Project Reality Forums

Burn 1 man armor!

devnull wrote:Not so many threads ago, somebody suggested two kit apporach to this problem: make separate crewmand driver and crewman gunner kits, and enforce delay for kit switches. I think it would be more practical solution than long warmup times etc.

black-wolf wrote:But, because you can request your crewman kit at a tank, the player would just hop out of the tank after driving, request a gunner kit, and start firing.

Exactly. Although this is an older thread, I had similar views on the "alternate crewman kit" not too long ago but noticed this loophole aswell. Unfortunately it's becoming clear that it'll be rather difficult to prevent people from circumventing the system. There are not very many options we have left to stop One Man Armor.

M.Warren wrote: 2. Turret cannot be moved unless a Driver is present in the drivers seat. (No Driver means: No engine, no power, no turret. That's reality, period. <And "manual hydraulic backup systems" aren't an excuse so people can be running amuck with valued assets.>)

ye u got a point there, but there mite b a downside to this. It once happened to me that our t-90 got badly damaged, but even with 1 broken track we got it behind a rock and hid it there, we cldnt really go anywhere, so my driver hopped out, trying to help me spot things from the other side of the rock, while I was manning the turret in the immobolized tank.

So ye, its a nice idea to stop noobs/solo'ers from suiciding armor into battle, but can b annoying in certain situations like this.

the hacks must be fixed!!!!!!!!!.that will solve most of it....and also the spawn time hack.....that WUmnuts noob put it on youtube and now every one knows bout it

yeah wtf why hasn't anyone else thought of no driver no working turret?!

wait better yet, why not no gunner no driving. i mean alot of the time when you get to a good spot the driver often jumps to the MG seat to cover the rear incase of infantry, so in which case you wouldnt disable the turret when you need to kill that common sneaky *astard who gets too close

Conman51=US= wrote:the hacks must be fixed!!!!!!!!!.that will solve most of it....and also the spawn time hack.....that WUmnuts noob put it on youtube and now every one knows bout it

kinda off topic there, take that to the "bugs" thread, the devs will take it more seriously there

black-wolf wrote:But, because you can request your crewman kit at a tank, the player would just hop out of the tank after driving, request a gunner kit, and start firing.

how about this? if you have one crewman kit the other one is not available to you

Bring you might be onto something. Perhaps just making it so that the turret wont work unless the tank has two people in it. Doesn't matter which seats, driver, or MG, just aslong as two of the seats are filled. This way that driver can hop on the MG while defending a flag n help ya out.

But ultimately, the whole idea of having the turret disabled unless someone is in the take idea is the ONLY idea thus far that will work. All other ideas suggested wont work, as they have loopholes.

60 second cooldown? The solo-tanker just parks, hops on the gun, and 60 seconds later he can fight. It's not a deterant in the least.

Seperate kits? Talk about cumbersome, and what happens if you lose your driver and want to RTB? You're kinda boned, not to mention the loophole mentioned earlier.

Now if the tank requires two people in it for the turret to operate, there isn't a loophole. There is absolutely no way for a solo-tanker to work. It's flat out impossible. NO other idea can guarantee this, so I think it's a no brainer which idea we should use.

wow old thread resurecction for the loss Id say
How did this end? Can't remember really tired now....

Colt556 wrote:Bring you might be onto something. Perhaps just making it so that the turret wont work unless the tank has two people in it. Doesn't matter which seats, driver, or MG, just aslong as two of the seats are filled. This way that driver can hop on the MG while defending a flag n help ya out.

But ultimately, the whole idea of having the turret disabled unless someone is in the take idea is the ONLY idea thus far that will work. All other ideas suggested wont work, as they have loopholes.

60 second cooldown? The solo-tanker just parks, hops on the gun, and 60 seconds later he can fight. It's not a deterant in the least.

Seperate kits? Talk about cumbersome, and what happens if you lose your driver and want to RTB? You're kinda boned, not to mention the loophole mentioned earlier.

Now if the tank requires two people in it for the turret to operate, there isn't a loophole. There is absolutely no way for a solo-tanker to work. It's flat out impossible. NO other idea can guarantee this, so I think it's a no brainer which idea we should use.

what about my second thought? if you have no turret gunner the driver cant make the tank move?

