Project Reality Forums

Hi all!

I searched forums but didnt find similar thread, sorry if there was one before.

I would like to make a discussion of this, not sugestion. So here are few things about fobs that bothers me when I play:

"No, We are not taking objective, We are looking for fobs"
Maps are big and have multiple interesting flags to fight over, but usually squads dont attack objectives becouse they know that if they want to secure a flag they have to go around and search for fobs. I think it woluld be much better if instead of searching for fobs all the time we could just focus on objectives and make game more dynamic.

"Just give up and spawn on closest fob"
When You have 4 fobs built You dont care if You are dead, you can spawn and die again and again. I have seen squads rushing enemy positions just becouse fob was near and to die was not a problem. What I wanted to say is that PR is great when you feel like you are really out there and you just dont want to die and you try to be careful and smart to stay alive. I remember how old rally points were bad for gameplay and now fobs do the same thing.

"There is so many of them!"
Fighting over one objective for an hour becouse both teams have fobs built all around the flag. You attack objective kill enemies and know that they will be back in 2 minutes and will keep comming again and again. You know they will be spawning and pouring on you like zergs until you are dead and then you will be doing same thing. Not realistic. Wouldnt it be better if you secure an objective and know that guys you killed are in main now and you actually won the fight and secured objective?

"Half of our team is building fobs"
People complain about squads on a secret mission 1000m from target. They build fobs or look for enemy ones. I dont think its good for gameplay to put so much focus on logistic matters when team lacks soldiers on front lines. Building fobs, destroing fobs, defending fobs, mortars, supply trucks, transport helicopters - thats a lot of important tasks but not actually fighting.

"There must be enemy fob somewhere"
I dont like the feeling that probably enemy have fobs all around me. I go for a flag and start to think: maybe i just missed one? Maybe enemies will start coming from behind? I will beter go and check that bush over here, and that dich, and that compound. I would like to focus more on flag but I just cant becouse if I miss enemy fob I will die. And even if I think I destroyed enemy fob there always is one enemy guy left and one crate, hidden in the bushes, just waiting until my squad is done and move along so he can rebuild that fob. I did that myself few times.

Fobs are great but there is to many of them. Trans helis, APCs and light vehicles are important only for first 10 minutes of the game becouse then fobs take their function. I would rather like to have one (maybe 2 for 4km maps) that way fobs would be something special and important. Squad would have to think twice before building fob. Defending it and attacking would be better and more intense aswell. And of course I ment AAS mode not insurgency (Multiple fobs fits great to insurgency).

Thats it, I think I made my point. Thanks for reading this and tell me what You think.

Bad1n wrote:Hi all!
"Just give up and spawn on closest fob"
When You have 4 fobs built You dont care if You are dead, you can spawn and die again and again. I have seen squads rushing enemy positions just becouse fob was near and to die was not a problem. What I wanted to say is that PR is great when you feel like you are really out there and you just dont want to die and you try to be careful and smart to stay alive.

Nice point, i totally agree with your opinion. It would make the gameplay even more realistic.
I?m playin pr, because it`s not the key objective to kill the enemys. It`s so cool to kill some bunch of enemys I know . But the reason I`m playing it, it`s because I like to play it with my clanmates, stay alive and defending each other.

But the problem is, that it could turn out like ARMA. I mean running really long distances, if you have no transport, to have a firefight.
I think, if the dev`s would do that, they would have to improve the transport possibilities.
Maybe the fobs are only a easy solution for the gameplay until now. When we would have no fobs in pr, we would play it much more careful and considered. I would like it

Sorry for my bad english mate!

I think fobs are very good feature of bf2pr. Period.

Well, I think FOBs are critical for the type of gameplay we currently have in PR:BF2. A type of gameplay which I personally love and cherish, and is a big part of why I keep on playing it.

You always need some sort of way to spawn in relatively close to the fight. Wheter it be FOBs, rallypoints, flag spawning or squadleader spawning. Here the first two are IMO the best alternatives, and the two last are not realistic or gameplay promoting at all.

If you remove all these spawn alternatives, leaving us with mainbase spawning, and this again resulting in problems getting to the fight. You would have the rely on having superb people transporting all the time, which in public games often might turn out to be a problem.

FOBs are important, if not the most important part of PR's gameplay today.

But I believe there is room for improvement. What bothers me the most is everyone giving up. They just don't care. Oh, I'm losing tickets? No problem, there's a FOB not 50m away.

It's very out there, but I thought once: maybe if you die within 100m from the firebase - or more -, you can't respawn on it? Well, everyone has a different idea about this every now and then.

I disagree when you said FOBs that "may or may not" be around are bad for gameplay. Not knowing where the enemy is established around an objective is quite... natural. And not always I see a team focused on logistics.

Anyway, looking forward to see the continuation of this discussion.

- FOBs aren't spawnable if enemies are close to it.
Which makes you quickly aware of enemies' location, whereas they still don't know yours.

- Excessive deaths are bad for the team's tickets, and extend the spawn time.
If you think you're wasting some time and tickets on destroying an enemy FOB, you can build mortars and target it. But it will give your FOB location.

