Project Reality Forums

First off, the hook is in the game to represent the ability to enter any building and get rooftop access, right.
Because hollowing all of the houses out isn't practical.
So why not add a higher falling distance without damage to represent the lacking ability to step down from objects by bending your legs or lowering yourself from higher distances?
When I'm on a semi-high object and have to go down, I do what most people do, I sit on the edge and slide off, I don't just walk off of it cause thats stupid.
But I don't have that option in the game.


And as Blakeman said, kits aren't always there, I don't see any on the models either so I guess we don't use them ingame except for rally points.
Not that we should use them, all the gear we have is worn on the vest anyway.

[R-DEV]Gaz wrote: Your argument is flawed. Adrenalin makes you run fast even though you're exhausted. Which you will be, mentally and physically after about 10 minutes of contacts. The average firefights are lasting 4+ hours in Afghanistan. It doesn't miraculously stop you getting injured, which is what you suggest. You jump off a wall onto concrete or uneven ground, or even flat grass, and you still run a high possibility of doing physical damage. The adrenalin may offset that pain, but it won't suddenly heal the damage for you.

I never said that adrenaline will miraculously heal you. I said it would give the increased awareness to be able to do what's in my next statement.

[R-DEV]Gaz wrote: LMAO, I've been serving 10 years, 7 of them as Air Assault, and I've obviously missed the vertical movement training we get trained on. Seeing as I run a lot of my unit's training, it seems someone has forgotten to mention that one to me Or do you mean the 6ft wall that you scale then jump off? With no kit on and your skid-lid on for safety reasons...

You're telling me that no one is told that falling flat footed is not a good idea? You'd think at least in Air Assault that soldiers are told the proper way of landing.

[R-DEV]Gaz wrote: Your third paragraph is valid, however, for the weight we are talking and the distance you drop, trust me, you will not stay on your feet. It's combat, not gymnastics.

It's 6 feet, number one. Number two, the extra weight is not all pressing down on one place, it's distributed throughout the body. Number three, the point is not to stay on your feet the whole time. If you can hit the ground with your feet properly, diving to the ground immediately afterward is perfectly normal, and may be encouraged because of the loss of balance. However, you do not suffer an injury, you just fall.

[R-DEV]Gaz wrote: That is not important at all. I wasn't suggesting reaching 100mph+ drop speeds. Crash a car at 30mph with no seatbelt on and experience the forces at work on your body. You'll still be thrown forward and hurt yourself. The whole POINT is that a 7 ft drop with a mass of 260lbs of kinetic energy coming to a complete stop is more than enough to do damage that may take that soldier out of the fight due to injury.

Of course I knew you weren't suggesting 100mph speeds. I was using hyperbole to show that your comparison of it to a car crash was unfounded, as it's 260 pounds going 6ft. It's definitely not a complete stop when you fall. If you just use your feet, it is. But if you fall properly, it's spread throughout the body, and the distribution of the decrease in acceleration doesn't immediately spread through the body, but it takes a little time. By the time it reaches your knees, the decrease in acceleration isn't as great as it is on your feet, by the time it reaches your hips, etc.

[R-DEV]Gaz wrote: No, the kinetic energy travels through the direction of least resistance. Legs vs ground. Ground wins. The force in which you hit it from that height with that weight will make you bend your knees from trying to absorb the shock so much that you will lose stability and fall over. It's the shock travelling up your legs.

First off, none of that really makes sense. First, kinetic energy is not a bullet, in this case, it's the ground, while energy does travel the path of least resistance, it is spread across multiple points.

Second, yes you will probably fall over. But, just falling over isn't the same as major injury. To recap, real life involves falling over. PR involves a bleeding injury requiring immediate use of a medic.

[R-DEV]Gaz wrote:This illustrates the forces involved in car crashes (think of it in terms of your knees (the car) and the ground (the wall) at 30mph. Not exactly a perfect speed to illustrate what I am trying to put across, but it proves the point.

