Project Reality Forums

Grim1316 wrote: 4-Specialized Officer kit uses the old spec ops carbines in place of the scoped variant that the officer kit has. Also would cost tickets if the commander is killed(similar to what a cell leader kit costs in INS)(This would also be needed to use the map, the same way the officer kit is needed now).

As for the last one, I suggested it because if they are "zeroed" to the same distance as the old spec ops guns, they would have to be rather close to the enemy to actually hit them. Thus really make people think before charging into battle when playing as the commander.

dude we already talked on the Binoculars idea and com/ro would have those laser targ bins so i think ure idea is silly also the idead of havin to be ion command truck to use air sup/mortars whatevea the air attack stuff is silly we need to make FB more of a defend or dont build idea like eithewr allowing commander norm functions in one or having commander /ro squad unable to respawn anywhere else. |PPl often say o commander needs to have more or be able to see more well if he was in a FB or in a chopper or on a high rise he could see more!

Did you not even read what that said, it would be a specialized officer kit, The only difference between the kit I suggested would be that instead of a scoped rifle, they would get the old Spec Ops kit Carbines. It would be iron sighted and zeroed to I think it was like 250M. Which would force them to use it only as a self defense weapon and make them think twice about being right on the front line.

Well to be fair your idea isn't necessarily perfect either. How would you decided what squad is the Commanders squad? afaik you cant be a squad leader and the commander at the same time, so there is no way he could have his own squad.

My ideas allow people who like to sit in the box(yes there are people who like the current system) to sit in the box, with out forcing them to be in the field. All the box represents is the aides running around the main base passing information around and getting support lined up.

The truck idea would be like a police officers car. It would have a better radio then the one he would have on his back, and would allow him better use of his laptop. Same Idea would go with only being able to call in the strikes, or laying lasers down on the map in the box. The Command Center would have the best radios to contact both fire support(artillery and aircraft) and Infantry on the ground.

Grim1316 wrote:Did you not even read what that said, .

appologies i didnt understand wh t uwere trying to say as i was pissed accept my apologies, no Drama on this thread ok re reading it now

some good points mad3e grim er.. commander would have to a specialist kit onmly requestable from the command centre i guess?! tru enuff we dont want to go to far outta the box (pun) so to speak some ppl like the sittin in box system, the whole radio thing is confusing me cuz if he got voip he can talk to all SL anyway.. bear with me ... so the radio just rrepresents his ability to communicate with all SL's and the laptop represents his ability to acess info intell sats whatever. So would u have it that the commad trailer of FB's allow call in of mortars etc but when comander is on foot he cannot? I liked ure idea about the gun zero'd i think if commy had a pistol he mite get stuck into close combat which is bad so props grim 4 that.
Personally i do not like the idea of a special command truck/apc/whatever i need more convincing but i can see the idea behind it, need more convincing of its merits as oposed to the conventinal Command trailer which is allredy in all bases. Morre options in FB's or Command Trailer is a cool idea like i said.

to sumarise:
-commander/ro voip to all sqauad leaders is rep. by radio pack
-acess to intel rep by use of laptop already detailed as havin load delay and blood mist if injured
-gun is old spec ops' carrbine sighted and zeroed to 250M, to avoid pistol gungho ness
-Command Trailer and Firebase allow Call in of mortars or Aircraft (like that huh) mortars able every 30mins in one single or 3 small barrages?! Make squads able to be given rewards for followin orders?
-commander option done away with in menu and commander/ro kit available ONLY from command trailer
-Commander/RO is a specialised officer kit

as you can see a very real idea is coming togetha, which is not a great leap into the dark and allows for greater flexability for commander more fun situational awarness , most IMPORTANTLY not a huge degree of re modelling. You can sit in ure box or go out i like it.

"imagine gettin in a BH flying over the battlerfield coming back to base and starting ure orders. "

i agree with everything he just said (aww i couldnt find the futurama pic)

I got an idea that might not seem very realistic in 2009 with Gps systems and long range radios but ill explain it anyway.

