Khamisiyah Insurgency Layer

[Jacksonez__]

Did you play Dien Doung? US NEVER won on that map.

How come? I never got to play that map, servers always crashed on it.

[risegold8929]

I would love to see it where MEC has the numbers in terms of Armour Assets, but the US has a great chance to take them out via (limited) Air Power which would hopefully balance it out a bit. It would eventually boil down to some INF vs INF gameplay (which is awesome and needs more love) instead of rape by armour (which almost always happens on every INS map) with the occasional air strike.

[camo]

I'm sure it wont be to much longer before you can play as MEC v INS.

Is that a hint Rabbit?

Is there any chance the ins 16 layer could be a USMC layer? The camo blends in better with the surroundings which might make up for the lack of armor support.

[Rabbit]

Is that a hint Rabbit?

Is there any chance the ins 16 layer could be a USMC layer? The camo blends in better with the surroundings which might make up for the lack of armor support.

There are soo many syrian warmaps coming up, developed by the Devs and the community. Get excited.

Kind of? Sbeneh will be in playtest soon this week too hopefully.

[waldov]

AFsoccer;1969592']<Bump>

I'm in the process of creating two insurgency layers for Khamisiyah, as an experiment to see if they'll work. I like the idea of giving you guys more options and insurgency would certainly open up more areas of the map to fight over. So I think what I'm going to do is create a INS 64 layer with US Army vs MEC and a INS 16 layer with US Army vs Insurgents. To make it work, the 64 layer would have heavy assetes and the 16 layer (with insurgents) it would be jeeps only:

INS 64

US Army:
1 x A-10
1 x Kiowa (or attack littlebird)
2 x Bradleys or tanks*
Several uparmored Humvees
Trans helos and support vehicles

MEC:
2 x tanks or BMP2s*
2 x AA vehicles
1 x BTR60
Several UAZs with machine guns
AA guns in bunker area
Trans helos and support vehicles

I'm hearing some comments that say that US would never have a chance against MEC in insurgency, so let me know what you think. The US will have air power (kind of like in the AAS ALT layer) and the MEC won't. Will this be enough to balance things?

*As for heavy asset balancing, I can't decide if it should be 2 tanks vs 2 tanks, or mix things up a bit by offering one faction tanks and the other APCs with TOW. It seems like the MEC would be defending so maybe they should get the BMP with TOW and make the US come to them?


INS 16

US Army:
Blackhawks
Uparmed Humvees
Support vehicles

Insurgents:
SPG techies
Techies w/ MGs


So if you guys have any thoughts, feel free to share them. Now is the time to tailor this how we like, and how we think it will work best.

Awesome! This is one of the best pieces of news ive heard in a while, ive always wanted to see the MEC show its true unconventional nature.

I agree with rabbit make the MEC assets pretty roughed up, ideally they shouldn't be able to take the Americans head on instead they should be relying more on tactics like ambushes and strong defenses to turn the odds in their favor, they're fighting an unconventional war after all. They should be fielding second line equipment like technicals, cold-war era APCs, dirt bikes maybe even a T-55 or two.

This is just an example of what you could have:

INS 64

US Army:
1 x A-10
1 x Kiowa (or attack littlebird)
1x M1A2
2 x Bradleys
2x Black Hawks
2x Logistical trucks
2x Transport trucks
5x uparmored Humvees

Heavy Area attack
UAV

MEC:
1 x BMP-2 or Scorpion tank
1 x AA vehicle
1x Mi-17
2x T-55s (maybe even 3?)
2x Transport trucks
3x Logistical Trucks
5x UAZs with machine guns and/or Dshk. technicals
8x Dirtbikes
(maybe even some civilian cars around the city?)

AA guns in bunker area
Heavy Area Attack
UAV

This is just a rough idea that's probably unbalanced in some way or another, im just trying to demonstrate the type of stuff you could possibly have. Remember many Middle Eastern military's aren't just prepared to resort to unconventional combat they're designed for unconventional combat (namely Iran) against a superior military like America. Giving them equipment like dirtbikes, technicals or even civilian cars is by no means a stretch of the imagination.

Anyways you know best, after all you pulled off Lashksar AAS which I personally think out-shined the original INS layer by quite a margin, hopefully you can do the same with Khamisiyah. Just remember to take into account that Assets aside the MEC will have some major advantages, such as pretty much equal infantry and the fact that they're defending aswell as unlimited reinforcements, the US are really going to need asset advantages to balance out the odds.

