Project Reality Forums

Today I suffered an incident that left me thinking, is an abusive SL subject to punishment? And most importantly, how can we identify one?

Just now in Karbala - in a very good mumble promoting server - this SL kept getting pissed and kicking members for making "stupid mistakes" in his view, even though none of them were even slightly grave. Eventually the squad was downsized to 4 (the Specialist kicked for being "an idiot and incompetent" and the medic "slow" even though it was clear he was a newbie), in which I was eliminated because I was holding our position in a tight passageway against a techie and a couple of insurgents (AR role). He demands me to cross the street - exposing ourselves even further - but since I took a few secs to reload behind cover, he insults me and kicks right after. At this point all squad members get slaughtered in the street (dazed, me included) and he returns back only to get a bullet in his head. A heated argument followed with him stating to the sky that he has played PR since the beginning and for me to get back to COD.

So I'm just wondering, in these particular cases, do SLs have complete free role to do whatever they please?
What defines an act of "being serious" or an a-hole?
How can an admin act in conformity?

If you dont like the SL or if he is being an A-hole just leave his sq

I don't understand why people remain in squads with ********* SLs?...

If you don't like a squad, leave it, join or make another, if no1 joins their squad then they'll soon leave/become a squad member, or people who like their style will join.

If no squad slots are avaliable, and the squad leader really is being a ******, then an admin should sort him out and you use the process that the specific server uses to report problems.

I have occasionally been a bit douchy as a SL, but I've generally apologised to my victims after counting to 10 however I do kick for repeated stupidities, like driving into water etc or disobeying repeated orders.

However some players DO like SLs who are super serious and all that, and if thats the way they want to be led then thats fine. However if you don't like ur SL you should definately move on, he's got his own ideas on how to play the game, and as teh leader of the squad he's got to get you into his mindset, if you don't want to be in his mindset, then you leave that squad; lead me, follow me or get out of my way.

You aren't forced to be under a specific squad leader, and you aren't forced to lead a specific squad member; so just find the squad you wanna be in. I generally squad lead because I have a specific play style, and I make my squad members conform to that style with input from them, but still my style and rules.

So I'm just wondering, in these particular cases, do SLs have complete free role to do whatever they please?
What defines an act of "being serious" or an a-hole?
How can an admin act in conformity?

you have to refer to the individual server's rules

Some server think swearing is bad enough, some servers think that taking your squad to some far corner of teh map is kickworthy. Actual abuse is definately not on in my opinion and admins should protect players from that as much as possible; if you are abusing another player then you need to log off PR and play a single player game for a while.

you can also report them for being abusive and stuff, most servers will probably kick him after a warn if keeps being a ****.

also theres nothing wrong with being serious, i like serious SLs, but every now and then you get these derps (quite literary derps) that think they are the messiahs of PR, just ignore them and leave their squad if you ever find your self in one.

[R-DEV]Rudd wrote:I don't understand why people remain in squads with ********* SLs?...

I don't. This particular episode lasted 10 minutes without me being able to saying anything back since I was constantly engaging enemies.

The point is that even people leave the squad it will steal minutes out of a few players along time (since they can't identify that SL in particular) and ruin the fun. It only takes a couple of minutes to set the relaxed mind of a player into a raging beast, therefore hurting the team overall as well.

I did reported by the way, but in the mind of an admin he has no idea what is the full story.

I understand this is just me ranting and exposing the risks of playing with the random crowd though.

dtacs at his best again

(just kidding tacksie )

The way I see it:

- He made the squad
- You/others joined it
- He didn't force you to stay (unless all the other 9 squads were full/locked and no-sq-kick was enabled?)
- He deemed certain members' performance to not meet his squad's expectations
- He removed aforementioned people (with verbal/text abuse presumably, according to your post)

His squad, his way, don't like it... leave... and make a way better squad!

*Edit: For the record I copped a fair amount of abuse for my heavy handed squad leading but I reminded people that they were free to leave at any time (sometimes with some extra reminder from the kick button)

The squad leader is the most important element of PR. It's up to him whether 5 other people will have a great time or a miserable time. A great squad leader with 5 random players will be an effective squad - and you, as a squad member, will have a great round. So, as a SM, finding a SL that suits you is probably the most important thing to do. I prefer SLs that are focused on their objectives while still somewhat laid-back, others prefer SLs that are completely serious all the time. So yep, don't bother being on a squad under someone you don't like. Report them if they violate server rules, too.

