Project Reality Forums

I love hovering choppers Takes about 3 seconds with deployed HAT for deviation to settle and give me 2 more to reach the target So if you are hovering longer than that - you doing it wrong especially in the hot zone. I mean whats next? The sharks with laser beams attached to their freaking heads to help you spot approaching boats and apc's in the water. lol All attack choppers never hover over the combat zone.

Herbiie wrote:OR just after 300 feet the rocket propelling it stops and it falls to the ground.

then peaple will just use that to hide behind a wall and shoot at the other team, becuase if it just falls to the ground, they can aim at a large angle, and it can fly up 300 feet, then boom, it falls somewhere in the area surounding

Herbiie wrote:The reason AA missiles are detected is because of the IR lock on is detectable through Photo-transistors.

OK I don't think you're understanding how an IR-guided missile works...

Most modern helicopters have systems which will detect the launch of any type of missile, guided or not. So it's perfectly plausible that a chopper can detect the launch of a HAT or LAT missile.

I would like to see this implemented. But then again, the whole air system in PR is a bit messed up atm, like Alex says for a start the ranges of various weapons need scaling down.

Stu.

Many of you are reasserting the same point.

That a helicopter can detect missile launches. And this is the problem. What most people think of when they think of warning siren is the tone you are given when your aircraft is painted by a Radar or IR signature. Meaning that something is tracking the aircraft. Another system will detect the launch of a missile, these two systems put together are what help pilots to be able to avoid getting blasted out of the sky.

However, a HAT has no Radar or IR signature so nothing for the aircraft to track and detect a launch from. Even if it could detect the launch which may be possible given the right electronics package, it would be able to detect launch and launch alone, and therefore useless since the buzzer would be going off whenever a missile is launch whether a threat or not.

stealth420 wrote:I have used all CAS tactics on muttrah , From coming in at 500 Altitude, popping flares when i reach 250 all the way thru the CAS run , Which works out great just like you. But what im talkin bout is when you need to stay on station , Example When the whole MEC team is overrunning West City and your team needs multiple hit in a short amount of time. A good way to achieve this is to use the mountains on the east side of the map as cover. This is when the HAT problem arises . Even 20 seconds of hovering still so your gunner can scan will get you blown up by a HAT. This is why we need warning sirens.

Your team might need maky kills fast. But that doesn't jusify a hovering Cobra.
At least fly around in a circle and you won't have that much of a HAT problem, just an AA one.

StuTika wrote:OK I don't think you're understanding how an IR-guided missile works...

Most modern helicopters have systems which will detect the launch of any type of missile, guided or not. So it's perfectly plausible that a chopper can detect the launch of a HAT or LAT missile.

I would like to see this implemented. But then again, the whole air system in PR is a bit messed up atm, like Alex says for a start the ranges of various weapons need scaling down.

Stu.

Trust me - IR lock ons are detected via Photo transistors

Part of the problem here is that the Eryx is super maneuverable. I've made some truly absurd shots with it, shots that by all rights should have missed. In most of these cases, the pilot wasn't hovering, or even flying in a straight line, I was just able to track them with the missile because of how fast it turns.

[R-MOD]Thermis wrote:Many of you are reasserting the same point.

That a helicopter can detect missile launches. And this is the problem. What most people think of when they think of warning siren is the tone you are given when your aircraft is painted by a Radar or IR signature. Meaning that something is tracking the aircraft. Another system will detect the launch of a missile, these two systems put together are what help pilots to be able to avoid getting blasted out of the sky.

However, a HAT has no Radar or IR signature so nothing for the aircraft to track and detect a launch from. Even if it could detect the launch which may be possible given the right electronics package, it would be able to detect launch and launch alone, and therefore useless since the buzzer would be going off whenever a missile is launch whether a threat or not.

What he said =D

[R-MOD]Thermis wrote:Many of you are reasserting the same point.

That a helicopter can detect missile launches. And this is the problem. What most people think of when they think of warning siren is the tone you are given when your aircraft is painted by a Radar or IR signature.

Painted by a IR signature?

IR missiles lock on to the IR light (heat) that emits from the exhaust from the engine(s) of the aircraft, there is no need to illuminate it with anything (unlike radar guided missiles).
Theres no way of knowing if someone is pointing a IR missile launcher at you until its launched.

[R-MOD]Thermis wrote:However, a HAT has no Radar or IR signature so nothing for the aircraft to track and detect a launch from.

A HAT missile has just as much a IR signature as a radar or IR guided missile, all of them have a rocket engine on the back spewing out hot exhaust, this is what the system detects.

then there are other missile detection systems which instead of looking for the heat from the missiles engine, uses radar to detect all objects closing in on the aircraft.


Question is, even if the cobra pilot would know of the HAT launch that just occurred 400 meters below him, would he have enough time to react?

