Project Reality Forums

Stones rock. That and my signature is all I have to say about lonewolfing.

Answer = VoIP

BF2 VoIP automatically attenuates all in-game sound and completely ruins your situational awareness. With 6 lads all using VoIP simultaneously you may as well all be deaf. If mumble was more widely used and VoIP was strictly limited to "squad radio" purposes I don't think squads would be getting caught off guard quite as much.

Hunt3r wrote:Well I was pretty much talking about a wolf pack I suppose. 3 pairs of people, working in close coordination, working towards a central objective, doing it the way they want to. It disperses your squad enough that nades are far less effective, there is less overhead needed to do the objectives, and you can sneak a good distance behind enemy lines and cause some real confusion.

But yeah, the idea here is to do what regular armies cannot do, and that is have people working in small groups to accomplish the goals, to ensure that you work more efficiently. Basically, you are trying to do spec ops. I realize that the PR goal isn't to have spec ops, but in reality, that's just what is effective. Spec ops to do disruption, with these groups massing on flags to cap, should achieve far more then large monolithic squads that are easily wiped out when you face an enemy that is elusive, quickly engaging, then running off, only to appear from an unexpected angle. You want to exploit the fact that you aren't slowed down by commanding and focusing on relaying information, but instead you are doing hit and run tactics to demoralise the enemy.

Sounds to me like what Green Berets do in real life.
Hit and run can fall under the category of Guerilla Warfare which is employed by many S.F. units as well.

Seriously if you like lonewolfing why not just play vBF2? I don't see the point of playing PR if you're not in it for the teamwork. It might be effective but it kinda takes out the point of the game.

[R-DEV]Jaymz wrote:Answer = VoIP

BF2 VoIP automatically attenuates all in-game sound and completely ruins your situational awareness. With 6 lads all using VoIP simultaneously you may as well all be deaf. If mumble was more widely used and VoIP was strictly limited to "squad radio" purposes I don't think squads would be getting caught off guard quite as much.

Indeed.

I can vouch for lone-wolfing raking in kills.
They're much harder to spot than a group, obviously, and more importantly, when you're lone-wolfing it feels like you've got more control on how you go about a situation. It's easier to think for yourself and do more complex attacks, like shooting one then running away (and most people will be dumb enough to just follow you) then attack from different directions, etc. I find that exerting this kind of control over your squad is pretty difficult, at least for me. They're quite far from impotent, really. It's just that if he doesn't kill everyone, the medic will still get his wounded squadmates up.
I don't get a lot of kills, but many of those that I do get are when I'm either alone or with 1 or 2 other people.

It also usually gives me a nice rush, when you're alone against a squad and especially when you get a few kills, you don't want your spree to end.

i find sometime the worst thing about lone-wolfing is why i don't play Call of Duty anymore. some fella will just jump out of a tree or spring up from a gutter n cap you. unless yer fighting insurgents, both sides know that there's no advantage lone-wolfing, thus anyone you see on the field will have squad mates with them. so there's no plucky fella ninja-ing you on his own.

unless you're up against Rambo, then that's fine. haha.

In my personal experiences, when I'm not wanted, I've excelled as a Lone Wolfer. All the squads were crappy on this one round of Muttrah, so I decided to grab a Scoped Rifleman and spawn at a firebase near the Mosque. Having heard of a major stronghold there, I managed to make my way there, eliminating 2 Rifleman on the way. I got in, killed another 15 people before being revealed and exposed thanks to teammates. I stood on the mosque roof playing king of the hill and taking fire from nearly all directions until my team came to secure the place. In my one death, we lost 2 Hueys, 2 squads worth of people, and a LAV-25 in pursuit of the Mosque and East City Objective.

TheOldBreed wrote:i find sometime the worst thing about lone-wolfing is why i don't play Call of Duty anymore. some fella will just jump out of a tree or spring up from a gutter n cap you. unless yer fighting insurgents, both sides know that there's no advantage lone-wolfing, thus anyone you see on the field will have squad mates with them. so there's no plucky fella ninja-ing you on his own.

unless you're up against Rambo, then that's fine. haha.

