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Yes, thanks for doing this guys!

I would be up for helping out with testing the improvements under different scenarios (preflaring, different flare ejection frequencies, various flight directions while flaring etc). If i can be of help with further testing, let me know.

DogACTUAL wrote:Arab, when you are testing the flare effectiveness, make sure you are aware of this issue:



Thanks for your efforts!

I think what you posted described only how it feels based on visual tests but that cannot be true when i look how refarctor engine works.
I'll will explain:

If your air vehicle get damage caused by the explosionradius only (splash damage), the ObjectTemplate.armor.defaultMaterial jumps in because Refractor Engine cannot handle multiple damagezone damage for splash damage.

It can only handle :
Direct Hit damage = here the vehicle armor materials for each zone jumps in.
Splash Hits = armor.defaultMaterial jumps in.
Direct Hit damage in combination with a followed explosion (including splash damage). That the overkill damage variant. Here, you get both damage sources.

What i know about PR's jets is a big bunch of jets, (i didn't checked all) have the same tweaks except the A-10 (maybe froogfoot too but idk).

armor.defaultMaterial 32 (A-10 =184)
armor.hitPoints 1800 (same for A-10)
mapMaterial 0 Airplane 32 (A-10 =184)

What i know about AA missiles is that they have 2 damage sources and sharing the same SplashDamage material and Direct Hits damage material.

Splash (radial) damage/material :
detonation.explosionDamage 550 / 750 / 900
detonation.explosionMaterial 53

Direct Hit (projectile) damage/material:
damage 750
material 53

So in generall the gameplay is like this.

Damaging Material 53 with damagecodes for splashdamage 600 - 900
Damaging Material 53 with damagecodes for direct hits 500 - 750

Compared vs. jet armor/defaultarmor materials 32 and 1800 HP's

When i look into the materialmanagersettings.con and look how Refractor handles the damage:

MaterialManager.createCell 53 32
MaterialManager.damageMod 7.5

Each damage source value get multiplied by 7.5

The main damage comes of from the explosion damage but i heard it get reduced (or maybe not) over distance. How much it get reduced, or if there is any damage fading out, idk.

Splashdamage values excamples :
600 x 7.5 = 4500 - distance damage loss
750 x 7.5 = 5625 - distance damage loss
900 x 7.5 = 6750 - distance damage loss

vs. 1800 HP

The minimum damage of a direct hit with the weakest missile ingame is 3750 and that vs. 1800 HP's. Here is no damage reduction.

I would suggest to reduce the damaging material multiplier.
On a map with 2 jets are atleast 2 opposite site jets, a manpad, altleast 1 AA vehicle and 3 fob-stinger emplacemnts.


But here we come to the next missile bug that need a fix, the secondary ghost missile.
I never experienced myself because i'm not a fly boy but what i saw from YouTube clips is that this ghost missile kills friendlies via Direct Hit or can someone say more about that.

What i suspect with the ghost missile bug is that after the explosion damage the main projectile continoues flying direction next heatsource and kill it because it cause enough damage in an armored zone.

BRUHH...



Thanks for the detailed breakdown of the specifics.
But i basically already knew the general mechanics of what you explained about how the damage system works, and that there is seperate explosion and impact damage and explosion radius and that vehicles don't have different armour materials for explosion damage.
I also browsed a lot of .tweak files and the material manager.

Yet as you can see what i described happens nonetheless.
Which is the point i was trying to make when i posted this:

You think you can perfectly predict how things will behave ingame by just looking at the relevant code, but you always end up either missing something in the code or forget to account for other factors that you didn't deem relevant to the issue.

So what do you think is going on? Do you think the missile explosion might trigger a bit too late? But if you run my video in slow motion it looks like the explosion effect is very close to or even right on the jet? Seems very strange.

Question to the Devs.

PR is able to simulate critical damage on tanks and apc's. The new method is now adding heat to such weapons to prevent firing with damaged turret weapons.

The old system was that the server REMOVED the weapon from the vehicle on critical damage.

Can we do the same by pressing the flarebutton and the heatobject from the jet get removed for few seconds?

So only the heatobjects of the flare are present for few seconds and the missile should not redirect to other heatobjects.

If the pilot flares to late, the jet should be in splashdamage area.

Edit:
I watched again your clip. At 1.04 - 1.14 i noticed on the second view that the AA missiles have an unnatural agilty and can make 90° to 180° turns. I believe this abilty (ObjectTemplate.follow.minDist 0) on value zero cause this. You can clearly see that the missile will pass the jet but than the unnatural agilty comes into play and biting your ***.

And what i dont understand why you got hit 1.07 but 1.08-9 your not even started smoking under same conditions.

So what do you think is going on? Do you think the missile explosion might trigger a bit too late? But if you run my video in slow motion it looks like the explosion effect is very close to or even right on the jet? Seems very strange.

You running a own version of testairfield or the official one?

You could add changes to each missile via tmp.con. You could add a projectilecam for the guy who shot the missiles and he could record it and you can analyze it in SloMo. Here you will find an answer.

But i'm sure you know that already.

No i actually didn't know that.

The footage for the video was recorded on the PRTA training server.
Can you explain how to do that (or maybe we can work together and test this ourselves)?

The problem is i dont know if you can mod a tmp.con serverside only without needing a new map. Serverside you can change numbers or values but adding stuff to tmp.con

The thing with the tmp.con is easy to understand. The tmp.con can change things of any tweak in the mod and you can also add things to a tweak.

Its done via activeSafe. You name the Object you want to modify ObjectTemplate.activeSafe xxxxxx and than you can change values or add codelines
Open con file with Notepad and add this lines. Maybe there already somelines so dont touch them.

tmp.con

ObjectTemplate.activeSafe GenericProjectile stinger_missile
ObjectTemplate.useProjectileCamera 1

Done.

You could also remove things by adding this codeline

ObjectTemplate.removeTemplate missile_gravity_force.
If you want to change some settings add the codeline in the tmp with the new value


You can change many things at the same time via maps tmp.con without changing the whole mod at all.

Problem is to have a server with someone who have access to the server and he/she is able
all time to change the tmp.con settings and start up the server for testing.

Thanks for explaining.

Problem is to have a server with someone who have access to the server and he/she is able
all time to change the tmp.con settings and start up the server for testing.

DEVs have a testing server that qualifies for that.