Project Reality Forums

We can use this material for the new Scenario gametype or a slight twist on Counter-Attack, if you guys agree.

Imagine:
"In recent days, several American aircraft have been damaged or destroyed by Chinese anti-air emplacements in a village on the river Qwai. To permit American air superiority in the region, a Marine Corps Reconnaissance Bn. has been deployed to swiftly and thoroughly eliminate the anti-air batteries in the village and engage any hostile Chinese units in the vicinity as necessary."

Objectives: Destroy all AA guns before reinforcements (i.e. Chinese armor + helicopter) arrive. (TOW Humvees will not arrive until the tanks do.)

Ghost1800 wrote:No, I grab HAT and attack them from above or behind.

Good for you, but if you are basing your entire opinion on the removal of tanks on this, please don't...

Ghost1800 wrote:The thing is that on Qwai you only have so much area to cover, being slow really isn't that big of a disadvantage on this map. Mobility is great and all, but when you are narrowed down to 3 crossings (and I can promise you at least one of the two bridges is almost always cut off) and are entirely reliant on not being spotted by anyone before you engage a tank that is probably surrounded by troops and maybe an APC or Nanjing... you have to be that much better then the tank crew or hope they make a mistake. Having to rely on the mistakes or inexperience of the tank crew is hardly what I would call balanced.

Being slow is a huge disadvantage when dealing with TOW Humvees. If you don't know where they are, you will be dead, especially if they know where you are first. Unlike tanks, if TOW Humvees were spotted on a part of the map, by the time you try to take them out, they will most likely be gone. Tanks would probably be nearby, and you are able to hear them. Also, there are many places to hide around the map with everyone's attention focused mainly on Fishing Village/Government Office.

Not to mention, 1 TOW can take out an APC, Tank, and Nanjing/Command truck in one shot.

Ghost1800 wrote:The bottom line is that it takes a lot more coordination and effort on the US team to achieve the same results, and it seems the largest complaint in this regard is that the Chinese have 2 MBTs (with a faster respawn then on other maps) on a map that really isn't that large by PR's standards.

It takes the same coordination as Chinese as with the USMC, from my experiences in both Tanking and using the TOW Humvee. Both tanks and TOWs have 1 goal, and that is to stay alive. The method may be different, but that is what asymmetry does! Also I've seen both Chinese and USMC win around the same number of times, so it is pretty much balanced, IMHO. Now, if it was Chinese winning that map 9/10 times, I would say that the Chinese are unbalanced, but they aren't in this case.

Ghost1800 wrote: P.S. No, my example makes it seem more similar to a rifle versus a mounted heavy machine gun, and while with any comparison there are some inconsistencies I'd say that with the rifleman most likely having to rely on maneuvering himself behind the jeep for a much higher chance of killing the gunner, it works.

No it doesn't, ESPECIALLY with the current deviation, which makes you a sniper in most cases. You can cleanly get a headshot, but then again you can pretty much kill anything that doesn't see you. Anyways... that's a whole other topic to discuss.

But I guess we can agree to disagree.

well regarding the suggestion about the radar and the UAV, i agree with both but i just have some tweaks with the UAV. Yes i think it should be used on Kashan size maps and stuff, but i think id like it better if the commander had a TV screen to view from when he deployed it rather than the radar that can see through roofs, but everything else with the radar and UAV i agree with.

Ghost1800 wrote:Tanks still kill off everything in that map. Sure, the TOW HMMWs have the ability to take on a tank, but that's like saying a rifleman has the ability to take on a .50 gunner... sure you can, but it's not exactly a fair contest.

Remove the tanks, remove USMC's LAV's, and maybe remove one TOW HMMW... give it the EJOD treatment, the map is too small for tanks.

NO thanks , we alredy have enough infbasedboring maps .

ReaperMAC wrote:A Cobra on the other hand, piloted by a skilled crew, can wipe out both tanks, even skillfully crewed. A Cobra on that map would be just over kill, not to mention Cobras have a longer range than tanks (or AA's for the matter).

You dream... simply because most Cobras pilots and gunners will go in and rape whoever is sitting in the AA, if there is a person sitting in it. Though it would be nice to do a movie of what you describe.

I agree that a AH-1Z Super Cobra is a very strong aircraft and heavily armed. But with what I disagree with is that it is not impervious.

Keep in mind that a majortiy of U.S. equipment is based on being light, swift and agile. The AH-1Z Super Cobra is just that and also has the least amount of on-board missles along with being armored significantly lighter in comparison to it's other attack helicopter counterparts.

Also "Qwai River" has a moderate density of fog cover as it limits view up to 250 meters. This will increase the need of having a squad leader with an officer kit helping identify targets and acting as a forward observer with communication to the helicopter and commander.