Bringerof_D wrote:what about my second thought? if you have no turret gunner the driver cant make the tank move?

I don't agree with it, at all lol. Atleast with the no driver no turret thing you can kinda support it with realism. That being the turret has no power (Allthough not true, it atleast sounds reasonable). But how would you justify the tank not moving cuz it's got no gunner? It's like saying a car wont run if it doesn't have a passenger. It'll still move, it wont be usefull, but it'll move.

Plus, several times ingame I've had my squadie nab a tank and drive it out to me, so it helps speed things along.

How do we force drivers to listen to their gunners? I'm tired of telling my driver to move in a particular direction only for him to drive away from incoming infantry or not move at all. Drivers also seem to be unaware that the turret sits behind their point of view and is higher up. I tire of being exposed but unable to shoot because there is something blocking my shot or the turret can't aim low enough. Friggin' noobs. Is there a mechanism to kick your driver out of the APC and replace him with a bot that obeys all your verbal orders?

Solid Knight wrote:How do we force drivers to listen to their gunners? I'm tired of telling my driver to move in a particular direction only for him to drive away from incoming infantry or not move at all. Drivers also seem to be unaware that the turret sits behind their point of view and is higher up. I tire of being exposed but unable to shoot because there is something blocking my shot or the turret can't aim low enough. Friggin' noobs. Is there a mechanism to kick your driver out of the APC and replace him with a bot that obeys all your verbal orders?

What you do is make a squad labled Armor, Tank, APC ect.ect, then get in the Drivers seat and go off to an out of the way place in the base. If no one joins your squad, send a request in chat, something to the effect of "(Vehicle Name) in need of Driver/Gunner, must have mic and follow orders", at least, that's what Warren does, and it works out pretty well for him.

Solid Knight wrote:How do we force drivers to listen to their gunners? I'm tired of telling my driver to move in a particular direction only for him to drive away from incoming infantry or not move at all. Drivers also seem to be unaware that the turret sits behind their point of view and is higher up. I tire of being exposed but unable to shoot because there is something blocking my shot or the turret can't aim low enough. Friggin' noobs. Is there a mechanism to kick your driver out of the APC and replace him with a bot that obeys all your verbal orders?

Whenever I run an armor squad, I give drivers the final word in all situations. They have much more situational awareness than gunners and I often find that gunners get tunnel vision when they are focused on a target.

to this thread.

solo tankers are bad, you cant argue about that,
but a 60 seconds timer wont affect anything. solo tankers will just waste the tanks even more.

the only solving to this problem is "no driver = turret wont work.", however, i dont think "no gunner = not movable" will work becouse sometimes you need to unstuck the vehicle, or move to a armor squad member who spawned far away.

Of course people try to use the vehicles the way which is most effective, which kills most enemies and sometimes it is most effective to just sit down with the tank and ambush, and for ambushing with tank you dont need a driver because you dont want your tank to be moved for next 30 minutes.

So when i for example look at the map and see situation where tank is needed for defending, why the heck i would like to get a driver for my tank if im just gonna park it to nice location and sit there next 30minutes to defend tactical spot.

Sure i can get a driver but he would have nothing to do for next 30minutes if we play the tank most effective way that is possible in next 30minutes of the match.


Now when i compare 1manning and 2manning tank usage, when there is 2 mans in the tank its not an option to do longer than 2minutes ambushes, there fore the tank is on offensive stance all the time and the tank's estimated life time is about 10% of that what it would be while 1manning the tank in good ambush zone..

In short words 2manning tank = offensive mode all the time, not defensive. So 2manned tanks are dying 10 times faster and because of it they are less effective.

For attacking with tank 1manned is pointless, for defending with tank 2manned is pointless.


1manning tank is very pointfull and effective way to use tanks, but ofc you cannot attack while 1manning, like some noobs does and gets killed right away... Suggestions that you should be thinking about is how to make 2manning a tank pointfull and fun for all kind of situations, including ambushing and defending for a long time in a row.