Frankly, it doesn't prove anything. I understood what you were saying already, and above I have my arguments.

[R-DEV]Gaz wrote: Point proven I assume?

I assume not.

I congratulate you for your professionalism in this online debating, most people just start swearing, or start to call you names and bring up irrelevant topics to the debate.

See as I made the latter pic mocking the original is that its not a three foot drop. Which is why I mocked it as most gamers cant relate reality to a game. Like the whole "Why cant I run down stairs and not get hurt".

In fairness, what is happening is people are overreacting at the bleeding effect, I'm guessing people are losing about 10-20(max) HPs, but because the bleed effect is severe they are like WTF!?? I can tell you, 6 foot or more jump with bergen on your back + rifle + ammo = ow, you will at least jar something. Even with just webbing, you still are careful, the human body is a system which is asking to broken, and is quite easily damaged.

PR cannot simulate falling, nor can any other game. In real life, there are mutliple ways you can fall, things you instinctively do to stop hurting yourself(humans are remarkably good at protecting pur bodies; eg cramp happens because the body feels you are about to injure your muslces, so the body gives you lactic acid to cause pain = you stop), I think in PR it's fine, as long as you have a medic, it's 3-5 secs max of healing, and you can even do it while running if you are smart.

Calm down everyone... It was just a joke making fun of the dumb falling damage at the time. It was nothing serious, like every motivational poster.

'[SP-DEV wrote:Scot;965301']In fairness, what is happening is people are overreacting at the bleeding effect

You got it right, the whole problem is around this fact: the bleeding effect is just too much for such a slight injure. Maybe you are going to lose 5 HP falling from a stair, for instance, but blood will cover your entire screen anyways...

Chuc didn't get the "Ouch I sprained my ankle after I jumped form 7 feet" animations done....hes really just lazy, too busy tweaking the "I chipped a finger nail" animation.

What about the "will I break a nail?" option on the commo rose?

I think the point which has been raised twice and has still been ignored that I'd like to hear addressed is why can't we have a slightly higher fall limit to represent the ability to ease yourself down a ledge, something not represented in the game world.

[R-DEV]Gaz wrote:Where's your radios? Spare batteries? Various bits that need manpacked and cannot be spoken of on public forums? Humvees doing 5mph aren't exactly 7ft drops onto concrete or uneven ground. I'm talking from personal experience too, and I'm going to hazard a guess that that patrol you have pictured has vehicles in support to drop kit in. Not a foot patrol. If you are advancing to contact, you wouldn't last very long in terms of needing a resupply very quick. There's a big difference between manpacking kit and having a vehicle to dump stuff in

Radios are with the radioman, he has one and it is on him. A little extra kit. The Corpsman has a backpack he hauls that isn't too heavy. You act as if every time a patrol goes out it has to have 12 days worth of rations and a full command tent on every back. ( Amateur Dramatics maybe?)
Couple this with the fact that almost every PR map has a truck....and supply crate drops... and a 'main' base..

[R-DEV]Gaz wrote: My point is, pack or not, people will still have them to carry ammo, radios and specialist kit. Those who dont, choose to, simply because they have crammed full their pouches with everything they are required to carry. Hell, I've done a sniper op going out with 2 water bottles, 6 mars bars and 50 rounds of 7.62, my long and a Sig with 2 spare clips. Wouldn't make that mistake again, as that op went from a 12 hr op to 36 hrs.

But will even this small amount of kit make you require a medic from a 10 foot fall?

[R-DEV]Gaz wrote: Going for sensationalism there were we? Damaged ligaments take soldiers out of contact, meaning you're a bayonet down. I did not suggest their kneecaps would explode, so ease up on the amateur dramatics

PR as it is seems dramatic with the amount of damage taken from slow moving vehicle exits and small falls. We cannot hug a wall for a controlled decent over the top, nor it seems can the engine tell the difference between a humvee going 5 mph from one going 35 mph. My post was to illustrate the vast difference between the reality (my experience) and what is represented in PR (amateur dramatics as you put).

