Required Spotter kit to request sniper kit

[MikeDude]

This already happens with squad names. There's no need to force your system of structure on everyone.

For example, with the sniper kit requiring a spotter, does that include the Taliban, Rebels & Hamas too? It could be argued that those factions run snipers in real life without spotters.

Just because the US never sends a sniper in without a spotter doesn't automatically make it the best practice in every situation. Especially when we're talking about a video game encouraging teamwork rather than following reality exactly.


Just because a person isn't in a squad and is off on their own with a sniper kit, that doesn't automatically mean they're not a teamwork oriented player. I've seen lots of lone snipers who are a great asset to the team. Sniper kit off alone might hint at useless COD kiddie, but it isn't always. So, I reject this suggestion on the basis that I don't want to restrict snipers, because I've witnessed them operating alone effectively.

You sir, have no idea what you are talking about.

[Portable.Cougar]

From time to time I will have a member of my inf sq take a sniper kit. It is used just as any other asset is. In support of the squad / team.

It would be a shame to lose this ability so that we can pander to the lowest common denominator, the lone wolf.

[SpectrePR]

Sniper and spotter team play is already "encouraged", as it is simply more effective. No need to restrict good players because of bad players mistakes.

[Truism]

Oh look, it's this thread for the eleventy billionth time.

Same misinformation encouraging role playing.

Protip: Spotters don't fulfill any real function in PR. In real life, spotters are necessary to adjust for distance and windage. Since PR has no ballistics, you're role playing.

Inb4
"But close quarters defence and a rope!"

What do either of these things have to do with spotting or realistic sniping?

Oh, right, nothing.

Enjoy your forced role playing. You asked for it.

[badmojo420]

"Force your system"? Chillax man. This entire game and these forums is about development, we discuss ideas here, and the Devs decide on what they like and don't like implement it as they see fit.

There isn't anything really in place to protect an asset squad's choice to run the assets they took charge of. Squad names don't reserve your Squad anything if the server isn't perfectly Admined. I've had Sniper teams break down a lot because others were taking the kit that were not in a Sniper squad.

There is no real need for a regular squad to take the Sniper kit, if that kind of return fire is needed take the DM kit and leave the asset for those who create the squad. The DM kit is very affective now.

There is nothing stopping any random squad from taking the Sniper kit. How many times have you seen a Trans, or Armor squad with a Sniper in it, or even a regular INF with a Sniper.

I'm personally all for Snipers operating on their own in supporting the team. That is why I am for a system that would support an actual consistent Sniper team for the whole match.

Just last night I was on a Sniper team and then the whole battle shifted right to us and we were suddenly in the middle of the action, where we didn't need to be. We tried to egresses, and got killed. We could not get the Sniper kit back, and the squad then broke down, and we all broke off into other squads. The SL of this squad was running it very well with the Spotter kit also, not just screwing around.

I'm simply discussing the idea posed in this thread. Telling me to take a chill pill because I don't agree with your point of view is pretty childish. I respect your right to post and support ideas for development of PR, the least you could do is respect my right to disagree with them.

I called it forcing a system of structure on us because it does nothing but restrict people who don't follow your ethics. Servers are free to set their own rules and enforce them. If server owners want squads named sniper to be in charge of the sniper kits, they'll make it a rule. When you change the game like the OP suggests you're making that decision for them.

Also, there's no actual way to achieve what you guys want to achieve. All that this suggestion would do is make it slightly more difficult. A player could easily join a squad request the spotter, leave the squad, wait a minute, join another squad(or the same one again) and request the sniper kit. Or like mentioned already, just get someone in the squad to pickup the spotter kit until you have the sniper kit, then they drop it.

The example you gave of losing the sniper kit from the sniper squad would still happen with this suggestion.

You sir, have no idea what you are talking about.

You sir, have no idea how to contribute to a discussion.

[Cpt.Future]

Why are you guys even discussing this?

The sniper kit is incredibly useless compared to the marksman kit.
The spotter kit is incredibly useless compared to the squadleader kit.

If newbies think playing as a sniper is cool or effective, just let them.


It's just as Truism said, sniper squads are role playing and nothing else.

[Cpt.Future]

Snipers and sniper teams are useless in PR.

Snipers are not there to report enemy movements and lase targets, they have their rifle to engage targets at long distances, but that's useless in PR.
People who get shot at long ranges will get revived and then the sniper can easily be taken out by an MG or marksman.
Also the sniper rifle is way too loud, makes no sense at all (while the USMC marksman alt even has a supressor lol).

UAV is way better than the spotter for lasing targets so that kit is currently useless too (inferior to the squadleader kit anyway).

Just remove the sniper kit, because it's a leftover from older version of PR when it was actually a good kit.

Remove GTLD from squadleader kits. Make the UAV less effective for lasing targets. Change the spotter kit into a "forward air controller" kit, so the infantry squads can have one rifleman who is able to mark targets for air support.

The current sniper/spotter system is a mess. You can tell that the DEVs tried to enhance teamplay and make lonewolfing harder, but sniper teams have no purpose in PR. Seriously.

[Spook]

Yep I would never take a sniper anymore. Marksmen are much deadlier now. More ammo, you got nades and you can use the rifle on short distance aswell. Even if I would be a public lonewolf Id rather join a 4men squad and steal a marksmen than a sniper ...good thing all the newbs still think the sniper is the most leet weapon ingame. That way they can have their fun and are not blocking any good effective kits.

