Project Reality Forums

mrnothing wrote:Snipers in Afghanistan Receive New Weapon

Do you first of all understand the different between a squad marksmen, and a sniper ? find out that first and then maybe you'll understand what I'm trying to say. Again, for like i don't know how many times, even though the marksmen does have a rifle that can take out target's that a M4 carbine can't do, they still have to maintain there role as a squad member. Your going to be running to more then one spot, and the SL is probably not gonna give you your happy hour to take out target's you see. Why not let the sniper do that when he's in a position where he won't be revealed, but can still take it out. Who knows, maybe way before the squad realizes there was an enemy there.

mrnothing wrote:Your correct. The marksmen rifle is a bit of an extent. But marksmen rifle might not have the effective range as a sniper rifle does. In my POV, a soldier with a marksmen kit would still be in a squad, but giving longer range then the ordinary assault rifle, but still maintain the role as a squad member. With a Sniper, they would be positioned in a area or building where they could give information to the CO or SL, without blowing there cover or position. Sometimes, a marksmen would be good as a spotter for the sniper, because marksmen could give co-ordinates or directions to a target, but the sniper would have the capability to take down the target.


Also to point one more thing out, the sniper in a CQB area could be great as a counter sniper. Unlike a marksmen who would stay in his squad, a counter sniper could help with taking out other enemy sniper's who pose a threat to the squad and there objective. Again, with the role of a marksmen kicking in, the marksmen could give co-ordinates to the enemy sniper while in a squad, but the counter sniper would either take it, or inform other squads to attack that area or avoid or call in the CO to make a arti strike or air to ground strike.

daranz wrote:Ugh. You keep saying that WE don't understand the difference between a sniper and a DM, and then you tells us you want what is a sniper mostly by name and who he's attached to, and a DM by the way he engages targets. Really, try to read what people are saying instead of trying to hammer the same information into the thread over and over, ignoring the fact that most people are already aware of the differences.

Solid Knight wrote:Snipers can be used as area denial sentries and not just for "intel". You can have a single sniper control an entire street. It helps to have a semi-auto sniper rifle in this case. And given how a lot of the next generation sniper rifles are semi-automatic it appears that real world snipers agree. The premises being that they have to shoot targets in an ubran environment where there happens to be a lot of targets to shoot. His request for a more appropriate weapon isn't out of line and it shouldn't just be dismissed as "that's what the marksmen is for". No, that isn't what the marksmen is for nor is the marksmen rifle appropriate for long distance shots at multiple targets because it lacks the accuracy and the zoom to do that. It's a medium range weapon. They may have similar functions but they are different roles.

And from the various responses I see on this forum it appears that people really just hate snipers in PR anyway. Nearly every suggestion is to make the kit less desirable, harder to use, less functional, et cetera. When somebody makes a suggestion for improvement to enhance their abilities or role people seem resistant to accept.

The notion of a CQB sniper isn't as absurd as it sounds. In modern battle fields snipers also have to operate in urban areas which pretty much defines CQB. You may be thinking of CQB as in the actual engagement range itself but in this case he is describing the type of battlefield. You have to be prepared for close quarters battle in an urban environment even if you're intent is to shoot at long ranges. Hence why you will sometimes see snipers in Iraq with an M4 slung on their back. You will also note that they don't bother with ghille suits in an urban environment.

Solid Knight wrote:Snipers can be used as area denial sentries and not just for "intel". You can have a single sniper control an entire street. It helps to have a semi-auto sniper rifle in this case. And given how a lot of the next generation sniper rifles are semi-automatic it appears that real world snipers agree. The premises being that they have to shoot targets in an ubran environment where there happens to be a lot of targets to shoot. His request for a more appropriate weapon isn't out of line and it shouldn't just be dismissed as "that's what the marksmen is for". No, that isn't what the marksmen is for nor is the marksmen rifle appropriate for long distance shots at multiple targets because it lacks the accuracy and the zoom to do that. It's a medium range weapon. They may have similar functions but they are different roles.

And from the various responses I see on this forum it appears that people really just hate snipers in PR anyway. Nearly every suggestion is to make the kit less desirable, harder to use, less functional, et cetera. When somebody makes a suggestion for improvement to enhance their abilities or role people seem resistant to accept.