What if these things put out a radio signal in a certain radius depending on the strengt of the signal

Squad leader (low signal)
Commander (medium Signal
Vehicle (medium Signal)
Commander Vehicle (strong Signal)
Fire Base (Strong Signal)
Main base ( Strong signal)

Now lets say Squad leader 1 is alone in A1 with his squad, and SL2 is maybe 300 meters away. Then SL1 can only see his squad mates + sl2 and his mates on the map, but everyone else won't be on the map because its only sl2 that is in range of his radio signal.

any requests made for the map like Resupply/apc/helicopter will only be visible to SL2 untill radio contact is reached by a FB or commander or Main base signal.

The commander vehicle will have a Strong signal to cover alot of Field.


Ofcourse you could say that people using teamspeak/mumble...normal chat...whatever would be able to bypass this and still tell where they are ect when they are "off the grid"... but it would be exausting explaining your every single move in chat or voice when you could just setup a decent radio signal and be displayed on the map real time.

As a SL why would you bother keeping up the Signal? well maybe you woudnt care much about it if you where just gonna sweap the place alone with 5 men but.... if you suddendly need an extration or supply you coud'nt call it (technicaly perhaps your map woul'nd be able to open to see your location so you could'nt just type your loc down.)

As a commander you would have to have a full scale view of your soldiers to make the right decisions so you had to put up FB and place yourself in a good spot to chain link the signals.

As a pilot you could patrol the area and use your helicopter or whatever as a radar to locate separated troops.

If you abonden your vehicle you lose the medium signal from it so there is more reasons to have any vehicle in the field and not just leaving it in case you need backup.

If a squadleader die or is critical wounded then his signal is gone making his squad go off the grid untill he is back up with his officers kit.



The distances on these maps would never make it possible for realitic radio distances....but for the purpose of teamwork and to magnify the importance of good communication i think it could be justified.

I don't know if its even possible to create this senario but i suppose every SL, Vehicle, Base, commander would put of a UAV kind of beacon (not an animated beacon though, or perhaps a light version that dose'nt interfere too much with map details)

Also the commander would be unable to issue orders to squad leaders "off the grid"

That sounds good enough that I just know it's hardcoded.
You should be able to limit SL abilities to build based on CO's proximity since scoring works like that anyway.
But I know I sound like a broken record here but the commander's job, IMHO, is to formulate, communicate and manage strategy.
It is not to to stay busy bombing things.
More arty is a great idea, but it would be better, engine permitting, to link arty to flags / FOB; ie: the more you have the quicker the recharge time on the Arty.
So the increased benefit comes with an increased vulnerability.
Bigger rock
thicker paper
sharper scissors

UntenablePosition wrote:That sounds good enough that I just know it's hardcoded.
You should be able to limit SL abilities to build based on CO's proximity since scoring works like that anyway.
But I know I sound like a broken record here but the commander's job, IMHO, is to formulate, communicate and manage strategy.
It is not to to stay busy bombing things.
More arty is a great idea, but it would be better, engine permitting, to link arty to flags / FOB; ie: the more you have the quicker the recharge time on the Arty.
So the increased benefit comes with an increased vulnerability.
Bigger rock
thicker paper
sharper scissors

i like very much the idea of linking commander to flags or FOB in any ways possible i like to keep thuis thread simple guyus no mega hardcore complex recodes for the developers, i very myuch want a ciommander that is encouraged to go to FOB's etc. i AM NOT IN AGREMENT OF THOS WHO WANT THE COMMANDER TO BE AN ARTY SPAMMER. He shud be cordinating the troops allowing better comunications between squads and have a strong visual prescence. Please read back if yo u are interested in a semi formulated plan me an wolf and grim cooked up. Remember guys we want to remember most of the sytem is hardcoded and we dont want to make it a NIGHTMARE to implement for the busy coders etc thanks

I have some assumptions when thinking about this and I would like to fact check them.

1. Arty can be called at almost any interval the DEVs want.

2. Scoring is still based on physical proximity as regards the COs score.

3. Objects ie: FOB/Bunker, can be linked to access to Arty.

If any of these are incorrect or inaccurate, please let me know.

The very first rework that should be done with the Commander is it should be renamed something else than Commander. Role of Commander fits well in clan oriented game play because of the nature of private clan organization, but the game itself is voluntary based for free audience and always will be and there just isn't any way to overcome it.