[Brooklyn-Tech]

in all honesty i would remove the requirement for there to be 2 people in the squad to be able to request the sniper kit. it only encourage people to join squads to steal the kit and leave. Also i think it should be possible to request the second sniper if there is already one present in the squad (if you lower the max amount of snipers per team from 2 to 1, that would be even better).

if someone is antisocial i dont think we could force them to to play with others by implementing rules such as these.

ALSO:

I think there should be a greater amount of spotter kits available. I think a minimum of three per team. There is no reason why a player must go into harms way to recover something like a spotter kit just because he happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time.

[Dogbox]

Don't make it necessary to have a spotter kit for a sniper kit. That would kill the game-play concept of the sniper.

I love the point Truism made. > Ranges < It's not a big factor whilst using a sniper. Just point and shoot. Don't over-constrict PR ffs. At least keep it playable. Like the Ins team that got nerfed to shitbits (Game-play got shredded for Realism) but the new Arty Ied kit is great.

The other point that was made; Yeah, the marksman is pretty awesome now, most people do still have the mentality to get a sniper kit badly instead of going for the marksman.

[Death!]

So, let me figure this out...

Snipers now:
1 - Do not have GLTD
2 - Do not have a radio
3 - They can't act like a full Squad Leader (no rally point ability)
4 - Most 1337 snipers (as I saw commenting on this thread) don't want the spotter + sniper system implemented

Why ON EARTH this USELESS kit is still ingame, then? Seriously... Why do we still have a kit which, right now, is not team oriented and a lonewolfing K/D jerking stimulator?

I totally vote for the spotter + sniper system, otherwise you can remove the sniper kit from the game forever. Of course some kids will cry, but I think everybody will get benefits from it. I freaking hate when someone gets in my squad and takes a goddamn useless sniper kit... I even saw a guy, from a well known clan, sniping alone on Black Gold Inf! Dude, you can't see 50 meters away with that sandstorm! This is the worse kind of lonewolfing ever.

Please, Devs, implement it.

[Heavy Death]

Yesterday somebody joined my squad, took the sniper kit... i kindly asked him why... His response was "To snipe people, duh." The rest of my squad jumped on him like wolves, asking for permission to TK, but ofcourse, we arent kids. So that guys went into CQB... with his sniper kit. And when everybody got killed by the incompetency of the squad, he was the only one alive and said with a smartas attitude "Hah, oh yeah, im done with you people." Needless to say he died 2 seconds later after leaving the squad, lawl.

See, this kind of shit. I talked to him nicely, no agression, i had to calm my squad down, and he was still a stubborn *******. When an animal is severely sick, like this guy... you put it down.

[Gracler]

Don't make it necessary to have a spotter kit for a sniper kit. That would kill the game-play concept of the sniper.

I love the point Truism made. > Ranges < It's not a big factor whilst using a sniper. Just point and shoot. Don't over-constrict PR ffs. At least keep it playable. Like the Ins team that got nerfed to shitbits (Game-play got shredded for Realism) but the new Arty Ied kit is great.

The other point that was made; Yeah, the marksman is pretty awesome now, most people do still have the mentality to get a sniper kit badly instead of going for the marksman.

Restrictions is what PR is built on as it "forces" realism since we all know that players will bunnyhop.... if they could.... they would use tanks solo..... if they could.... and so on and so on.

Right now players use the sniper kit solo because they can, not caring about wasting a server slot. I lean towards removing the sniper kit since it is getting obsolete to the marksman and it draws too much negative attention.

[=]H[=TangFiend]

Have my fingers crossed this or something close gets implemented.

I'd prefer if an in squad spotter kit was necessary to request a sniper.

This one is all pros and no cons except for the few empty cans who seem to be crying and rattling the most.

Obviously the restrictions on the spotter kits would need a tweak to make this work, no problem.

There are many other similar restrictions in Project Reality already that force teamwork even if they are a tad unrealistic. Heavy assets are require multiple players. The construction of emplacements requires multiple people, despite could totally be done solo irl.

Kit limiting is in itself a total gameplay restriction to force teamwork, obviously if this was some huge issue than no one would play. The very ability to capture a strategic objective requires at least TWO people. If you think about it, really what would make two dudes at a building any different than one in terms of it being secure.

The very spirit of Project Reality is restriction and modification of Vanilla Battlefield 2 mechanics to create a play style with heightened realism and team oriented gameplay.

The lone Sniper running solo skylined up on some highest hill or in some predictable clocktower trying to bingo everyone just seems like such leftover from Vanilla behavior.

[Mikemonster]

The cynic in me says though that it remains in order to entice people to the mod. It does make for some good 'be like a REAL SF SNIPER' pics that encourage new players to aspire to this 'role'. Which is great to be honest, I don't mind if that's the case.

I did argue about a year ago that the Sniper kit should be removed and replaced with a spotter kit (so that all this 'recon' can be done by the people that need the kit to 'spot for the team').. I never thought it'd be used as well as the sniper, lol.

I seriously doubt anyone would make a recon squad if there was no 1-shot-kill gun to be used from just beyond view distance.