New base for Korrengal

[dtacs]

[quote=""'[R-COM"]HangMan;1297270']Current Korengal is a master piece imo. It is the only current map where you are guaranteed a good fire fight.[/quote]
Masterpiece? You call round the clock baserape a masterpiece? There are firefights, where it is an even balance of each side fighting eachother in a mixed environment, then there is one side who is sitting in hills shooting at spawning enemies. So no, it isn't a firefight.

As US Army if you have a weak team then you get pinned in the base and have to fight all game, sure you loose, but its actually a lot of fun defending that lump of rock

You aren't defending. Defending defines that there is something to lose, and something for the enemy to take. They are not taking anything, they are simply firing in and in and in to kill you. That is no objective, its genocide.

If you have a super leet team then you get intense fire fights at the caches like you did before. So really its a win win situation, as long as you think about the enjoyment factor of the gameplay as opposed to being solely focused on Winning.

When you are getting shot up at the main, what is there to focus on? There is the objective at hand to focus on, and considering you cannot even get to it/them alot of the time, I think Korengal is a total failure.

Tell me CodeRedFox, was it your intention to have the Taliban fire into the main constantly? The best choice now would be to change the gamemode by removing all the caches and the rest of the map. With respect, you completely failed with this map change IMO.

[quote="Bellator""]Let the talibunnies attack the main, that's good if you have a good squad defending main, because then you can accumilate kills, get intel and distract the talis while other squads take out the caches (which the talis are too complacent to defend all too frequently).[/quote]
Except for when this happens. Notice that there is a cache with only a tiny bit of its diamond showing. Later on in the game, another cache spawned there, we had to attack from 3 directions in an attempt to get up there (which we had to stage from our main surprise surprise, and the Taliban had C4'd/mined/claymored/nade trapped each one. What an awesome map!

[Gore]

Every map is a good map, it depends on the players. And if you don't like being raped, gtfo of main and go get some caches. And if they're too hard to get, you're not trying hard enough.

[USA-Forever932]

If you want to have realism in this map, then where are the Blufor air assets? Their 155mm howitzers, their mortar tubes? Also, where is the day/night cycle to provide the blufor with the cover to move? Also, I don't think that the blufor main is big enough to actually be considered realistic to the real thing which can house about 150 people assuming "Viper Company" is that large.

In the real Korengal, the US have access to all these weapons and more. Why don't we have them in this map if the terrain conditions for the US and Taliban are supposed to be realistically balanced towards the Taliban (as they should be in INS maps)? Since the USA has such difficulty establishing FOBs in this map because of the nearly impassable terrain and because the Taliban have magical flying crates all over the map which allow them to make hideouts. What you get is every attempt the Americans make struggling to gain a foothold or get map control anywhere on the map resulting in catastrophic failure. It is impossible for the Americans to maintain a FOB anywhere on this map because no matter where you go, the Taliban will have it surrounded from all sides. Your fobs will starve to death and survive.

Also, the Americans lack any sort of REAL logistics ability. If the entire American team gets all of the humvees and their logistics truck to make a major, combined attack using teamwork then they can only transport 17 people at a time. How can the Americans hope to work together when only half of their team can travel together and the rest must take the slow, monotonous walk from the main to the combat zone? Yes, there are ways out of the main, but are there ways to maintain sustained operations outside of the main base when the enemy team can just make some hideouts and throw themselves at you until you run out of troops?

[dtacs]

One logi truck.

So...yeahhhhhh....

[Ford_Jam]

Image

Hey, that was a good round for the Taliban

As for the US getting smashed, one logi is a bit ehhhh tbh.

I've always imagined a larger Korengal since I saw pictures from the real Korengal Valley, perhaps an extension to the current map out towards the northwestern direction and turn it into a 2km map. With the same dense bushes and forest, but where the terrain can flatten out a bit and give the US some breathing space.

That being said, I have no idea about map design or how to make a map, just a thought.

[Rudd]

I really want to try a new strategy when I get my internet fixed, the entire USA team immediately attacks the NE side of the map at the start of the game, after clearing 1 squad remains up there, 1 squad remains in main to provide fire support and the rest of the teams starts cache hunting,

the mountain squad, with one humvee, a firebase or two and hopefully plenty of advanced warnings from UAVs will then patroll west and east to prevent taliban gaining the high ground and camping the main base

preventing camping of the main base is very important on Korengal, because as hard as you try you are going to die sometimes, and sometimes you aren't going to get a rally poing down, so reinforcements need to have their path clear.

the logi truck is a problem, it is a bit of a deathtrap - hopefully there can be a safer alternative in the future such as a logi humvee or a logi stryker of some kind, my optimal alternative would be airdropped supplies, much like vbf2 however far less accurate.

[dtacs]

I really want to try a new strategy when I get my internet fixed, the entire USA team immediately attacks the NE side of the map at the start of the game, after clearing 1 squad remains up there, 1 squad remains in main to provide fire support and the rest of the teams starts cache hunting,

the mountain squad, with one humvee, a firebase or two and hopefully plenty of advanced warnings from UAVs will then patroll west and east to prevent taliban gaining the high ground and camping the main base

preventing camping of the main base is very important on Korengal, because as hard as you try you are going to die sometimes, and sometimes you aren't going to get a rally poing down, so reinforcements need to have their path clear.

the logi truck is a problem, it is a bit of a deathtrap - hopefully there can be a safer alternative in the future such as a logi humvee or a logi stryker of some kind, my optimal alternative would be airdropped supplies, much like vbf2 however far less accurate.