[R-CON]Deer wrote:Of course people try to use the vehicles the way which is most effective, which kills most enemies and sometimes it is most effective to just sit down with the tank and ambush, and for ambushing with tank you dont need a driver because you dont want your tank to be moved for next 30 minutes.

So when i for example look at the map and see situation where tank is needed for defending, why the heck i would like to get a driver for my tank if im just gonna park it to nice location and sit there next 30minutes to defend tactical spot.

Sure i can get a driver but he would have nothing to do for next 30minutes if we play the tank most effective way that is possible in next 30minutes of the match.


Now when i compare 1manning and 2manning tank usage, when there is 2 mans in the tank its not an option to do longer than 2minutes ambushes, there fore the tank is on offensive stance all the time and the tank's estimated life time is about 10% of that what it would be while 1manning the tank in good ambush zone..

In short words 2manning tank = offensive mode all the time, not defensive. So 2manned tanks are dying 10 times faster and because of it they are less effective.

For attacking with tank 1manned is pointless, for defending with tank 2manned is pointless.


1manning tank is very pointfull and effective way to use tanks, but ofc you cannot attack while 1manning, like some noobs does and gets killed right away... Suggestions that you should be thinking about is how to make 2manning a tank pointfull and fun for all kind of situations, including ambushing and defending for a long time in a row.

It'd interest me to know where you get your percentage figures from. Or maybe it's true that 65% of statistics are made up on the spot.

I personally don't like people who 1-man because it just isn't realistic at all. If you like 1-manning, why not play Vanilla?

Sitting, doing nothing as a tank driver is just part of realism. You can't be moving all of the time. People need to learn to deal with that and maybe even ask for an Adderall/Xanax prescription if it's really that bad.

Changing ppls attitudes so much that they would be ready to sit down and do nothing for longer than 2minutes in tank driver slot while the tank is defending some area 15-45minutes is just absolutely dreamworld thought, in computer game.

I do both, i 2man and 1man tanks, depending which one is needed, attack or defence. And i have noticed very well the difference how long the tank stays alive, and difference on how many enemy tanks, vehicles and infantry my tank kills, depending on attacking/defending with tank. 2man tanks just lives much shorter time and are less usefull/effective when it comes to supporting my team and winning/losing.

No driver has enough patience to do the smartest thing, if it means not to move at all. This is difference between computer game and real life and because of it you need to make compromises in computer games, just simple implementing of real life elements to a computer game doesnt always work. And mostly it is because it would be too boring, noone wants to do it. Like do you wanna have 12months training before you are able to play as a soldier in computer game ? Do you want to sit and do nothing for 30minutes because it would be realistic and smartest thing to do in the current situation in computer game ? Do you wanna put bullets one by one to a clip before you are ready to leave main base and go to fight ?
Reason for compromises can also be that RL-realism in game is unrealistic, meaning if you take 1 realistic thing and put it to game, its unrealistic because other realistic stuff are missing from the game. Good exsample are armor, in PR you cant hit target that is 100 metres away while tank is moving on non flat area, IRL its possible. Thats why making driver and gunner 2 separate persons like in real life, makes shooting even harder in PR because stopping your tank in order to get high enough accuracty to hit the target 100metres away, is slower, and when you compare total result to real life tanks, you see that tanks effectivenes and deadlyness are super unrealistic in PR. If tanks would be as deadly as they are IRL, gameplay would suck big time in almost all of the current maps.

Ive never been knocked out by a one manner and never will for two simple reasons, coordination and mobility. A sitting tank is a dead tank specially if the aggressor actually knows tank techniques. The only reason I see them even being considered "problematic" is because the majority of the populace does not know how to utilize armor in a manner which puts them into an advantage. Its always just driven around in search and destroy missions and engage targets as they come instead of being selective of who they fight and how they fight them.

Another thing I noticed is that when being engaged in tank combat the majority of crews tend to stay static and just duke it out toe to toe until one goes down, this is a very common stupid mistake and the only reason solo tankers are effective. If you do not get the first shot off disengage and maneuver to a position where you at the advantage. Its the inexperienced ones that get killed.