). I have yet to see, on the shooter forums, someone argue that the G3 is an inaccurate gun and those guys argue EVERYTHING. If you have any experience pls elaborate on it.

I made a quick video of running G3 full auto kills
YouTube - Heckler & Koch G3 Top Gun

nedlands1 wrote: The G3A3 is also the basis for the PSG-1 and MSG-90 sniper rifles so to begin with it must have been inherently accurate.

Be very carefull here. The PSG-1 is considerably different from a G3. Most of it's internals have been hand tooled for tighter tolerances, has a heavier barrel and normally fires handloads custom tailored for greater accuracy.

nedlands1 wrote:I'm fairly sure that is true if you take barrels of the same OD. However, I believe that in real life, they tend to beef up the OD with barrel length to prevent just that.

To clarify: OD = outer diameter not overdose in this context

EDIT: Boltcatch I think the reason the G3A3 could be considered a more accurate rifle is because of tight German tolerances. Not sure how much of a difference there would be between an M16A4 and a G3A3 though. The G3A3 is also the basis for the PSG-1 and MSG-90 sniper rifles so to begin with it must have been inherently accurate.

True, but if you're not starting with a thinner barrel on the short weapon to begin with, you're probably not going to beef up that longer barrel enough to have any sort of advantage. The difference in practical accuracy is mostly an issue of sight radius and the fact that shorter weapons tend to be zeroed for shorter ranges (50yard-200m zero, etc.)

Between the M16 and G3, I would not expect to see any advantage for the .308 round (wind aside) until 600 yards or so. Also, look at what weapons dominate the service rifle matches - AR-15's; tight American tolerances can be just as good as "tight German tolerances". For practical accuracy, the flatter trajectory of the 5.56mm really helps at typical distances; the G3 may be just as mechanically capable, but the shooter will probably not be as effective at dealing with the rainbow-trajectory (which is even more of a problem on the 7.62x39mm AK type weapons; I know, I ditched my AKM clone for AR's for exactly that reason)

It is my understanding that by modern standards, the PSG-1 is not outstandingly accurate compared to other weapons of similar weight (let alone cost).

Sabre_tooth_tigger wrote:I made a quick video of running G3 full auto kills
YouTube - Heckler & Koch G3 Top Gun

You needed an entire mag to wound or kill one guy and you were firing unsighted. If your sights were up, you'd be shooting the sky after 3 rounds and the guy would just headshot you on spot, like one of them did at the end.

The vid is just a tongue in cheek thing to show the G3 nor the accuracy changes make guns impossible to use (even when you go full auto and play the top gun soundtrack loudly)
Using sights at 10 feet distance would not be good for any gun in game or real life?

Firing full auto has you looking at the sky even sighted/right click,etc, if you dont correct the recoil.
I think its just the auto rifleman gun that has the noticable decrease in recoil if you look down the barrel

I dont advise firing full auto unless making your own cheesy video, I might try making a single shot cqb vid I guess.
The framerate when recording those kills went as low as 12fps though I might have found a better recording program now

VipersGhost wrote:Ninja the G3 is a bit less accurate in-game than the 5.56 family. I don't have any experience with the gun nor can I find any definitive results other than most seem to agree that it's accuracy is pretty on par with the M16 if not better (a few thought so). I have yet to see, on the shooter forums, someone argue that the G3 is an inaccurate gun and those guys argue EVERYTHING. If you have any experience pls elaborate on it.

I would have to say that the H&K G3 is actually a pretty accurate gun in semi-auto. Once you start playing with that selector switch you are bringing accuracy down a notch. This is going to happen with any .30-caliber weapon. But compared to most other automatic weapons in 7.62x51mm, I would have to say the G3 and all similar variants are top of the line. AR-10's aren't bad, but I have to say the G3 is slightly more accurate in my opinion. I prefer the AR-style sights over the HK sights, but that is only because I have been using AR irons for a lot longer. I used to own a G3 for a while but had to sell it when I moved. The only time I used auto was on the range at the end of the day, where I'd light off a few mags and then let the purple ***** cool off on the way home. Amazingly, I never once had a single stoppage in that rifle. Ever.

Regarding the PSG-1, it is a pretty damn accurate rifle for being a semi. There is no semi in the world that can compare to a bolt, and yes the PSG-1 is slightly heavier than a bolt. That is common sense. But of all the semi-autos I have fired, it ranks #1 with me for precision and reliability. If I didn't need to buy a new car right now, I'd probably be getting one of those instead.

Slightly off topic, but if anyone sees a pre-86 M249 available let me know. I'd gladly sell a kidney on the black market to buy one.

One of them I think I missed completely first try The rest of them died in 20 bullets or less

Again, with G3 use single shot even at close range. Full auto was for comedy, demonstration. I thought it would be funny to show the worst gun used in the worst way and still getting kills

Ninja2dan wrote:I would have to say that the H&K G3 is actually a pretty accurate gun in semi-auto. Once you start playing with that selector switch you are bringing accuracy down a notch. This is going to happen with any .30-caliber weapon. But compared to most other automatic weapons in 7.62x51mm, I would have to say the G3 and all similar variants are top of the line. AR-10's aren't bad, but I have to say the G3 is slightly more accurate in my opinion. I prefer the AR-style sights over the HK sights, but that is only because I have been using AR irons for a lot longer. I used to own a G3 for a while but had to sell it when I moved. The only time I used auto was on the range at the end of the day, where I'd light off a few mags and then let the purple ***** cool off on the way home. Amazingly, I never once had a single stoppage in that rifle. Ever.

I like the direction the guns are going but I really hope the continue to be tweaked. I'd like to see the G3's accuracy on par with the M16. Then it'd be a recoil vs damage thing.

Yea, sounds good.