Project Reality Forums

Caboosehatesbabies wrote:Yes, but in RL pilots also have survivalist and evasion training, and have a great deal farther then a maximum 4km to travel. However, the point remains that, while on the ground, a pilot does NOT go looking for a fight, and in PR that is exactly what the pistol was used for.

Project Reality is a constant struggle between reality and gameplay. We often say players are hardcoded, but when a very simple change that does not effect the INTENDED gameplay significantly can be made that stops a vastly UNINTENDED and wasteful practice, it should be done.

The simple fact is, the detriments of giving the pilot kit a pistol (paratrooper squads that waste tickets, Tk's for assets, and pilots trying to rambo it behind enemy lines) vastly outweighed the single benefit (self-defense in the RARE case that you survive being shot down AND fail at evasion).

All these claims of rambo pilots and paratrooper ticket wasters..

If you want to know the truth.. I've never seen these things happen at all ingame.

I might of seen one pilot sneaking around trying to get a few kills, but seriously. It's not as common as the mods and non-pilots who don't have an idea say it is.

Almost everybody is requesting the pistol to be given back, I'm sure the players should have a say in what happens. It also prevents people from having those fun "zombie games" that they do when they are bored. The pilot was always the perfect class. Not anymore.

The truth is.. Pistol vs automatic G3s is not a fair fight. When your going down in a parachute.. People will see where you land.

I know this for a fact because In .8 when i was shot down and tried to call for extract... first of all the red smoke is a dead giveaway, and the parachute isn't that helpful in masking where you land... So the enemy knows where i am, and they are comming to kill me with their automatic rifles. I'll tell you, I didn't get many kills like the claims talk about rambo pilots.

The point I'm trying to make is: Pistols really aren't that powerful weapons in PR. They won't have that big an effect that you guys are claiming they will. But they are much better than hiding like a little pansy hoping that the enemy don't spot you (They always will) If I or any Reasonable person sees a way to get back into the airfield, I will take it. I don't fancy running around with a pistol that barely kills and trying to kill enemies. If i wanted to do that, It's called the rifleman kit. Like i said before, i play PR because it is realistic, I and Everybody who plays this game enjoys realistic. This is what separates us from VBF2. Pilots get pistols in RL, not having them in PR is Unrealistic. Pistols save our lives, or even lets us have a fighting chance. We don't like getting shot unarmed... It's NOT fun.

Stop over-reacting and give us our rightful and realistic sidearm back!

Hope they take you prisoner, otherwise, game over, that's just the way it is.

Pilots I hope will stay they way they are if not more penalties. For once in my PR life pilots that survive a crash have been fleeing after touch down and making there way back to base. I even saw a rescue happen. From a enemy POV it was cool to see guys working together and pilots now have a new mission after touch down....make it home alive with out engaging enemy.

I've missed the pistol, too. (and NO i am not one of those Rambo players. i have enough training in one game for evasion and even sometimes that fails) there has been may occasions where my aircraft got hit and i ejected out. when the pistol was still here, i had at least a chance of surviving if i was sighted trying to conceal my position/ walk back to main. now, there's (basically) no chance of surviving if i get sighted. my record of getting back to main now is... 3%. before it was more of a 50/50 chance. watching the military channel, pilots of jets DO get a pistol for SELF DEFENSE (and a combat knife sometimes). I'd at least like to see the pilot kit include rocks and a knife to at least have a chance. (maybe make the pilot kit so it's worth more tickets) -edit- i was typing when u posted code red. sry -edit-

Its micro-unrealistic yes, but it leads to greater macro-realism, so it isn't a bad thing in my opinion.

The only reason people would use the pilot for the pistol is because in 0.8 (not 0.85) the rifles, how can I say, were incredibly inadequate. Basically meaning, pistol was a better choice for combat.

And if some guy lands near you and takes you out now in 0.85 with a pistol, you have got some serious squad problems going on.

i've never seen anyone tk waiting for a HUEY or something with pil... nm scratch that. i just want to be able to defend myself if i get spotted. but ya, if u get taken out by a guy with a pistol that just landed near u and one of your squad members shot him down, you REALLY got some squad problems, i agree.

Alex6714 wrote:The only reason people would use the pilot for the pistol is because in 0.8 (not 0.85) the rifles, how can I say, were incredibly inadequate. Basically meaning, pistol was a better choice for combat.

And if some guy lands near you and takes you out now in 0.85 with a pistol, you have got some serious squad problems going on.

Yes i agree. The pistol is like a peashooter now.

So why don't the pilots have the pistol?

They cannot go rambo with it OR parachute down in squads (it sucks)

Teamkilling is a server problem, NOT a game problem. (People TK for APCs and tanks also. I guess crewman should lose his weapon also!) - Also Keep in mind that most people run up to a heli and request a kit and then get in. So anybody who is waiting for a heli can TK w/ the rifleman kit and then run up and take a pilot kit from next to the heli.