A good idea, but for the most part impossible due to the idiocy of many pub squads.

[Startrekern]

A good idea, but for the most part impossible due to the idiocy of many pub squads.

You cannot plan the game for what 'pub squads' will do.

That's stupid.

[snooggums]

I really want to try a new strategy when I get my internet fixed, the entire USA team immediately attacks the NE side of the map at the start of the game, after clearing 1 squad remains up there, 1 squad remains in main to provide fire support and the rest of the teams starts cache hunting,

Sweet, two wasted squads! If the Taliban simply hangs back they have the run of the map.

[Farks]

This is why insurgents shouldn't be allowed to baserape - it distracts everyone from playing insurgency like it should be played.

[Rudd]

Sweet, two wasted squads! If the Taliban simply hangs back they have the run of the map.

well one squad is able to support its team with fire and the other squad deny's area to the enemy, which also happens to be high gruond which is easy to defend and very hard to attack - which also protects the main.

fact is that Korengal is nearly a conventional vs Conventional map, each team has the full spectrum of requestable kits, going 1v1 on korengal is just down to player skill and a touch of luck, so you're gonna need to play differently, human blob doesn't work here, you don't have vehicular superiority, so its going to be about high ground and manouvre, so if you aren't controlling strategic areas such as the mountains to the NE it could bite you in the *** later.

At any rate, if the mountain squad has a humvee, they can move out and support quickly if that becomes necessary.

[bad_nade]

Masterpiece? You call round the clock baserape a masterpiece?

This video opened my eyes:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a2hnXgrnlUQ
(requires youtube account because of its ratings: L: Strong language, V+: Strongly violent or disturbing)

So round the clock baserape is indeed realistic, but due to game play reasons it would be nice to get out of the base sometimes

[CodeRedFox]

Tell me CodeRedFox, was it your intention to have the Taliban fire into the main constantly? The best choice now would be to change the gamemode by removing all the caches and the rest of the map. With respect, you completely failed with this map change IMO.

In short....yes. I wanted to make a map that was not fair, and clostly reflected the hardships of troops at the real location. Which is why it was update recently. The map was made to bring the idea of overpowered US outpost as every other US based map is the opposite. The whole argument of its can be mortared is lame thou. Its not like a constant stream of mortars. Also if you remember when the map first came out the PR rules were completely different. The Taliban had no rallies and no requestables. Gameplay was much different...it worked for the most part. But now the rules have changed and the map, like all 1km maps cant be play that same anymore.

And for the other questions.
Can the rules be changed for this map only? No, PR rules are whole game wide.
Can the map be pushed out to a 2km or 4km? No, the map would have to be redone from scratch with less detail.
Can you add a helicopter? No, it had one once and it didnt work.

Is insurgency the only choice for the map?
Now this is the question I have been thinking about. If I was to change this to say a random AAS it would be the only map of its kind and I'm not sure if it will float with the team. But I'm not sure I even want that.

Hopefully the changes in the next version will help out a bit. The introduction of two CROWS humvee will allow the protection at the outpost while being able to pick off snipers. And the US getting new spawn point at the beginning of the game might help out as well. As well as the Taliban spawns being spread out and removal of extra spawns.

Basically the major issue is PR rules dont work for 1km maps. Korengal being one of the only 1km map just because of the difficulties getting around. Its amazing how small the map is. Which is why I always advise against building them.

Maybe in the future I will come back and "Rhino" out a new version. But I have my hands full at the moment and can only change what I have to work with.

[snooggums]

You could always add in the forward outpost idea and make holding the location generate intel over time, giving a reason to be capture it as an option while not making it a requirement for the BluFor as they could let the Taliban hold it and gather intel the old fashioned way.

[Startrekern]

I always, always assumed it was 2KM. I didn't realize how small it was until recently. It definitely doesn't feel small, so brilliant work.

[snooggums]

Most people don't believe me when I tell them it is only 1km. Primarily because you need to walk about 3x the direct distance due to the terrain, which is my favorite part about the map as it makes using the terrain to one's advantage a viable option.

[CodeRedFox]

Its the main reason I wont un-naturally smooth out the ground. If you want to climb the hill I'm gonna make sure its a pain to do so.

[Kain888]

IMO this map is great. It's quite demanding when it comes to tactics and movement, yeah, but I find this to be a big advantage.

As it comes to baserape and stuff like that. You usually need just one 3-4 people squad to defend main and it's quite fine. Guys who defend can additionally cover a lot of map (plains) and support the rest of team. Worked well when I played it.

IMHO CodeRedFox the only thing you should consider about baserape is to make it more difficult for bomb cars to drive into center of main and explode wasting all assets and people there. Last time I played the map that bomb car was quite annoying and hard to prevent. Maybe just removing bomb cars on that map? What's the point of them there anyway?

[RHYS4190]

my vote is that the US pull out of the vally, and then nuke it.

[Startrekern]

If the map is ever retired..

Can we have an awesome nuke vid? On the valley?

<3