Duckmeister| wrote:I congratulate you for your professionalism in this online debating, most people just start swearing, or start to call you names and bring up irrelevant topics to the debate.

F**k off, you c**t. Happy?

Gaz what did you do air wise? I just thought you were a sniper?

Blakeman wrote:Radios are with the radioman, he has one and it is on him. A little extra kit. The Corpsman has a backpack he hauls that isn't too heavy. You act as if every time a patrol goes out it has to have 12 days worth of rations and a full command tent on every back. ( Amateur Dramatics maybe?)
Couple this with the fact that almost every PR map has a truck....and supply crate drops... and a 'main' base..




But will even this small amount of kit make you require a medic from a 10 foot fall?




PR as it is seems dramatic with the amount of damage taken from slow moving vehicle exits and small falls. We cannot hug a wall for a controlled decent over the top, nor it seems can the engine tell the difference between a humvee going 5 mph from one going 35 mph. My post was to illustrate the vast difference between the reality (my experience) and what is represented in PR (amateur dramatics as you put).

Must have missed the fact that I was originally on this team as a military advisor. Have you done time in Afghan? Seriously? I think you've played in Iraq, and that's about it. My amateur dramatics as you call it are reality. But I obviously know nothing. Nps.

Eddie, rip this prick a new one.

Gaz is mad

*gtfo's*

M.

[R-DEV]Gaz wrote:Must have missed the fact that I was originally on this team as a military advisor. Have you done time in Afghan? Seriously? I think you've played in Iraq, and that's about it. My amateur dramatics as you call it are reality. But I obviously know nothing. Nps.

Eddie, rip this prick a new one.

Ok? You obviously are taking this way to damn seriously and need to chill. I was just giving you a ribbing but you took it the wrong way, fine.

Honestly, if you are this serious about defending a video game then have it your way. You win the internets.

Your 'Played in Iraq' comment is insulting on so many levels and I am abhorred that your fellow devs let you talk like this.

In-game, do we have all this gear you keep saying everyone carries around? Blakeman should be a military advisor.

Gaz, you are being an extreme ******, you're trying to turn your argument from a "Afghan is more intense than Iraq" fight. Ridiculous.

I'm agreeing with blakeman on this:

I think you've played in Iraq

That statement is horrible. Do you understand how many U.S. and Coalition forces died, as you call, "playing in Iraq"

You're sick.

Yeah, locked. DEV's, feel free to re-open.

Blakeman wrote:Ok? You obviously are taking this way to damn seriously and need to chill. I was just giving you a ribbing but you took it the wrong way, fine.

Honestly, if you are this serious about defending a video game then have it your way. You win the internets.

Your 'Played in Iraq' comment is insulting on so many levels and I am abhorred that your fellow devs let you talk like this.

Caught me at a rather drunk time. However, some of your comments are quite ignorant. In case it hadn't escaped your notice, there's a few of us who have served in Iraq also. The last thing I would do is wish to be insulting to people's service, so don't be insulting to mine. It was only directed to you.

Feel free to carry on being abhorred.

bust331 wrote:In-game, do we have all this gear you keep saying everyone carries around? Blakeman should be a military advisor.

Gaz, you are being an extreme ******, you're trying to turn your argument from a "Afghan is more intense than Iraq" fight. Ridiculous.

I'm agreeing with blakeman on this:

That statement is horrible. Do you understand how many U.S. and Coalition forces died, as you call, "playing in Iraq"

You're sick.

Sick eh? Thanks. Afghanistan IS more intense than Iraq, but that is not the point of this thread. If you pull your head out of your *** and read my previous posts, I have covered all I need to to prove my point.

PS) I do know you f**king throbber. I've buried or attended the funerals of more than one. I've earned the right to call that war how I wish.

As mentioned before, there's always a reason, not just from a purely 'milsim' POV, but from a playtest POV, why things are in place as they are. Sometimes these are changed, sometimes they are tweaked. However, see my last few posts to know the reasons why we have the system currently in place.