Project Reality Forums

Yeah, special privileges wouldn't happen, CIA members dont even have those.

And I am pretty sure CIA admins would be segregated from this proposed server's admin list as well. It will be a proper server.

It's a good thing that mods still keep this open, it's a bit like =H=, it gathers all sorts of verbal diarrhea in one place.

But I will comment on the last bit about newbies. They're all the same or we wouldn't label them as such when players show blatant inexperience. The newbies of past releases were no different to the ones of today - and ffs, tactical shooters weren't a hit back neither, most came from BF2 which is an arcadish shooter. This simple reasoning should be enough to stop your elitist **** and understand that you're part of the problem.

The way I see it is that the current mass of PR veterans grew up to be more and more intolerant. This is the only difference that I've noticed in all my years in PR. It grew to a point that most vets don't want to explain the game at all, and sometimes when is someone is flexible, it has to be within certain parameters that we deem ethical. The typical newbie won't read the manual - most of us never did actually - or understand to a certain extent what is considered rude to us. He never had a chance to play in such a community and game, so how can he comprehend?
Or you really want to believe that the newest generations are completely devoided of intelligence? That they were put on this Earth to deliberately fuck up in PR because they can't evolve. You seriously want to believe in that ****?

It's like you neglected your kid's education and at his late years you start complaining about how a dumb fuck he is.

Be intelligent and stop shooting yourselves in the foot. If you want an educated community then do your part.

Acemantura wrote:Ok, so what if TG came back?

Who would take care of it? Who would pay for it? Who would play on that server? And what would the rules be?

If you can answer most of these questions, PM me, I've got 3 servers and only 2 are being used.

Who would take care of it pay for it the same people that are doing it now tg isn't gone no one is playing it because no one seeds it any more

I think alot of the gameplay that comes out of servers is the atmosphere they create, such as admin behavior, seriousness, and general maturity.

CIA sets a pretty laid back atmosphere, sometimes admins spam **** with the !s command, some of the scrolling messages are joking. This atmosphere however seems to effect how serious people play.

On the other side of things TG ran a tight ship with high maturity. Admins never screwed around and there was never any inappropriate messages on your screen. The admins had rules, and enforced them to a T. This set a high standard for players to follow.

Well, make it happen.

If you want it, claim it, pay for it, tend to it, and most of all quit your bitching. I have the available resources for a TG or TG-like server to happen. All I require is money, a monetary justification to give a server to the community or rather to those who would like to see it come back.

Along with my offer comes my Clan tag, so you don't have to waste time with newbs who are uncertain of "new and undiscovered" servers.

Plus, you are guaranteed the same level of server stability, server plugins, and maintenance that I give to my server, if not more than because whomever purchases (as an individual or as group) is paying for my services.

Bottom line, I can make it happen if no one else can or will, especially because you will be using my clan tag, under our server license. I just need to justify handing over a server with some money/donations. Admins, rule sets, and all of the other groundwork needs to be laid before anything can move forward.

Who among you will claim the stewardship? A clan, some players, or will this be the PR community proper?

Arcturus_Shielder wrote:Be intelligent and stop shooting yourselves in the foot. If you wanted an educated community then do your part.

I agree 140%.

BUT, the problem is that there are players who are bad because they are new, or just not into shooters or have limited to no knowledge about tactics and such, so they tag along not really doing what they are supposed to. You can work with those to make them better over time... ideally every SL and SM should try and help him.
Then there are those who are new, have some limited knowledge about tactics and are willing to learn. Those are the players we crave for, that is future veteran material. They will automatically ask questions and absorb information much quicker.
At the bottom, there are those who either know or dont know how the game works, but dont play in the way it should be... atleast vaguely, and also refuse to learn something new that would benefit. Such are the people we dont want at all, and these are the ones who i meet more often than the first two examples and that, my friends is the problem of bad gameplay and the increase of it.

People have no respect for the SL position, as they use it as an asset to gain something else. Ideally, SL not only should be a good example on a skill and knowledge level, but also act as a morale boost and a teacher. I try to be a good SL in that way, but i fail since i see people not being near me even after repeating numerous times and being in the heat of the battle, i really dont have time to work with those people, so i instead kick them out, hoping for a better replacement. Also PR is too fast paced to really hold a training session and then hold hands during te battle as obviously, you are going to die with the rest of your squad. I should work more on actually making better player out of some... we will see how it goes.

Acemantura wrote:Ok, so what if TG came back?

Who would take care of it? Who would pay for it? Who would play on that server? And what would the rules be?

If you can answer most of these questions, PM me, I've got 3 servers and only 2 are being used.

As said, it's not because of the label TG, it's because of the regulars that played under that banner. Most of them are gone now, find players of similar mentality and you'll get your own "TG".

Arcturus_Shielder wrote: Or you really want to believe that the newest generations are completely devoided of intelligence? That they were put on this Earth to deliberately fuck up in PR because they can't evolve. You seriously want to believe in that ****?

I've tried it over the years, I really did but this is the conclusion I've come to.

Brainlaag wrote:As said, it's not because of the label TG, it's because of the regulars that played under that banner. Most of them are gone now, find players of similar mentality and you'll get your own "TG".

Not necessarily, K&N attracts every type of player, including the dumb wits. The environment that TG cultivated was far more serious, and boosted that "je ne sais quoi" of teamwork that you all crave.

Why not try again with a server that will hopefully not crash so often, and you may even get some players back into the player base while you're at it.

Acemantura wrote:Not necessarily, K&N attracts every type of player, including the dumb wits. The environment that TG cultivated was far more serious, and boosted that "je ne sais quoi" of teamwork that you all crave.