You can give "Commander" different kind of roles like intelligence, co-ordination, fire support, logistics etc. but please don't imagine that the "Commander" could ever be leading people in game environment like it is done in real military organizations. You could get close to it with complex and hierarchic reward, obligation and punishment system but there isn't any such system in PR and very likely will not be in the near future, if ever. Even vanilla BF2 had better way to select Commanders with global ranking system, and they didn't got much power to mess with your team.

The word Commander just gives misleading connotation about what actually can be done at the present status. Maybe something like "Headquarters" could describe it more broadly and wouldn't be such person oriented and definite.

IMO the point of giving the commander a UAV is the best way to get more commanders. Not a UAV as in vbf2 but a kind of smal airplane that the commander can control and see through so he has to identifies enemy soldiers from friendlies and make his plan's based on that. The great benefit of this system is that you have more commanders and that is beater than how it now is with almost none commanders.

fubar++ wrote:The very first rework that should be done with the Commander is it should be renamed something else than Commander.
as previously suggested the role of radio operator calling in logistics from a hand held laptop presenting a larger than average target to enemy to discourage gungho this RO or FIELD CO could be much closer to action
which fits with the previously stated fact check prox. to action scoring

You can give "Commander" different kind of roles like intelligence, co-ordination, fire support, logistics etc. but please don't imagine that the "Commander" could ever be leading people in game environment like it is done in real military organizations. Even vanilla BF2 had better way to select Commanders
i couldnt agree more, i want to see a more active commander with ability to call in aircraft, scoped rifle and really controling the FB's

The word Commander just gives misleading connotation about what actually can be done at the present status. Maybe something like "Headquarters" could describe it more broadly and wouldn't be such person oriented and definite.

whilst i would prefer to see the changes highlighted previously in the thread HEAD QUARTERS really does define the current role of commander better , but do you hear someone saying so what? thanks guys will repopst idea for all lazies to see

commander would have to a specialist kit onmly requestable from the command centre i guess?! tru enuff we dont want to go to far outta the box (pun) so to speak some ppl like the sittin in box system, the whole radio thing is confusing me cuz if he got voip he can talk to all SL anyway.. bear with me ... so the radio just rrepresents his ability to communicate with all SL's and the laptop represents his ability to acess info intell sats whatever. So would u have it that the commad trailer of FB's allow call in of mortars etc but when comander is on foot he cannot? I liked ure idea about the gun zero'd i think if commy had a pistol he mite get stuck into close combat which is bad so props grim 4 that.
Personally i do not like the idea of a special command truck/apc/whatever i need more convincing but i can see the idea behind it, need more convincing of its merits as oposed to the conventinal Command trailer which is allredy in all bases. Morre options in FB's or Command Trailer is a cool idea like i said.

to sumarise:
-commander/ro voip to all sqauad leaders is rep. by radio pack
-acess to intel rep by use of laptop already detailed as havin load delay and blood mist if injured
-gun is old spec ops' carrbine sighted and zeroed to 250M, to avoid pistol gungho ness
-Command Trailer and Firebase allow Call in of mortars or Aircraft (like that huh) mortars able every 30mins in one single or 3 small barrages?! Make squads able to be given rewards for followin orders?
-commander option done away with in menu and commander/ro kit available ONLY from command trailer
-Commander/RO is a specialised officer kit
as you can see a very real idea is coming togetha, which is not a great leap into the dark and allows for greater flexability for commander more fun situational awarness , most IMPORTANTLY not a huge degree of re modelling. You can sit in ure box or go out i like it.

"imagine gettin in a BH flying over the battlerfield coming back to base and starting ure orders. "

I also like sgt.maj.kruders idea

"Best thing would be commander flying the UAV and looking down with a guncam.UAV should be really slow though,and a bit big so its an easy target with few hitpoints with 20 min respawn."