So where is the problem? There is no reason why pilots shouldn't get the pistol back at all. It was a stupid mistake to take the pistol out of the pilots kit and there are absolutely no reasons why it shouldn't be put back in.

Koroush47 wrote:Yes i agree. The pistol is like a peashooter now.

Incorrect. While not as good as it was, the pistol is sill an excellent CQC weapon and I use it extensively when playing urban maps as a squad leader.

Koroush47 wrote: They cannot go rambo with it OR parachute down in squads (it sucks)

See above.

Koroush47 wrote: Teamkilling is a server problem, NOT a game problem. (People TK for APCs and tanks also. I guess crewman should lose his weapon also!)

Good point, but people TK more for air assets more then ground assets.

Koroush47 wrote: Also Keep in mind that most people run up to a heli and request a kit and then get in. So anybody who is waiting for a heli can TK w/ the rifleman kit and then run up and take a pilot kit from next to the heli.

This is incorrect. If you TK someone with a requestable kit, you cannot pick up ANY kit of the same team/type that they had for I believe 5 to 10 minutes. The game will kill you.

Caboosehatesbabies wrote:Incorrect. While not as good as it was, the pistol is sill an excellent CQC weapon and I use it extensively when playing urban maps as a squad leader.

This is incorrect. If you TK someone with a requestable kit, you cannot pick up ANY kit of the same team/type that they had for I believe 5 to 10 minutes. The game will kill you.

1. That only applies to tight urban areas. Not all pilot maps are urban. And I'm pretty sure that a MEC with a iron sight G3 would be much much stronger than a pilot with a pistol in CQC. With the new pistols, you would have to be pretty damn good at the game to actually "rambo" everybody.

2. Then why don't they just make it so that when a pilot uses a pistol to TK a pilot, they are slayed/punished somehow?
Fixes the tking problem, Makes every party happy (Besides the TKers), and it actually makes sense (below)

If ontop of a carrier a random pilot opens fire onto another pilot and guns them down.. somebody will notice and take action, Not let them waltz over to the huey and fly off.

Well removing a weapon for the purpose of stopping TKs, might as well remove every weapon then it is impossible to kill anyone on your team.

Admins would kick the guy anyway, and as it is now you can still TK away if you please, just before you get the kit...

Alex6714 wrote:Well removing a weapon for the purpose of stopping TKs, might as well remove every weapon then it is impossible to kill anyone on your team.

Admins would kick the guy anyway, and as it is now you can still TK away if you please, just before you get the kit...

Really no reason to remove it in the first place.

Big mistake if you ask me.

"1. That only applies to tight urban areas. Not all pilot maps are urban. And I'm pretty sure that a MEC with a iron sight G3 would be much much stronger than a pilot with a pistol in CQC. With the new pistols, you would have to be pretty damn good at the game to actually "rambo" everybody. "


So then we really need the pistol.....???

I guess I just don't get it.

I just can't get my head around why pilots absolutely NEED a pistol.

Can you please explain your reasoning again Koroush47?

From what I can gather the reason you're stating is that they should in PR because they do in RL. Ok, that is true. In RL a pilot would carry a pistol. But in RL he only has 1 life and the military has spent tens of thousands of dollars and years training him.

My argument against giving them a pistol is that it facilitates the ticket wasting paradrops.

Your argument in rebuttal to mine is that the paradrop is not an effective strategy, correct?

You're overlooking the fact that people don't CARE if it is not effective, they just wanna feel cool doing it.

I donno, I think the benefits of no pistol outweigh the detriments, I guess I just believe that if you were doing your job right as a pilot, you wouldn't need a pistol.

Nice explanation CHB, couldn't of say it better myself.

I thin kits pretty cool the fact that they have no pistol or knife.. adds to the challenge if you get shot down. But even some of you saying at least a knife isnt that just bringing back the tk factor?

No need to try to code the players.

If they want to be idiots and drop into enemy territory with a pistol, let them do it. They have the right to be stupid, and they also have the right to get shot in the face as a consequence.

As a compromise, just give pilots a knife instead of empty hands and the right to be stupid and get shot if they so please.

is there any we the kit could be made so that when it is picked up by the player it they can't pick up another one. Honestly if you make so that they can not get a new kit then the paradrops will stop. the TK's might come back but that is fixed by Admins passing out kicks and bans. If that doesn't work, the making a pic up kit do that, It should be made as a spawnable kit on maps with air vehicles and have it act like a civilian kit. With some rules, if the pilot has fun out they are okay to shoot if they put it away they can't be shot but must be arrested. That way both parties are happy, one gets their weapons back and the other gets no paradrops.