The notion of a CQB sniper isn't as absurd as it sounds. In modern battle fields snipers also have to operate in urban areas which pretty much defines CQB. You may be thinking of CQB as in the actually battle itself but in this case he is describing the type of battlefield. You have to be prepared for close quarters battle in an urban environment even if you're intent is to shoot at long ranges. Hence why you will sometimes see snipers in Iraq with an M4 slung on their back. You will also note that they don't bother with ghille suits in an urban environment.

viper759 wrote:i didnt plan to have to post this heh.

real life "CQB sniper"
YouTube - Battle on Haifa Street, Baghdad, Iraq


notice the rifle hes using, now notice the rifles other guys are using and then look at where they are.

Bringerof_D wrote:i wouldnt mind giving the Snipers a new rifle with Semi auto, i'm just saying it shouldnt be a new kit, nor should it ever be refered to as CQB sniper. it makes me shiver everytime i read it or type it. again however at the point where a sniper is looking down a road to deny the enemies the ability to cross said road in an urban environment, he would be using a a smaller caliber rifle not a 50.

@mrnothing: I understand completely what the suggestion is for and what you want AND i agree with what you want, but you simply arnt asking for the right things. from what i've read what would solve your request would be as simple as giving the marksman a scope with more magnification. a weapon can take any scope as along as the scope has the right mounting brackets so thats not un realistic. that or give the marksman a variable scope. sight in time wouldnt be an issue since it takes a while to adjust it anyways

what was unrealistic about your request would be a sniper being issued a 50 cal to hit a guy just across the street.

mrnothing wrote:oh no. don't get me wrong again ! I didn't exactly mean give them a new kit. Keep the same equipment the sniper would have all the time, when you play on a urban map (can't name them all exactly), there weapons and outfit would change to suit the conditions better.

and yes your correct, you could just give the sniper a M14 like how the DM does. But looking at today's military, a lot armies are adopting to a semi automatic sniper. There's gotta be something that makes it different from the M14. If there wasn't, why not just same some money and adopt a old, but still reliable weapon ?

I guess in a nut shell what im saying is it separates squad marksmen from a sniper.

and no lol, i never requested to add a 50 cal. I find it un realistic too because its not necessary to use a powerful round on soft target's within a small range if necessary. again, the 50 cal sniper is a anti material weapon used to stop vehicles or equipment.

mrnothing wrote:Your correct. The marksmen rifle is a bit of an extent. But marksmen rifle might not have the effective range as a sniper rifle does. In my POV, a soldier with a marksmen kit would still be in a squad, but giving longer range then the ordinary assault rifle, but still maintain the role as a squad member. With a Sniper, they would be positioned in a area or building where they could give information to the CO or SL, without blowing there cover or position. Sometimes, a marksmen would be good as a spotter for the sniper, because marksmen could give co-ordinates or directions to a target, but the sniper would have the capability to take down the target.


Also to point one more thing out, the sniper in a CQB area could be great as a counter sniper. Unlike a marksmen who would stay in his squad, a counter sniper could help with taking out other enemy sniper's who pose a threat to the squad and there objective. Again, with the role of a marksmen kicking in, the marksmen could give co-ordinates to the enemy sniper while in a squad, but the counter sniper would either take it, or inform other squads to attack that area or avoid or call in the CO to make a arti strike or air to ground strike.

Bringerof_D wrote:ok now you got me wrong, when i said give them a semi automatic rifle i mean give them a semiauto 50 cal.

pclipse_teh_owner wrote:In urban battle you don't shoot sniper distance anyhow!

mrnothing wrote:you never know unless your a sniper or former sniper yourself .....
I'm sniper's have had to deal with shooting target's from a long range to a short range.

Tirak wrote:You can if you so choose, get a marksman kit and act like a sniper, it's about mentality, not kit. You do not have to confine yourself the the role the kit may indicate, if you want to go off playing Urban Sniper with a Marksman kit, great for you, take up the role and use the weapon for it, but changing the Sniper kit to fit your idea of what it should be on some maps is not the answer.