Then again, some good SLs need to use the kick button more. Don't kick people for being a bad shot, being new to the game or such, but by all means do kick people that ignore orders, run off on their own and don't acknowledge anything via voice or text despite being asked to do so.

Oh, and about you saying that players can't identify that SL... true. But if he's constantly an ***, word will get around, and people won't really join his squads. Just like word gets around about good SLs - there are those who create a new squad and see it filled in a second.

Well... IMO, if you don't like the squad, leave. If you are in my squad, I expect you follow my orders to the letter.

Of course I try not to be an A-hole. But if I tell you "medic, RTB with the logi, rearm and bring it back", then the medic is suppose to RTB with the logi, rearm it and bring it back. I don't care that he's the medic - I'm the SL and I told him to do that. It was not suicidal, I had the plan in my head. Rarely have I seen a SL demanding a suicidal role (I actually never got told to do anything suicidal), like the OP said his SL did. If you happen to be in my squad and you disagree with my order, QUICKLY state why (so I, obviously, re-evaluate my order) but, if I tell you twice to do something, do it, or please, PLEASE leave my squad.

This is a game and you have the freedom to do whatever you want. But please, do so without getting in the way of others.

Who Let this Guy to be an SL He better Be a SM

goguapsy wrote:Rarely have I seen a SL demanding a suicidal role (I actually never got told to do anything suicidal), like the OP said his SL did. If you happen to be in my squad and you disagree with my order, QUICKLY state why (so I, obviously, re-evaluate my order) but, if I tell you twice to do something, do it, or please, PLEASE leave my squad.

Let me make this clear. I did obey his orders and was punished for doing so - I was the first one getting killed when crossing. The only problem according to him is that I took too long when in fact I was being pinned down. A good SL knows how to assess the situation at hand, especially after reporting him that there were 2 insurgents closing down + a techie and that I couldn't cross that easily to them (from one side of the passageway to the other).

This thread is mostly a rant, but after the heated argument I realized that he managed to ruin a newbie's experience of the game and called out another because he took too long to throw a rope. If this was going on during a calm phase, I would of call his attention, report him and then move on my way. With all the action going on constantly though, I was only able to realize what went on after he kicked me.

Mind you I play this game for a long time and some people know that I'm a teamwork minded player. I have lead as well. But with all honesty, I've never faced a ********* SL like this one who obvious had some experience on his side due to some strategic moves.

So in light of this event, who isn't a novelty for most (except me), I wonder if it's possible to make the life of everyone easier by recognizing an abusive or uncooperative SL through a reputation system?

This would add a lot of pressure to anyone that takes the role, but also keep him in line.

He may have expected you to disengage, which in PR translates as "run the f*** away". I think this is quite a source of discord inside squads as some players, especially when they don't quite trust their SL (I often don't, if I've never played with them before, or it's not the squad of my choice as in joining mid game), have a tendency to ignore move orders when getting shot at if he's not addressing me personally. It's not as personal as it sounds, it happens very rarely.

But it is bad. Maneuvering is pretty important part of PR and it often means you have to disengage, even in close quarters.

And it's also one of the most annoying things that can happen to you as a SL. Even if they're all tactical and covering each other, having 3 guys 200 meters behind while still communicating with you like "SL, we've got a couple of guys to our NW... etc." just makes you want to yell "I DON'T F***ING CARE JUST GET TO ME ALREADY!", and some do yell, as in your example.

Now, I'm not defending the guy, no matter how bad squad performance is, I'll never defend abusing players. TBH I think you really should have left his squad earlier.

1: Leave the squad.
2: Report him for being abusive towards other players.
3: Profit.

Arcturus_Shielder wrote: Mind you I play this game for a long time and some people know that I'm a teamwork minded player. I have lead as well. But with all honesty, I've never faced a ********* SL like this one who obvious had some experience on his side due to some strategic moves.

Oh, don't get me wrong - I know you (I think I've played with you once or twice). I understand what you did.

Now, it's hard to say whether he was right or wrong, I was not there. But I had situations in which something sounded absurd (such as the medic RTBing with a logi) but was actually part of a plan (like jerkzilla exemplified with the 200m away thing).

saXoni wrote:1: Leave the squad.
2: Report him for being abusive towards other players.
3: Profit.

Indeed.


People that want uber squads, I mean see what you're going with there, but there will always be "the one guy" that's slower.


