Project Reality Forums

I don't think the point is to create a system that is absolutely accurate to real world standards. Rather it's there to create a firefight that plays out in a more realistic manner.

I fully comprehend your point of view and what you propose.

How will this change will benefit firefights in PR? Won't a change like that just encourage people to run around and pop off quick accurate shots like it's call of duty?

People will do whatever works best in order to win at video games, that's a proven fact. What works in PR is similar to what works in real life. That was achieved by adding unrealistic things like the deviation system. Players need their best option to be the option the developers intended them to use. If we reversed the deviation system then players would adopt twitch style run and gunning, because it would work.

Edit: Also, you based this feedback on the sniper having best aim after standing with his weapon up for 8seconds. The sniper standing deviation was changed to that a while back because you can't rest the weapon on things in PR, and forcing people to always be prone while firing severely limited your options. So, while it makes sense that holding a large rifle up for a length of time will tire you out, and thus make your aim worse. It also makes sense that someone could rest the rifle on a window sill or whatever is around them. We have to take the good with the bad, it's good we can now fire standing, it's bad that a sniper standing in a field can hold his weapon up for hours without fatigue.

In real life; if you cannot hold the weapon still after merely a few seconds... you are NOT QUALIFIED to use it. Except for mounted weapons.

Real life isn't a video game.

Edit: But holding a weapon still and achieving maximum accuracy aren't exactly the same thing now are they?

As nice as it sounds to you Sharps, CQB battles will just look like back in 0.6, enemy spotted, bam enemy down thats it. Fights of about 10-20 second max, depending on how many opponents/friendlies there are.

A thing that might improve everything in conjunction with your idea is to add a small penalty at the start (dunno stand still for a sec or two and then what you said). I think you actually meant something like this, didn't you?

It's there so you don't prone and then pop up and shoot someone in the face like an absolute troll that evades gravity.

so... shoot, tap W, then shoot again instantly accurate 24/7 the idea is good, but gameplay wise its not so good.

In what situation do you ever fire standing up in PR?

The issue is null and void in my opinion because the only time you actually do it is when there's a wall in front of you ..

It's still less accurate than firing whilst crouched - the issue is already fixed.

T.A.Sharps wrote:... or does it make more sense to spray an entire mag of bullets in the other's general direction, bullets landing everywhere, and only 1 or 2 hitting a target 10 meters away? In a game where CQB is supposedly modeled.

Is that sarcasm? Or are you serious that you can only hit 1 or 2 rounds out of 30 on a 10m target? Is that full auto hip firing on the move?

It just seems like you're over-exaggerating the CQB difficulty to make your suggestion sound better.

Deviation doesn't ever bother me. I like it this way that the bullet actually goes where you aim if you just are a bit patient.

Also, I hardly ever even notice the deviation so much, everything to about 60 meters goes pretty nice straight without letting the deviation to settle

I think its there becoase in long range firefights it takes time to adjust for the distance and wind.
Just my opinion.

In CQB this would be good. Now the winning tactic of CQB is to spray n pray with unscoped LMG.

I think you might be missing the point of deviation and settle times. It also sounds like what you are asking as not possible within the game engine, but we'd need a coder to step up and answer that one.

Basically, as far as I understand it, the deviation/settle time system is meant to replicate reality in the sense that you don't carry your weapon in the "ready/up" position while moving. It takes time to pull that weapon up to your shoulder, rest your cheek on the stock, aim down the sight, catch your breath, fight off the adrenaline surge, and get your muscles to actually steady enough to keep your target under the sights.

The settle times are then put in place to replicate that cycle, due to the fact in part because there is no long animation sequence to cover it. And because BF2 lacks a real weapon sway, with your weapon usually always pointing perfectly center, the deviation system is in place to replicate such sway. Deviation settles after a few seconds to simulate all of the above.


What you're asking does make sense in a realistic manner, but in order to do so in the BF2 engine would require coding of multiple settle times and deviation levels. First, you'd have to use the system already in place, and then you'd need an "unsettle" timer and opposite deviation change when the weapon is held on target beyond a certain amount of time (based on weapon type/weight). It would also have to take into account the specific weapon being used, the stance of the operator, and the terrain he's on. Obviously firing from a supported position, which can include resting your weapon on the hood of a car or a window sill, would not cause muscle fatigue.


As for someone trying to hold a weapon steady while standing for an extended period, chances are it's not a concern. You'll most likely be gunned down or blown up for your stupidity before your muscles start to tire. Not to mention the fact that any "sniper" who tries firing from a standing unsupported position at a distanced target (aka non-CQB) deserves to have his nutsack implode.

T.A.Sharps wrote:Also, to this guy.....



Chill out Rambo...

Go pick up a bull barreled Remington 700, with a scope and mount that weigh a few pounds on there own, and 5 rounds of .308 cartridges a tell me how long you can hold the cross hairs on a egg at 100 yards from the offhand position.

Come back on here and tell us how you did.

This guy has a point.
I've tried holding a bb gun G3 perfectly still from a crouching position and it's impossible. Not perfectly still.
If it were real i'll still be a threat to anything within 200m but not perfectly still.


But anyway i think the current deviation system is fine.

At long range fire fights it makes sense so no quick scopers. And In real life you see a target take a deep breath and then shoot.

In cqb i find the deviations actually help.
Since it's so quick and fast the chances that you've got your gun perfectly trained on what you want to hit is relatively low. So even if you aren't perfectly aiming at him due to deviations you'll hit him anyway.

Which kinda simulates spraying and praying which works great in real life cqb

Plus real life doesn't have 60 milliseconds lag (just 10 if you're using your eyes to fire, not sound ).

But nobody mentioned my point, when on earth do you fire standing up in PR and there isn't something that in real life you would rest it on?

Mikemonster wrote:Plus real life doesn't have 60 milliseconds lag (just 10 if you're using your eyes to fire, not sound ).

But nobody mentioned my point, when on earth do you fire standing up in PR and there isn't something that in real life you would rest it on?

One example would be when firing over a small hill across an open field. Like in Al Basrah village/fields area west of the city.

In firefights you would have to keep zooming in and out in order to regain accuracy.



You're on the right track, but this isn't a proper fix.


Btw, ARMA2 already has something like this. Weapon sway is impossible in BF2 (real weapon sway, not FH2, which just moves the weapon to make it look like it's moving, but it really isn't). But Deviation isn't the culprit to this "error".