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Re: Tunnel Questions
Posted: 2010-04-13 19:49
by Schroederfgson
if we do add tunnels, they should have firing slits added to them at ankle high levels on the ground above, they were used widely in Vietnam, cant find pictures of them though, great for ambushes
Re: Tunnel Questions
Posted: 2010-04-13 20:00
by Adetter
DevilDog812 wrote:cant they just be scaled down?
Hope so, but dont think so.........
firing slits, like this one.
http://k43.pbase.com/u48/koiom/upload/40657732.VCFiringSlitsCuChi.jpg
or this.
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d170/pauljamesog/Vietnam/CamBunker1.jpg
i know its a bunker.........
Re: Tunnel Questions
Posted: 2010-04-13 22:12
by Schroederfgson
first link is blocked for me with a 403 error, but kinda like the 2nd one, but more sunken down into the ground
Re: Tunnel Questions
Posted: 2010-04-14 05:18
by Adetter
yeah, that was the first one..........only it was down on the ground with two holes. U only saw a little bump.
Re: Tunnel Questions
Posted: 2010-06-29 16:08
by sAueR115
Uhhh... they were able to stand in the tunnels in Vietnam. They didn't move around so quickly by crawling for miles underground...
Re: Tunnel Questions
Posted: 2010-07-07 20:21
by Quikli
Tunnels are a must in a Vietnam war simulation. Tunnels were a huge aspect of the war.
Tunnel Rats should also be a "kit". They should be armed with a pistol and a kabar knife with maybe a flashlight if BF2's engine can support them.
Also the tunnels should be only be compatible with people who "Crouches" or goes "prone"
Re: Tunnel Questions
Posted: 2010-07-12 15:13
by sammya
Great questions Adetter. Tunnels are a must. My friend recentally went to vietnam and went on a tour of a part where parts of the war was in vietnam. his guide showed him the tunnels that the viet congs crawled through.
He said that in order to crawl through one of these tunnels you would have to starve yourself for weaks which is what the charlie did which gave them a huge advantage over the americans because the americans couldn't fit into the tunnels.
So if these tunnesl are implemented into PR:V... will they be small enough just for the congs? And to make this possible is there anyway tha the congs models be smaller then the americans to give them this advantage.
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Re: Tunnel Questions
Posted: 2010-07-12 18:04
by chagadiel
Quikli;1384531 wrote:Tunnels are a must in a Vietnam war simulation. Tunnels were a huge aspect of the war.
i am afraid to say tunnels where not a huge aspect of the war far from it.
tunnels where in the chu chi district almost entirely. This is becuase the clay in the ground are very suitable for tunnels at chu chi and the rest of vietnam mosly isnt. there was some tunnels complexes near the DMZ which the marines found but this was more an isolated case than the rule. they had bigger problems like whole NVA infantry regiments slipping through the DMZ
if you met a vietnam veteran from the 9th infantry, 173rd airbourne, 101st airbourne, americal, koreans or any of the marines they would probably say they never saw tunnel complexes. bunkers yes, little tunnels to hide from an airstrike maybe but not the tunnels peaple are talking about here.
the tunnel of chu chi where unique and a small very important pocket in II corps north east of saigon. they have captivated the the war memory and where a royally big pain in the but for saigon and MACV haveing a inpenetrable vietcong fortress so close to the capital
i will admit to some hypocrosy i run vietnam wargames and the campaign the players are in is in II Corps and i ran a game with some tunnels a cache and some traps.
i can strongly recamend the book called the "The Tunnels of Cu Chi " it has been on the book shelves constantly for 24 years. it is a great book and it has everything you need if you are interested in the subject and find the facts are better than the overal myths.
Re: Tunnel Questions
Posted: 2010-07-13 16:39
by K-Massive
Just saying out my opinion about the tunnels
In my opinion it would be best if you could crouch in the tunnels, and make the entrances really tiny that you had to crawl to get in there..
Re: Tunnel Questions
Posted: 2010-07-13 19:11
by Tunnel Rat
I was with Triple Deuce of the 25th Infantry based out of Cu Chi. We found a number of small tunnels that would hold maybe 2, 3 or 4 people. They were a place to hide and sleep in. They were not constructed to fight from. The famous "tunnels of Ch Chi were in my opinion really caves, not tunnels. What we did find a lot of were what we called "Spider Holes". They were small holes for one or two people to hide in with a hinged thatch door on top. The enemy would pop up out of them and spray the area with AK47 rounds then drop back down inside. They were great for ambushes and very difficult to find and attack. I recommend that the Viet Cong FOB's could be underground spawn sites with the ability to construct some "Spider Holes" for defending an area and for ambushes. I don't think we need elaborate tunnels. Just my thoughts.
Re: Tunnel Questions
Posted: 2010-07-13 21:41
by chagadiel
I recommend that the Viet Cong FOB's could be underground spawn sites with the ability to construct some "Spider Holes" for defending an area and for ambushes. I don't think we need elaborate tunnels. Just my thoughts.[/QUOTE]
couldnt agree with you more. with the build abilty in PR the vietcong "team" have the abilty to stick together and create interesting and creative ambushes with bunkers and trenches and such. the model bunkers could come camoflaged with foliage to help the models sink in with the terrain and allow some interesting fire fights and enphasise the need for artillary or TAC air support for the U.S "team".
Re: Tunnel Questions
Posted: 2010-07-14 11:52
by TomVasseur
So basically, you enter the spider hole as a VC, have a 180 degree vision, wait for an enemy, pop out, spray, get back in. Sounds nice but I still have some questions.
How will the enemy be able to clear the spider holes? Should the person inside be able to take damage? Should the spider hole be able to take damage?
Will the spider holes be mobile? If so, will they be kit-bound (like the specialist kit with the hook which can be picked up) or will they be more like a requestable option?
If the spider holes are mobile, what is the best way to camouflage them. I can imagine that it will be difficult to hide a thing which isn't orignally a part of the landscape. Maybe close to the ground, maybe like a bush covering it? (maybe you have pictures of how the spider holes you saw looked like?)
This a picture that I found, but if you have this, how will you be able to give a 180 degree view, forward (that was what I had in mind otherwise I can't really imagine this being effective in game play).
Re: Tunnel Questions
Posted: 2010-07-14 21:07
by Tunnel Rat
Simple Spider Hole
From Wikipedia: A spider hole is U.S. military parlance for a camouflaged one-man foxhole, used for observation. A spider hole is typically a shoulder-deep, protective, round hole, often covered by a camouflaged lid, in which a soldier can stand and fire a weapon. A spider hole differs from a foxhole in that a foxhole is usually deeper and its design emphasizes cover rather than concealment.
We cleared them with covering fire and a frag or sometimes just drove over them with our APC's.