At the same time both anti-aircraft emplacements and infantry anti-aircraft extend up to 600 meters. Not to mention that the map is smaller than most allowing only one AH-1Z Super Cobra to be utilized. Along with the fact that there is some tree cover to offer concealment to Chinese infantry anti-aircraft. Also the fact that having an AH-1Z in the distance with anti-aircraft present will certainly hear them coming.

Remember this isn't "Al Kufrah Oilfield" and putting an AH-1Z Super Cobra on it with like 3 miles of open area and clear skys, this is "Qwai River" we're talking about. Two very different maps and two very different possibilities.

But like I said, the utilization of the AH-1Z Super Cobra is simply an alternative method. And i'm firmly aware that it'll most likely never be used at all on "Qwai River", just trying to help people understand that it isn't the "omgwtfohgeez|_337BBQsauceroflcopterpwnzorcraft" the helicopter must be used in discretion. Not flying around and loitering an area without a forward observer as that is suicide and a complete waste.

New additions, reevaluations and updates have been posted for the latest v3.0 revision of this thread.

Please bear with me, I understand that it's a lengthy post and a majority of issues are being confronted. But if some of the developers would be so kind to comment if such information can be given out on what's being handled and/or what is not going to be altered or arranged into Project Reality by the v0.8 patch please let me know.

I will make it my best effort not persue certain topics that have been laid to rest or attempt to "drag them out" as that is completely not my intentions. I am simply trying to bring a number of situations we face to the spotlight here in Project Reality and act as a simple reminder of something that may have been forgotten or overlooked as time goes on.

Just hoping to help Project Reality to become a bigger and better game. You guys have done exceptionally well in bringing the game to where it is now. Let's work out these details of both minor and major importance to help perfect the game.

Please feel free to comment and expand furthur on these ideas located on the first page of this thread. I try to keep my opinions general as possible so that a large majority of players may come to a unified understanding that the problem or suggestion at hand can be agreed upon as easily as possible without having these ideas biased to myself or a particular player type.

Game on, with honor and integrity. See you on the battlefield gentlemen.

M.Warren wrote:Keep in mind that a majortiy of U.S. equipment is based on being light, swift and agile. The AH-1Z Super Cobra is just that and also has the least amount of on-board missles along with being armored significantly lighter in comparison to it's other attack helicopter counterparts.

It is armed with a chain gun that can be devastating to infantry, and hellfire missiles that can be manually aimed or laser targeted (by using laser designation from the ground below), destroying tanks and structures alike. Couple that with the immense flying ceiling, the cobra can target almost anything.

M.Warren wrote:Also "Qwai River" has a moderate density of fog cover as it limits view up to 250 meters. This will increase the need of having a squad leader with an officer kit helping identify targets and acting as a forward observer with communication to the helicopter and commander.

As I said, flying high above, negates the necessity for having foward observers. Especially if you can manually aim the hellfires.

M.Warren wrote:At the same time both anti-aircraft emplacements and infantry anti-aircraft extend up to 600 meters. Not to mention that the map is smaller than most allowing only one AH-1Z Super Cobra to be utilized. Along with the fact that there is some tree cover to offer concealment to Chinese infantry anti-aircraft. Also the fact that having an AH-1Z in the distance with anti-aircraft present will certainly hear them coming.

Unfortunately I can barely hear them on Kashan, so I'll give you that one. But with the flare system, they can easily pop flares and speed away into saftey, and they can come back from a different angle, or the person using the AA will either be dead or engaging infantry.

M.Warren wrote:Remember this isn't "Al Kufrah Oilfield" and putting an AH-1Z Super Cobra on it with like 3 miles of open area and clear skys, this is "Qwai River" we're talking about. Two very different maps and two very different possibilities.

Qwai River is not as big of a map to warrent the use of a Cobra IMO. And yes I do realize we are talking about Qwai here, which can disrupt the balance that it currently has.

But like I said, as a regular player, playing on both sides on Qwai, I have seen around the same # of wins from both factions. IMO, with those results, the map is balanced. But if the Chinese are winning 9/10 times, then I would say that the map needs to be looked at.

i would like to mention that it is physicaly possible to one man an armoured vehichle in real life, its just gonna take a while for you to jump from the driver seat and climb into the turret, arm and fire. it may not be a practical way to fight but it is do-able if one is willing to carry the workload and has a good hidden position to fire from.

Aircraft Suggestion:

In Qinling, (the ONLY map) The runway is 4 feet high.

In my last 4 landings with the J-10 and the EF2000, I have, in hopes of using as much of the runway as possible, tried to land as early as possible, the Fence being my biggest concern. With that said, I hit the FRONT if this stupid elevated runway, and do an idiotic bounce into the air and end up dead more often then not.