I didn't enjoy the environment they setup, I actually found it rather dumb with some really weird rules, yet I came back over and over again because of the playerbase. However I have to say that days when the server was full with regulars and a normal day with average PR pubbies made a staggering difference.

Acemantura wrote:Why not try again with a server that will hopefully not crash so often, and you may even get some players back into the player base while you're at it.

Good luck with that, the biggest obstacle you have to overcome is to form a solid group of regulars that know how the game works. These are hardly around anymore and I've grown sick of PR too.

Brainlaag wrote:I've grown sick of PR too.

Well then perhaps the problem is more personal than systemic.

Would you care to discuss of what exactly you have grown tired.

Because as you have aptly explained, such a server would be pointless if those die hard players are bored instead of enjoying themselves.

I believe you may be looking at it the wrong way Ace. TG was a community that cultivated experience over years of dedication from players, and as mentioned most of them have gone to the wayside for various reasons. I think the standards of respect and maturity of the overall PR community have taken a dive over time, and this is reflected in the lack of "team" on public servers lately. The "TG" tag really meant little more then "I'm here to play this game with a serious tone", there is nothing more to it then that. The admins on the server were varied and the rules were actually quite lenient, I feel CIA and PRTA both have a more grounded set of rules (Asset names being a big one, the only rule I don't see around is the obligation to listen to your commander).

I think if you really wanted to boost the quality of teamwork you would have to first start with giving the players a better sense of team, with mutual respect as the jumping off point. Nipping spats in the bud would be a start, not that I haven't seen a few examples of this, but it is a thin line between keeping things civil and going overboard with admin privileges (the term admin rights would mean it is your God given right to decide right and wrong, when that is indeed such a grey area).

I'd also like people to stop throwing the term "elitist" around so much, it is quite unfounded as I have witnessed plenty of newer players refusing to take advice and conform with the standards put forth by those who have been around long enough to know what works and what doesn't. Many people label others elitist because they cannot take criticism well at all, and then use it as an excuse to play poorly. On the other hand I have run into my fair share of lesser skilled players who apply themselves accordingly and do their best to keep up with the rest of the squad. What it comes down to is a test of patience and the ability to endure frustrating mistakes while trying to impress the importance of detail to those who are still learning the ropes. I read the manual like a bible when I first start and ate flak where it was due, some of the new players cannot stomach this and label it abuse and become belligerent towards those who know better. This in time forms a rift that is not easily undone, and naturally drives some potential new blood off, but that is mostly of their own doing. Many players would label OD-S elitist, and while we do have some strong characters in the clan (which clan doesn't?) it comes down to how you approach each individual and the circumstances that unfold after the initial impression is made. Do yourselves a favor and quit calling other players "elitist" when quite frankly everyone is here to enjoy this game we love so dear, some of us can just endure failure more then others.

Placing blame on this and that only wastes our energy and time, both of which are against us thanks to many new titles being released, regardless of how shallow their gameplay really is. I commend Ace for stepping up and trying to offer solutions to many of the problems outlined in this thread and we could all take a few notes from his attitude.

Acemantura wrote:Well then perhaps the problem is more personal than systemic.

Would you care to discuss of what exactly you have grown tired.

The Playerbase:

• The lack of commitment by new players.
• The complete and stubborn refusal of new additions (Mumble haters hail).
• Decrease of older players (many being my mates).
• Lack of communication, especially on European servers lately (be it language barrier, or something else).
• The incredible Amount of idiots and smacktards (mostly due to the 128 server).

Overall I don't think any of the gamechanges and new mechanics ruined it for me. PR has grown steadily to the better over the years, sure we have lost some nice maps but overall the game is more enjoyable than it used to be (It's not a kind of "OMG YOU'VE RUINED PR FOR ME WITH YOUR CHANGES" symptom).

But the players, omg the players, I can't say if it's me being involved in more demanding and mature communities and simply having become older, or if the gameplay has really gone down hill this bad but I feel as if I'm playing with a bunch of zombiefied monkeys sometimes.

-->What Murphy said.

Patient bear may be patient for 1.0, but he clearly isn't immortal. Just had to say that.

Why do I get the feeling that 1.0 will be PR's last major patch?

It's just a number, and with people still working on new maps and modeling new weapons/assets for planned com-facs I believe you will be proven wrong.

How many serious-pants players are there?

And why can't you cultivate and train that same serious mindset if you had your own server?

If we can register enough serious-pants players to work on a serious-pants server, this problem may solve itself, but would require, by my best guess, a month of pure dedication.

So, who wants to trade in their britches for some serious pants?

Murphy wrote:It's just a number, and with people still working on new maps and modeling new weapons/assets for planned com-facs I believe you will be proven wrong.

I'm simply looking at the amount of time it's taken them to produce 1.0. It's a long time, and that to me suggests that they're trying to create something akin to a final product with 1.0.

pssh, you're akin to a final product.

Murphy wrote:I'd also like people to stop throwing the term "elitist" around so much, it is quite unfounded as I have witnessed plenty of newer players refusing to take advice and conform with the standards put forth by those who have been around long enough to know what works and what doesn't.

using the same tactics/standards that "work" over and over creates stagnant gameplay. maybe its not about the standards that work anymore, maybe its time for something new(within reason of course).

maybe add a rule to stop squadleaders not responding on SL chat, which often happens on K&H. yes some people don't have mics, but you cannot lead effectively without communication.

If one is on mumble, but not utilizing the software, that person is not on mumble afaIc.

Its not just the seriousness of the players its how much we all knew each other and how friendly all the people are. I've met people on TG that have become what I consider some of my good friends.