The SRAW has two modes of operation: Direct Attack and Top Attack.

DA is unguided.. Like an RPG.

TA is computer guided, and is similar to the Javelin's TA mode,

Both modes have a range of 17-600m.

The SRAW should be altered to reflect this, though it is unlikely..

-REad

[R-CON]ReadMenace wrote:The SRAW has two modes of operation: Direct Attack and Top Attack.

DA is unguided.. Like an RPG.

TA is computer guided, and is similar to the Javelin's TA mode,

Both modes have a range of 17-600m.

The SRAW should be altered to reflect this, though it is unlikely..

-REad

both modes are guided...

direct attack means the rocket collides with the target, like if you want to hit a window or a door or something.


the top attack means the rocket flies just above the target and fires its two warheads down on the top of the tank where the armor is the weakest.
But unlike the javelin which flies up and then dives down, it flies straight and above the target and its two warheads are pointed down towards the ground and are fired when the rocket detects that it is above the tank.

as you can see here, the missile is above the target when it detonates:

Cp wrote:Painted by a IR signature?

IR missiles lock on to the IR light (heat) that emits from the exhaust from the engine(s) of the aircraft, there is no need to illuminate it with anything (unlike radar guided missiles).
Theres no way of knowing if someone is pointing a IR missile launcher at you until its launched.



A HAT missile has just as much a IR signature as a radar or IR guided missile, all of them have a rocket engine on the back spewing out hot exhaust, this is what the system detects.

then there are other missile detection systems which instead of looking for the heat from the missiles engine, uses radar to detect all objects closing in on the aircraft.


Question is, even if the cobra pilot would know of the HAT launch that just occurred 400 meters below him, would he have enough time to react?

This all depends on the electronic warfare package that is installed on the aircraft. There is no one case fits all for aircraft. My sources, Jane's and the wealth of military manuals I have at my finger tips, lead me to believe from some short reading that a Cobra would not be able to detect a HAT launch as a threat.

Herbiie wrote:
It's almost impossible to detect a non-guided missile except through radar, and that'll be after it's fired and closing in fast - you'll die anyway. The reason AA missiles are detected is because of the IR lock on is detectable through Photo-transistors.

If thats the case then any attack helicopter should be able to lock onto a AA

Past couple of days ive been on muttrah 24 7 server,

Been hatted and Towed, about 3 or 4 times in the cobra, its hard to tell which one hits you.

Anyone else think a warning sirem for HATs and TOWs could be added. Please agree

The problem lies with the innefficiency with which helicopters are provided to engage targets at long range (which is their main tactic) in comparison to the ease of tracking and firing at one forced with ~600 meters maximum of your location, give or take a hundred meters depending on the map.

stealth420 wrote:Equip all choppers with a secondary warning for Anti tank Missiles

Times ive been hatted in cobra : over 50 times due to no warning system.

That's the noobest thang I've heard in a long time...

Lemme try to beat it!

How about, An alarm ring for the whole team when...

Someone laser your tank!

Wait even better

When an area attack is about to come down to rape you!

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Fun being made, On a serious note,

Listen to CP, he knows what he's talking about obviously.

Has to Helos being able to detect a launch, I say the hell with that. The helos can already do really unrealistic fast maneuvers (considering size of maps) and they would bail away from the scene before slow HAT reach target.

Now maybe if you make it realistic, and delay the detection by a couple priceless seconds (first launch sequence not being detected) this could work out in PR.

Although I would rather just tell you to learn how to hover a target properly from a distance Or how about teamplaying for once and waiting for your team to LASER your hellfires a TOW position or FB.

P.S: Owned x 50 lol

And by the way, you pilots already got to nerf the SA-7 to undeadly, only vehicle destroying **** as pilots and crew always have time to bail. I even hit a full huey with a HAT once, right inside, and the huey had time to take off again before crash landing 20m away. Pilot then ran back to the dead squad to revive everybody with med kit and cap flag. How "Realistic" is that.. lol

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McLuv wrote:The problem lies with the innefficiency with which helicopters are provided to engage targets at long range (which is their main tactic) in comparison to the ease of tracking and firing at one forced with ~600 meters maximum of your location, give or take a hundred meters depending on the map.

I'm sorry but a centimeter accurate laser target is more then fn efficient in my book for long range.

Cobra, Apache and Havoc all have choice Between laser guided or laser TARGETED missiles.

It's a shoot and forget at 1km away, WTH do you want more?!?! A magic bullet to assure the supremacy of slow moving, poorly armored, air targets that are helos?

FFS in Iraq now they shoot down Kiowas and helos with modified light mortars air bursting like AA flak.

I vote this should be locked, for re-suggestion and unrealistic.

Holy Necro Batman!!!

Really guys, only bring this stuff back up if you have something new to add to the discussion.