In no other map are there elevated runways.

No real life runways are elevated.

The reason I've heard for this is: (paraphrased)

If we dont make them high, then we get the black flashing visual glitch all over the runway.

Here's a metaphor:
"Screw airbags and seatbelts, they make the car ugly."

Just pisses me off how I humiliate myself by landing a second too soon.

~Sirsolo

Sirsolo, not sure which aircraft gave you the most trouble but it was most likely the J-10. But it's accepted that it's the worst aircraft around and all we can do is wait till v0.8 comes out. Reason being is that the J-10 situation has already been corrected.

Also I've heard mixed reports of developers fixing the airport at "The Battle of Qinling" and supposedly were intending of building up the ground on either side of the taxiways and runways. This is so we don't get the "black flashing visual glitch" and to facilitate easier recovery of aircraft that have gone wayward.

However I do urge you to practice on a local server of your own utilizing the EF2000 Eurofighter, F-16 Fighting Falcon and the Mig-29 Fulcrum. I would suggest also practicing them in that order as it transforms from easy to harder. Don't even bother with the J-10 as it is of the v0.75 patch, you'll just be banging your head against the wall. Essentially every landing you attempt will result in you needing to slam into the runway to land... Then to just find out your front landing gear is now stuck into the ground and will most likely flip out of control anyways.

i flew the J-10 on qinling yesterday and i find the worse thing is the lagg on takeoff on landing, i always take off into the west in the J-10 the east is always laggy, unfortunetly this means you have to pull a sharp turn as soon as you take off.

The j-10 is okay but no match for the typhoon, however yesterday i manged to take down 3 typoons, an apache, a merlin, and destroy a tank (LGB), i was only shot down twice all round but i crashed 3 times on landing, and once attempting to take off into the east, i got airbourne but got lagg and hit a tree

evrytime i attempt to land on that map my J-10 stalls just before the runway (its impossible to avoid or you will go too fast and hit the end fence), and hits the fence, or hits the end bit of the runway and bounces off, or yesterday i had a glitich where the nose wheel sank through the runway as i came in very hard.

Newly updated to v3.5 and I hope this will come in handy for both user and developer alike. May this help Project Reality on it's way to v0.8, take care gentlemen.

Tank have laser detector...

Man, this thing is longer than a TPS report. Warren, every time you post I always get excited because I know that it is going to be well done and thought out. I basically agree with everything said here and hope that they are taken into consideration before the next patch is released. Nice job.

I dont mind the list warren, but its a bit well, "cluttered" format IMO... theres seemingly not too much structure to it, and theres alot of redundant information where you have "reevaluated"...

having it structured like: Infantry Changes, Vehicle Changes, Game Mode Changes, etc would make it easier to read. As well as mentioning whether the issue is Minor, Major or Critical.

Just a thought..

Another thing: your English is excellent, but just too wordy to read thoroughly. If you could somehow reduce the wordiness while retaining the vocabulary, your posts would be even better than they already are - and the current quality is, to be straightforward, hard to beat.

At this point, I'm just nitpicking, really. The redundancies - for example, "to the fullest extent possible" (the term 'fullest extent' implies that the key aspects are already upheld as much as possible, and the term 'to the fullest' achieves the same meaning with less verbosity) - can derail the entire paragraph, depending on what they are and where they're located.

SuperTimo wrote: evrytime i attempt to land on that map my J-10 stalls just before the runway (its impossible to avoid or you will go too fast and hit the end fence), and hits the fence, or hits the end bit of the runway and bounces off, or yesterday i had a glitich where the nose wheel sank through the runway as i came in very hard.

Try hitting the ground in front of the fence so you bounce back up, fly over the fence and land on the run way. That seems to work pretty well. Not realistic, but neither is landing being impossible either

gclark03 wrote:Another thing: your English is excellent, but just too wordy to read thoroughly...

[R-DEV]fuzzhead wrote:I dont mind the list warren, but its a bit well, "cluttered" format IMO...

Yup, if you want I can chop it down sometime and restructure it. This post is basically one of the first few I had ever made in the PR forums and just kept going on from there.

I was simply sticking to the previous format to keep things as organized as possible. This is if someone happened to copy the list, they'd be able to easily identify the changes and updates made. So the person wouldn't have to go searching for the changes and could see the alterations made from previous posts aswell all in 1 shot. So yes, I know it isn't easy to read but it wasn't created with that purpose in mind. It was made more for adding, editing or removing content.

But like I said, I'll see if I can make it simpler to read sometime in the near future. It's just alot of data.

Please don't add a lock tone to HAT or decrease its damage anymore. It would be unrealistic and nerf it beyond sense.