Trust me, it is so incredibly easy for a single rifleman to wipe out entire squads.

I simply don't understand the concept of large squads for fighting against other infantry and assaulting a firebase. You simply don't need 5 people covering you. Two scanning around, and carefully thinking and planning their actions will kill and disrupt the enemy far more then a full squad looking around, trying to stay together.

Once again, a wolf-pack squad as your primary infantry force, dedicated to offensive actions, disruption of the enemy, and causing chaos, with confusion, is a potent force. In defensive positions and capping flags, monolithic squads of infantry does make a lot of sense, but if you just corral in your the wolf-packs to stay in capzone, before they go off to once again assault the enemy, you'll really be quite successful.

I can certainly ninja entire squads because an entire squad walking around is simply far too conspicuous and too vulnerable to really be effective against guerrilla tactics. The only counter to guerrilla tactics is to stay mobile, and constantly be on the search for enemies, constantly checking enemies, and dispersing to keep the number of people in a given area to be relatively low.

PR is, quite simply, a game that I find far more enjoyable because you can really use some tactics, and there is much more coordination in the game. I do try to play alone or in pairs, but my objective in games where I do use such tactics is to go ahead of the infantry and soften up the defenses to make their assault easier. In HUGE maps designed for armor and air battles, this is completely irrelevant anyway and one should focus on large mechanized infantry squads that cap flags, with fast recon vehicles scouting for enemies.

Hunt3r wrote:Am I the only who has recently noticed that when you don't focus on squadleading, and just tell your squadmates to follow, and sometimes help you out, you get a huge increase in your KDR, points gotten, and objectives accomplished?

Or as a lone-wolf. I've managed to take out entire fortified firebases and two squads by lone-wolfing. I realize that PR is all about teamwork, but a single rifleman that plays it smart can seemingly take out many enemies.

Yup that about sums up .9 infantry tactics

PR=a twich based fps like all the rest now.Reaction speed over team work.But we can at least try to play like a team before one guy wipes our squad.

I got cut off from my squad once and pwned about 14 guys maybe more with a pkm on silent eagle once.It shouldnt be able to be done IMO.

I give my squads very loose orders. It's usually easy to get people you don't normally play with to be cooperative as long as you don't boss them around too much. I usually just circle my squad around through indirect routes and take objectives by surprise. My orders are usually just "hide", "attack", "follow me", "try to hold your fire", or "attack this target first".

Lone wolfing is fun. In older versions of PR I used to just go rally hunting by myself and take out whatever or who ever I could within reason. I'd raise some hell on those supply routes and it's always fun to kill a rally right as the enemy begins their assault. A few minutes later the firefight dies down because none of them could respawn close enough to the fight.

No you guys are all missing the point, dont you see what is being said here?

You are more combat efficient in smaller groups, so if you want to have a perfect balance, go for 4 man squads, if an entire team had 4 man squads it would be epic, and really it would be more realistic since in real life we have 4 man fireteams.

Go try this now!

Wicca wrote: You are more combat efficient in smaller groups

Incorrect. More squad members = more bullets = more dead or suppressed enemies.

so if you want to have a perfect balance, go for 4 man squads

Disagree. If you pair people up in twos it becomes alot easier, ala BB system.

IE:

• SL + Medic
• Specialist + AR
• Rifleman + Tertiary kit that requires ammo (HAT, Gren, marksman, LAT etc)

Once the groups are sorted out names can be applied and the teams split up to do certain roles. Its a flawless system from my application of it.

[R-DEV]Jaymz wrote: BF2 VoIP automatically attenuates all in-game sound and completely ruins your situational awareness. With 6 lads all using VoIP simultaneously you may as well all be deaf. If mumble was more widely used and VoIP was strictly limited to "squad radio" purposes I don't think squads would be getting caught off guard quite as much.

Yeah that sums up why I hate VoIP and get called a noob by everyone while no one can hear a tank about to drive over us.

IMO it's just the more you force people to stick together, which isn't a bad thing, the easier is for one random lone wolf to throw a monkey wrench into the whole thing.