You just have to use your squad to your advantage. What's fun (for me ^^) to do is go on a random server by yourself and be a squad leader. Let whoever comes in join, and if they don't know, teach

You tend to find that a SL treats his squad like he does his children. For example my kids would be running around, shooting AKs in the air whilst that SL's kids are probably crying in a corner somewhere .

But in all seriousness it becomes a question of when "setting an example" of people becomes over-excessive and unnecessary, a lot of people try to gain respect and obedience through kicking but on the other hand i rarely kick during a game and i don't get either of those two with my SQs . It can be difficult for SL's and maybe that style works for him.

In my opinion its all about having fun, so if you are not having fun just leave and join a squad with "cake" in the title

p.s KATY PERRY IS FIT!

Every player should be respected in PR's community.

If your squad leader is being a prick, and humiliating both himself and your squad, you should shout his name from the rooftops, because that kind of thing is not tolerated in most servers and doesn't fit the style. The community is large but not so large that we wont remember a dipshit who ruins other people fun.

For the sake of future player satisfaction, please notify the server admins on their website about him. this isnt a school yard where we say "stay away from the bully and he will stop bothering you" thats not how it works here. we are all mostly adults above the age of 20, and we deserve our peace and quiet and respect. And If that guy wants to ruin his reputation let him, but not at the expense of our patience. However I dont condone flame wars, its just easier if the people with server power (who are mostly genuinely good guys guarding the freshness of the tactical mindset) know who these tards are so they can receive a nice timely permanent ban. Im not a ban nazi, i just believe in extreme cases like grieving, hacking and having a long term bad attitude should be delt with in the most permanent and satisfactory way possible.

Its idiots like that who imagine they are tough guy drill instructors who get a power trip and actually possess very little in the way of actual life or game skills. They should go play a game that allows that kind of childish behavior and jerk out their frustration before their wives get home.

Psykogundam wrote:Every player should be respected in PR's community.

If your squad leader is being a prick, and humiliating both himself and your squad, you should shout his name from the rooftops, because that kind of thing is not tolerated in most servers and doesn't fit the style. The community is large but not so large that we wont remember a dipshit who ruins other people fun.

For the sake of future player satisfaction, please notify the server admins on their website about him. this isnt a school yard where we say "stay away from the bully and he will stop bothering you" thats not how it works here. we are all mostly adults above the age of 20, and we deserve our peace and quiet and respect. And If that guy wants to ruin his reputation let him, but not at the expense of our patience. However I dont condone flame wars, its just easier if the people with server power (who are mostly genuinely good guys guarding the freshness of the tactical mindset) know who these tards are so they can receive a nice timely permanent ban. Im not a ban nazi, i just believe in extreme cases like grieving, hacking and having a long term bad attitude should be delt with in the most permanent and satisfactory way possible.

Its idiots like that who imagine they are tough guy drill instructors who get a power trip and actually possess very little in the way of actual life or game skills. They should go play a game that allows that kind of childish behavior and jerk out their frustration before their wives get home.

I see your point and I agree with it. But it's important to remember that each person has a definition of fun. If the dude finds it fun to boss around, good for him... he's having fun! If you are not having fun with his playstyle, that go play on another yard. It's not like that person is a bully. He's just a teacher from an optional class.

I am not defending people who ruin gameplay but we must remember that he is not necessarily ruining gameplay. He was sure an A-hole by getting pissed at a new guy (I never got mad at a new guy... even if he took 2 minutes to revive someone with I telling him how to do so step by step several times), but let's remember that fun is different for one and the other. If you think he's ruining the server and have a legit reason (such as breaking a rule) feel free to tell on him. But I've never seen a server who kicks bad SLs, just SLs who don't follow CO's orders.

I have no problem with strict SLs, if they are good. Now if he is all smartass and no show, he is retarded/had a though childhood... or something. I had 2 occasion where SL wasnt to my likings in terms of abuse, so i left, simple.

Psyrus wrote:dtacs at his best again

(just kidding tacksie :wink

Saw that coming a mile away.

saXoni wrote: 2: Report him for being abusive towards other players.

Telling people they are bad at the game isn't insulting, its observational. If players are bad and need to improve, telling them is a great solution. Bad players waste others' time and I don't tolerate them. SL's are there to create a fun experience for others, if some members are getting in the way of that they don't deserve to play the game.