Also inrease the Mortar/JDAM strike respawn timers.

please help contribute

Some good ideas there but I would take issue with one of them.
The UAV should not be low and easy to hit as I do not think it is IRL.
I would like to see the respawn time be linked to the amount of FOB so there is an additional reason to protect them.
I know this idea goes beyond the box and into coding but what about jamming ?
It is an integral part of the modern battlefield and the more the CO is made necessary the more important clear comms become.
I doubt if you could simulate any kind of jamming on the VIOP but you could make it so the jamming delayed or stopped mortar strikes/JDAMS.
The jammer would require a new model ( perhaps the old bunker as a placeholder ) and it would have to be placed within a certain distance from an enemy FOB to work.
Perhaps using a HMMV to place special crates and ONLY a Combat Engineer could build it.
OR maybe I am reaching too far for the engine.


I am not aware of anything in the game that limits the other team's abilities so it could be hardcoded

Taken below from Wiki about Headquarters, Military Headquarters (Headquarters - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) may give you some kind of impression what the "Commander" role should be, and how it can vary. You could for instance design different type of Command Posts / Headquarters on different type of maps. You just don't need stick with the idea of one person whose sole purpose is giving orders and leading the battle, it can be moreover co-ordination, sharing information and so on...

Military headquarters take many forms depending on the size and nature of the formation they command. Typically however they fall into the Tac, Main and Rear types (particularly within NATO).

The tac (short for tactical) headquarters is a small collection of staff and communicators. Usually very mobile, they exist to allow the Commander to get forward in an operations and command the key parts of it from a position where they can see the ground and influence their immediate subordinates.

The main headquarters is far less mobile and is often involved in both the planning and execution of operations. There are a number of staff assembled here from various staff branches to advise the Commander and control the various aspects of planning or the conduct of discreet operations. A main headquarters will usually have a Chief of Staff who coordinates the staff effort.

The rear headquarters is some distance from the battle or front line in conventional operations, its function is to ensure the logistical support to front line troops, it does this by providing medical, material, equipment & combat supplies by vehicle to where they are most needed.

Usually very mobile, they exist to allow the Commander to get forward in an operations and command the key parts of it from a position where they can see the ground and influence their immediate subordinates

dude and what we have the problem with in PR is we need to Strictly Define the Command role, is he TAC is he field commander is he rear wtf is the commander, we need as it seems to crop up endlessly DEFINE HIS ROLE give him a name that signifys his duties not commander as it is toatally unreal to assume on man is in TOTAL command of a 32 ma\n army, is he a forward commander incontact with some unseen rear base in which case he is TAC or is he supreme commander of a warzone wtf is he DEBATE NEED!

i vote we make commander a form of TAC thanks for lookin into it

I think he is in the Main HQ.
I agree that we should either move him to TAC or give the option to move.
I think the rear HQ would be a tournement / scrimmage CO as he or she would spend time out of the game ( ie: away from the FEB) to prepare a plan etc.

I agree that often the CO is not actually in charge of anything, but it is not always the case.
If you can get 70-80% of the squads following orders you are in charge and commanding.
The slot may be limited in certain ways but you are not an intel co-ordinator or a logistics manager.
You command the team, for better or worse.
Playing under a different screen name, with no VIOP in the CO slot for some strange reason, I still led a team to victory because I commanded, not just relayed info or sent trucks.
Some of the squads were less then happy with me and were more than willing to share that opinion but in the end, they did as I asked and we won.
Would we have won w/o a CO ?
I don't know because the squads that did the really hard work knew what needed to be done anyway but I like to think the CO provided that little extra intel and coordination that allowed a squeak by victory.
I think that proves that the Commander is in charge and that having someone in charge is part of the game and regardless of what changes the CO slot undergoes, he or she should remain as the commander.

It's a matter of opinion should the Commander remain as it is and just adjust the features it possess, or completely re-think what actually is the reason why it doesn't work. Some individuals, like you, may carry out the Commander task with something between excellent and average performance, but the reality in Project Reality is that the post is often led by incompetent "try-outs" or even worst just abused. Would the small changes fix the issue, I have my doubts, as stated before. The reality and the game are just too much apart and at the present state the difference could not be solved.

I understand what you are saying and I support a change in the CO abilities, but I don't think we need to remove the commander as a function, rather make it more useful and user-friendly.
But TY for grading me above average