Wicca wrote:I think Mongol is right, its about the skill of the player, its not just "I am good at shooting"

Its about thinking, its part of PR, Just like in real life, just saying "follow me!" wont Force any good teamplay, nor will any of "PRs, gameplay" its the player who decides how he wants to play, and i must say.

The only reason there are so many epic players here, is because PR does a pretty epic job at promoting this mod, to be realistic, teamwork, good gameplay.

Thats why people have michrophone or follows orders etc.

So, the real reason why people suck against lonewolfers? Squadleaders that suck.

Thats my oppinion anyway, some Squadleaders just forget leading, and sits back and just plays, instead of pushing his oppinions, orders and tactics down on the squad. He just says, follow me.

My biggest problem is with Squadleaders that try to micro-manage. Each squadmember should know their job and not be told how to do their job, the squadleader needs to lead, not do the job for them.

BrownBadger wrote:My biggest problem is with Squadleaders that try to micro-manage. Each squadmember should know their job and not be told how to do their job, the squadleader needs to lead, not do the job for them.

I like to have a point man or fire team it is his/thier job to 'control' the fire fights leaving me able to communicate, co ordinate and place team markers.

BrownBadger wrote:My biggest problem is with Squadleaders that try to micro-manage. Each squadmember should know their job and not be told how to do their job, the squadleader needs to lead, not do the job for them.

Yes, but most of the time the squad leader is leading a bunch of rag tag players who have experience, but not enough to get the job done.

I have only found 3 players in my time which I don't have to micromanage, its just the babysitting job which is the SL.

dtacs wrote:Incorrect. More squad members = more bullets = more dead or suppressed enemies.


Disagree. If you pair people up in twos it becomes alot easier, ala BB system.

IE:

• SL + Medic
• Specialist + AR
• Rifleman + Tertiary kit that requires ammo (HAT, Gren, marksman, LAT etc)

Once the groups are sorted out names can be applied and the teams split up to do certain roles. Its a flawless system from my application of it.

Excuse me, but if more squad members was more effective, we wouldnt be having this debate in the first place, now as hobby leaders, less is more, if your able to squeeze the maximum out of 4 guys, but almost nothing out of 6 then go for 4.

And Suppression fire in PR is something i rarely see, i only see covering fire, so that statment is false.

The british army went for 3 fireteams in a section during the falklands war, it was a mistake, and theyve reverted back to 2 fireteams. So basically, as a leader you need to make things simple so you can be effective, if you overcomplicate everything youll spend more time thinking and talking that acting, and its really the acting its all about.

Keep it simple and stupid.

I have had the 3 buddy team system myself, it doesnt work, its slow, confusing and just bugs you down.

Hunt3r wrote:Or as a lone-wolf. I've managed to take out entire fortified firebases and two squads by lone-wolfing. I realize that PR is all about teamwork, but a single rifleman that plays it smart can seemingly take out many enemies.

Key word being seemingly...

Lonewolfing = the noise before defeat

Teamwork beats "skill", everytime.

Success in lone-wolfing depends on the ability of the rest of the team to wage a farily organised battle. If they are half-assed in this aspect and the opposing team is similar or worse - the lone-wolf might have an enjoyable round.

If the enemy team is on top of things, the lone wolf is a bit irritaiting, maybe..., but easily dealt with. A team of lone-wolfs, no matter their skill, will be crushed easily by a team of teamworking squads. Especially in PR, but it is also true for vBF2.





The famous Chinaman Sun Tzu said:

"Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat".
Fits the concept of lone-wolfing very good IMHO.

Fenrir07 wrote:Key word being seemingly...

Lonewolfing = the noise before defeat

Teamwork beats "skill", everytime.

PR isn't much about objectives it's more about attrition. Thus lone wolfing is very effective. In past patches lone wolfing wasn't as effective as it is now. Not nearly.

dtacs wrote:Incorrect. More squad members = more bullets = more dead or suppressed enemies.

The only thing you need to counter that is a LMG. With a lmg, you got as much firepower as a squad, some what.