[StandardSmurf]

I see why some people are worried that blu for will be too OP, and that the map does not have a ton of places for caches. That said I still think it would be a blast to play or at least put into beta testing. PR has not had anything new come out in a pretty long time, and something new would be nice. In regards to blufor being too OP that can be controlled by what set of vehicles they are issued, I think a few strykers is hardly OP. On a map like this a gary could easily evade fire driving in those dunes up to its target. Cache locations could be more numerous that you would think if you give the map a good look again. It is common in INS for the cache area to get surrounded and heavy armor to rape, it is fun and it is realistic. Instead of everyone saying NO to trying out fun ideas, how about be open minded. I for one am all for this idea of an INS layer USMC or US Army VS INS. Not MEC as INS, or scaled down MEC. That MEC idea being INS ... someone is smokin. That isn't at all the same fun as being regular INS IMO. As Forest Gump would say ... Thats all I got to say about that.

[risegold8929]

No, please remember this is Ins we are talking about, US should have the advantage and to balance things the MEC can use as much conventional infantry as they want, but with limited vehicles

Yes it is INS, but imagine an INS where the Insurgents are no longer anally bored and can actually fight back effectively against armour with armour. Besides, armour on a pure defensive role can easily get steam rolled by HAT kits and lases with the Aircraft.

If we are going to rattle things up with a MEC side as insurgents, why not push a little further and see how this goes.

[Death!]

I played it yesterday, MEC is currently so, so OP. USArmy could not stand a chance, they got one cache because a guy ninja'd it.

That map would be cool with mixed modes like it is on Burning Sands. Also, MEC should have tickets, a huge amount, but still get it. If a cache is destroyed, the MEC team could lose like 100 tickets.

[Death!]

my prediction was right, MEC is OP with armor

It was, but I really enjoyed playing that layout, even if a bit broken. I got the feeling AFSoccer intended for us about exploring different places of that awesome map. I was running in the desert with a 50. cal jeep full of MEC soldiers, playing Abu Ali on local and seeking for americans to eliminate, a really fun experience.

I don't even think MEC should lose its armor, I just think they should not get "infinite lives" as it is now. And maybe, I said MAYBE, put some flags into the mix like it is on Burning Sands.

tl;dr: I really enjoyed the experience of a conventional army as insurgents

[AFsoccer]

You'll see some variation of this in the next patch.

[Murphy]

The flag mix in burning sands sucks, its bad made, and BLUFOR always lose...

I finished a round on Merk less then an hour ago and Brits won with 250ish tickets. We managed to keep infantry in the city staying occupied with the caps, while armor supported the troops working to bring caches down. It requires more coordination then a standard INS game but when it plays out like that it's an extremely entertaining map. The INS had some bad cache spawns, but they did make us pay for every cache.

[dysin]

first game of khamisiyah ins earlier. ran the a-10 with uav. had to do most runs beyond visual, sending munitions from 1500+ to level out a little over 1100. anything under 1k and it was instant lock from up to 3 full grids away with that massive view distance advantaging their ground units.

at two points in the match, we decided to gun operating aav's with no designation in thick cover- just to force enough leeway to work the tanks and bmp's offensive on our infantry. through all of this, we were having to break a gap in their line amongst 3 aa emplacements and scattered manpad's to give blufor the breathing room to make a push.

the entire round was literally moving from one aa target to the next, with small pauses to work the fob itself or run down their armor.

c4 was on the last cache when the tickets ran out. good game for both teams. we were definitely pressured running the cas in a direct support role.

[Kerryburgerking]

Give them T62s and BMP-1 instead of T72s and BMP-2s

[AFsoccer]

Give them T62s and BMP-1 instead of T72s and BMP-2s

I thought about that but the only T-62s in our inventory have woodland camo and looked really bad on a desert map.

[Rabbit]

I thought about that but the only T-62s in our inventory have woodland camo and looked really bad on a desert map.

Black Gold. BMP-1 and T-62 desert, and even no militia flags, so that is another bonus.

[AFsoccer]

Aah, nice. That texture isn't in the inventory because Vapoman loads it as a special "bg" texture... but I'm sure I can use it.

Thanks for pointing it out. There are so many nooks and crannies in this place! LOL