Remove Or Update The Rifleman Anti-Personnel Kit

[Spec]

The thing is, PR doesn't have a story. I'd personally like it to have a story, but it doesn't, so we have no idea what sort of wars those are, if they all happen at once, or if each map is one out of many possible scenarios or whatever. If all the conflicts in PR happened within a few years from eachother, we have the old problem of having to somehow logically explain that with a background story. So far, this problem was simply ignored, and thus, logically, all related problems were.

With no story, there's no politics at all, and without politics, there's no policies, rules or anything. So we kinda agreed that the current rules are in effect in whatever situation PR shows us.


And at least in the Afghanistan-themed maps and the militia ones, the RoE might even be fully effective in PR's hypothetical storyline. Without story, we can't tell where the great war began and what age we're in anyhow.

Anyhow, vBF2 claymores suck for gameplay. Hell, even the avoidable, easily visible, defusable grenade traps do more harm than good already. A claymore which would possibly even come without visible trip line would be aweful gameplay wise.

Edit:

What I'd agree with, though, is giving the AP fellow the ability to remove their own mines (in their current form) plus possibly hostile ones and grenade traps. Would make the kit useful especially in insurgency games, without being too unrealistic. He's a bit of a minor demolitions expert then instead of a rifleman with claymores, I guess.

[Trooper909]

Update yes remove no.Its a great kit but highly situational witch is why its rarely requested. .Being able to move your claymores is a great idea as it would make it more mobile witch is where the kit really fails.

It would also remove the need to detonate you explosives If you do have to move.Good Idea for all explosive based kits actually.

[Bringerof_D]

the claymores are effective in many places, you just gotta think. on many more mountainous maps, there are only certain routes infantry can use to say walk up the side of a mountain. an Example being the Fools road, korengal, in certain places Archer, etc. There are very areas that infantry will use to get on top of a high feature. those are the best palaces to use them. Either place them along said path, or create a kill zone at the top of the path where they are likely to pause to let others catch up.

i agree with what some others have mentioned here, make it so a player can pick up the claymores.

[Bob of Mage]

What about factions that still use true AP mines? The MEC (only a few members would have signed it and even than the MEC is a new state so it's not bound by those signings), Israel, Russia, China, and the USA have all not signed the treaty. If those nations, plus groups like Hamas, use AP mines in real life they should have the option in PR. It's rather sad to ban a weapon for those factions that use just because some factions don't use it.

[Himalde]

I'd like to use it more, the major problem is that it takes a loooong time and a lot of ammo to set up a usefull trap. You spend most time walking back and forward to get ammo. Add 5 claymores to the kit and add the trip flairs and it would work a lot better.

[spiked_rye]

the major problem is that it takes a loooong time and a lot of ammo to set up a usefull trap. Add 5 claymores to the kit and add the trip flairs and it would work a lot better.

I agree that it's a major pain to actually set up a good defence, but I think 5 claymores would be excessive, considering a claymore weighs about one and a half kilos, and is quite bulky, but three would be a good number if the restock time was taken down.

Also yes agree with everyone who thinks that explosives should be able to be re collected, it's really annoying setting a trap up, then a flag gets capped, and you're now off the beaten track.

[Arnoldio]

3-4 clays per kit would be good, less walking abck and forth and mroe useful.

Kit is extremely useful, but in extremely rare situations, since here in PR people come in from all sides, there is no prediction most of the time...

But removing it, hell no.

[Phantom2]

I personally like the AP kit as a little ambush device when we are about to get overrun by enemy infantry. Just place them were you are, leave, blow them up. Look at them dead bodies. I also like it when I find a person who strayed too far from the squad. kill him, put a claymore, Run, wait for medic. Boom

[Stoickk]

Removing a claymore, real world, is actually a bit faster than emplacing one. It is a matter of unscrewing the shipping plug from the blasting cap well, removing the blasting cap, securing the cap in the wire spool (claymores, at least back when I used them, are not generally fired wirelessly) screwing the shipping plug back in, wrapping it all up and putting it back in the bag.

This is in comparison to the emplacement process that involves testing of the firing device (clacker) firing wire and blasting cap, physical emplacement sighting and camouflage of the mine, emplacement staking and camouflage of the firing wire, and all this after finding a suitable firing location within the length of the wire.

In terms of PR, I would love to see the ability to remove claymores. I would also like to see the ammo counts for the two detonation channels linked, so that it is up to the RAP how many are placed on which channel, versus being limited strictly to one blue and one yellow. This would be similar to deployed and undeployed modes on AR's and marksman rifles, or the Arty IED's for the Insurgents.

