[Request] PR Vietnam - Mapping Appeal

[Sgt. Mahi]

Yup those are some really ugly maps. Got to look through them today. There's only on map I would even consider, which is Course of the River but honestly you can almost make a EOD2 map in a couple of days so there wouldn't be a point. I might start something from scratch for fun but it's gonna be a slow process.

[AfterDune]

You could audit Operation Ghost Train if you like .

[Sgt. Mahi]

I was actually thinking about that when I saw the map was included but I thought you guys already would have done that. I was also thinking about Bi Ming?

But if you like I will go ahead and work on OGT

[AfterDune]

They're both in the files, yet have no new GPO yet, since we haven't really focussed on it (other maps do have new GPOs, just not these two). But sure, go ahead and pick one.

Make sure to create a new thread for that though .

[Sgt. Mahi]

I'll look into it this evening and see if I can make a thread about it at the end of today. Did you wanted me to make a thread in the community map section or PR:V section?

[AfterDune]

I think that location is fine, sure.

[sharpie]

Guess who starting mapping..

Still doing the basic tuts, should take me another...month to get through them all, but when that is all done-it's map making time baby.

[Tomking]

I'm not ready to post in the map thread yet, but I wanted to discuss my idea before I progress any further.

As I mentioned a while back, I was interested in the first battle of the ia drang valley at LZ Xray. I'm basing the fighting on SRTM geo data and a little creative freedom for gameplay's sake. For history about the battle please wiki it. Just know that the NVA forces out numbered the US some 1500:200 men. Gameplay will simulate that but not in such a crazy ratio.

Here is a mini map. A brief description of the game play concept will follow.



BLUFORGoal - Maintain control of the Landing Zone and surrounding Flanks in order to destroy NVA forces.

Pros - Close Air Support, Artillery and Helo Transportation.

Cons - On low open ground, out numbered by massive amounts of NVA forces.

OPFORGoal - Destroy US Forces and Regain Control of the Valley.

Pros - Elevated Flanking Positions. Large Numbers of Reinforcments.

Cons - Lacking Close Air Support, Artillery and Helo Transportation.

[Rhino]

Keep the US Main as far away from the fighting as possible, so shove it right in the top right hand corner but also try to conceal the surrounding terrain from inside the main base, like put a barrier between the edge so players on the ground can't see the difference and make the surrounding terrain look as close as possible to the normal terrain

Also I'm not sure 2km is really large enough for such a map.

[Tomking]

There are several reasons why I opted for a 2km. I think the benefits outweigh the drawbacks considering the scenario I'm trying to recreate. 4km would be too much.

Some base reasons would be:

1) Denser vegetation. I want the whole map to be dense jungle. 4km would spread the statics out.

2) Small engagement area. The battle is over the clearing. So it will be broken into 4 CP's and the battle will be focused in a predestined location. The 4km map would have a lot of wasted space and useless statics.

3) Actual Battle. The clearing in real life was about the size of a football field. I'm not wanting to recreate the whole valley and make a full on AAS4 map because it would not portray the event realistically.

_______________

When this map progresses further I would really like to simulate a battle in the terms of the real event.

The US inserted solely by Air Cavalry and had no other means of transportation because of the dense jungle. The NVA strongholded themselves in the region due to the safety from enemy ground vehicles. So having choppers only is the plan. I know this is risky in the event that no pilots are available, but that seems to rarely be case on most servers. "People sure do love their assets."

In reality US Firebase Falcon was so far away that the fighting just took place in and around the clearing. The US infantry had orders to not enter the mountians. Therefore I want to make both bases out bounds for either team. The fighting is for the landing zone CP's only.

_____________

Gameplay:
The NVA will have a huge ticket advantage. But will have to face off against a lot of heavy bombing by the US. If either team caps out the Clearing CP's the enemy team will start a bleed. The team to destroy all enemy reinforcements first will be Victorious.

Also, doesn't pushing main bases too close to the edge cause mumble crashes or something like that?

Thoughts?

[lucky.BOY]

What will be tha cap order? I cant see the creek, foot hills and mountain trail flags being capped in some order, can they be available all at once? So US basicly capture LZ and then can attack the remaining in any order.

Idea n.2, You could make Lz the first flag, then kinda divide the second flag into mountain trails and river creek, which would be both cappable simultainously, and when they are both captured, the foot hills would become cappable, being the last flag, and capping it would make NVA ticket bleed.

I am also wondering how the spawning of NVA will be handled, but its maybe too soon to dicsuss this. Anyway, IMO you cant put the initial spwnpoints too close to the LZ, because when hueys would come, there would be whole vietnamese team waiting for them.
but when you put them further away so US get a chance, they cant walk that distance all round long.

They could get a delayed spawnpoint belonging to each flag except for LZ. If NVA holds the flag and its not the start of the round, they would have a spawnpiont available a little bit behind the cap zone.
Possible problem - What if americans capture the flag? Can we make the spawnpoint available only for one side?

- just my thoughts.

[Tomking]

@ Lucky
During the real event the US Calvary landed at the Clearing and secured the LZ. Then once under fire, 3 companys each took a flank and gaurded it. See LZ X-Ray for more information.

The Blufor will have to capture the Clearing Flag first before the 3 flanking CP's become available.

All 3 flanking CP's will be active at once because the NVA attacked the US troops from all sides.

The NVA will start by capping the 3 flanking CP's in any order before they can then capture the clearing CP.


**To answer the rushing comment by the NVA team - they will need to travel some challenging terrain in order to get their and it would be wiser time spent building reinforcment FOBS in the mountains rather than rush the clearning.

[Rhino]

You forgot the main advantage of a 4km map for this scenario, distance between the US Main base and the main combat area which tbh, is a huge factor in order to get this concept to work well. A 10sec chopper ride isn't going to be very immersive, nor at all good for gameplay with choppers being able to do lots of short trips. As you said in re/l the main base was very, very far away, you should be doing everything you can do simulate that and also if you want to have CAS a factor at all in this map, it needs to be 4km for that too (even if the nearest firebase didn't have a runway, you can still give it one to simulate other bases providing air support)

You can still do everything you want, other than yes, you will have to slightly sacrifice your vegetation density BUT what you can do is have dense veg round the main combat area, with having only light vegetation around the areas which are just for flying over, and when I say light what I mean is big trees, that are not quite as dense as the normal area but most importantly, no bushes under the canopy layer.

I also would place a lot of the overgrowth via static and have only the main trees etc as overgrowth.

[Tomking]

The actual firebase falcon was about 16km away from the landing area. I agree that a 4km map would add immersion to the chopper ride. Vegtative densitys could be altered to optimize the experience around bases and camps. I agree with all of those statements. But I just don't feel like I'm trying to create an immersive chopper ride over an immersive combat experience. Not to mention the effect that spreading out to 4km has on terrain. The Jungle Floor is going to be difficult to traverse. 4km maps spread out the polygons available on the heightmap. I just don't know if making this a 4km is worth the extra time and effort just for a longer supply line for US forces.

Is there anywhere I can learn more about how FOBS, CAS, Arty, Deployables and such are going to work in PR:V? Or can I assume it will function as BF2 R does?

[Tomking]

Is anyone currently working on NVA base statics?

[Alek-say]

Any news about the map?