[mati140]

What about changing the detonation system this way - pressing detonator activates the sensor and makes it explode when s1 steps in front ot it. Next... and here comes the problem - maybe it would simply disable sensors? Or, maybe it would detonate it imediately? Or maybe both, depending on the kit version - one with activate-detonate system and the other one with active-disactive system?

Also there should be some disarm "weopon" for taking own mines (fast, unless armed) and enemy ones (slow, disarming first, maybe with some randomity factor that would make it explode in, let's say, 5% of situations?), also for combat engineer instead of wrench (while AP Rman would be able to disarm AP mines and granade traps only, Combat Engineer would have ability do disarm everything). It may be simply hands with a, let's say, knife and a screwdriver, or just hands, that would move like when healing after pressing the firebuton.

Alternatively some minigame would be made for disarming, so player would actualy need to take some time learning to be a combat engineer / minesweeper, making those kits more important ones - togeather with giving more explosives to both teams, that would make CE and AP kits necessery (ATM CE isn't used to much).

Sorry if some ideas are reposts of reposts.

[40mmrain]

I only use rifleman AP on the taliban or militia due to obvious spots for cache defence.

What's the exact limit for claymores at once?

Increasing the amount of clays at once would drastically improve it's usefulness.

[Stealthgato]

Needs more clays to be carried at once. By the time I'm done setting up an effective layer of claymores the enemy has already gotten the objective I was trying to deny them.

[BulletPr0of]

I slightly disagree with the majority of points saying how limited it is, there are so many choke points found in urban maps, especially muttrah, they can easily be used to cover doorways, alleyways, gateways etc; and even if they are seen they can act as a deterrent to the assaulting team, tunnel networks are where the kit really shines, although I strongly feel the kit is only as good as the person holding it, on open maps, you can place them and use them to fall back on, directing the enemy towards the kill zone. The kit has to be used with some thought.

However I do agree on the ability to pick them up, maybe skinning a simple pair of pliers, or a multi-tool, with the effects a wrench has on a mine, but for all AP mines, inc. grenade traps and drop it in the #2 weapon slot. Or if the pliers thing is unrealistic, just go with what ever method is used, bare hands, just a weapon slot that gives the impression and ability to disarm AP mines.

Also I think that spamming the kit with more clay's is the wrong way to approach it, I personally feel for balance sake, they should be left to strategic placing, rather than being spammed, if you're in a position to need 4 claymores the chances are you'll be close to an ammo supply, and if not, just take a squaddie with you, carrying ammo.

[Tachidude]

I agree with the idea of disarming the clays, maybe even add the ability to do it with pipebombs. This will make the kit more useful on ins maps and will provide more mobility for rifleman AP, you dont have to stick to one place where you set up some clays, you just remove them in a manner that combat engineer does with mines. This will make the rifleman AP some kind of squad's explosives specialist.

[Capt. J.Smith[26MEU]]

I also agree with having the RiflemanAP with some sort of tool to remove or disable the Claymores or pipe bombs. In the military, to defuse a claymore can be simple by defusing the blasting cap. People can also use the kits properly if they know how to or have experience with them on Insurgency or AAS with the Blufor. We use that kit all the time and the results alone have proven to be affective. I also agree with having the kit hopefully for a spawn kit like the sapper for Insurgents.

[Cossack]

Why there is not ability to make it claymores as tripwire - it would made more sense using this kit. But thinking as it is now, its suitable for static defense organization.

[qs-racer]

Yes, the possibility to have one wire claymore and one remote claymore could be nice for the bluefor faction

[velocity]

Why there is not ability to make it claymores as tripwire - it would made more sense using this kit. But thinking as it is now, its suitable for static defense organization.

Because almost no country uses claymores with tripwires in case a civilian walks over it.

Google Ottawa Treaty

[Psyko]

the issue i see is manpower. it means dedicating a man to staring at a perimeter, where most of the time the squads rely on their weapons being very portable. literally everything is portable except mines. Even HMG and TOW emplacements can be considered portable.

If they could be lifted that might change things, might.

[kangaroo]

I think the AP kit would be more useful if you could actually pick up your claymores. That way you can quickly throw them down when your squad takes up position in a building, making an improvised ambush or something else, then bring them with you to the next objective.

Thats exactly what I was thinking! It sucks how you cant pick up your claymores after you use them, it would also be useful if you could lay down more trip flares im thinking up to 20 for the bushy areas on the map. Also it would be really really handy if you could set of the claymores in smaller groups or individually, I was thinking maybe if you had the detonator out and you clicked onto the claymore on your scroll bar again it could bring the detonator up to your screen where you could select 5 boxes for the 5 claymores that you want to go off. that way you don't lose all your claymores when you only need to blow 1 or 2 at once.