- You cannot build more than 6 FOBs, and they need to be veeery spread.
Considering the size of the map, if half of the team is building FOBs, it means the enemy team is unable to control the map, and they'll surely lose.

I don't now where did you find that FOBs are bad and will remove the focus of the game.

Bad1n wrote:"No, We are not taking objective, We are looking for fobs"
Maps are big and have multiple interesting flags to fight over, but usually squads don't attack objectives because they know that if they want to secure a flag they have to go around and search for fobs. I think it would be much better if instead of searching for fobs all the time we could just focus on objectives and make game more dynamic.

And then, enemies surrounding your position, I usually have a printed map with the CP radius so I search for FOBs inside it.

"Just give up and spawn on closest fob"
When You have 4 fobs built You don't care if You are dead, you can spawn and die again and again. I have seen squads rushing enemy positions just because fob was near and to die was not a problem. What I wanted to say is that PR is great when you feel like you are really out there and you just don't want to die and you try to be careful and smart to stay alive. I remember how old rally points were bad for gameplay and now fobs do the same thing.

Then lead a squad, do different from the others and show them that doing like you is the best way, so they'll feel encouraged to try to survive at all cost, this works, if don't, choose another server to play on.

"There is so many of them!"
Fighting over one objective for an hour because both teams have fobs built all around the flag. You attack objective kill enemies and know that they will be back in 2 minutes and will keep coming again and again. You know they will be spawning and pouring on you like zergs until you are dead and then you will be doing same thing. Not realistic. Wouldn't it be better if you secure an objective and know that guys you killed are in main now and you actually won the fight and secured objective?

And why you don't request the team to have one Squad alongside with yours and tell another two squads to attack? Also, why don't you move out when you see that your position is compromised?

"Half of our team is building fobs"
People complain about squads on a secret mission 1000m from target. They build fobs or look for enemy ones. I don't think its good for gameplay to put so much focus on logistic matters when team lacks soldiers on front lines. Building fobs, destroying fobs, defending fobs, mortars, supply trucks, transport helicopters - that's a lot of important tasks but not actually fighting.

Enemies are dumbs if they place FOBs distant from the battle, since it'll only give points, but no help to the team, or they're operating mortars, if your team is doing the same, complain, request help, if the guys that are 1k from the fight are operating mortars is okay.

"There must be enemy fob somewhere"
I don't like the feeling that probably enemy have fobs all around me. I go for a flag and start to think: maybe i just missed one? Maybe enemies will start coming from behind? I will better go and check that bush over here, and that ditch, and that compound. I would like to focus more on flag but I just cant because if I miss enemy fob I will die. And even if I think I destroyed enemy fob there always is one enemy guy left and one crate, hidden in the bushes, just waiting until my squad is done and move along so he can rebuild that fob. I did that myself few times.

You must learn how to defend your position and when to move out if you know that there are enemies close, also, you don't need to be in a static position all the game, you can move around and search for the FOBs since you have a 150m radius at least to search for them.

Fobs are great but there is to many of them. Trans helis, APCs and light vehicles are important only for first 10 minutes of the game because then fobs take their function. I would rather like to have one (maybe 2 for 4km maps) that way fobs would be something special and important. Squad would have to think twice before building fob. Defending it and attacking would be better and more intense as well. And of course I meant AAS mode not insurgency (Multiple fobs fits great to insurgency).

For the vehicle turning useless, I think no, one must see that if they're dying to much when leaving a FOB, obviously they should respawn at MB and try another approach, which would be either by Helicopter or APC..

FOB's do what they are supposed to do, and they have a strategy involved with them. PR doesn't have a crazy ticket bleed so you can actually lure people into your flag and kill more of them and earn from that in the end. Not really a good tactic imo, but many pub. rounds have ended with the enemy having 2 flags left to grab but out of tickets.

Although a lack of skirmish maps might be your main issue, PR prolly has some potential in those maps. A good 6v6/8v8 map would be kinda nice. Those we have today are kinda 'ok'.

A solution to hiding FOB's could be a louder radio, in the sense that if your 10 m away you will easily hear it, although insurgents and Vietcong etc. should have silent FOB's.

Fobs are the one thing I found one of the coolest thing in PR. Cause it adds something that nearly no other game does right: logistics. And I love it

You raise some valids points , which mostly have to do with them being forward spawn points, and not so much operation bases(that need protection and manned assets). So yeah, what my favorite thing would be is to keep fobs, but let them not be the primary spawn options. For example the rallypoint changes that were tested on PRTA 128 tests were the more I think about a good change. This makes people who want to actually man fobs and their emplacements being able to do so, while the others can count more on the rallypoints which are less usable then fobs and squad specific.

for people who didn't got to test them, rallypoints stayed much longer and were if I recall faster to set up.

Good arguments there SShadowFox and Im sure it works great on clan wars or events with all very good players but on the common public servers its not so easy.

One more thing: I didnt say to remove fobs, just limit them a bit. Players dont have to walk from main if they die, we still have RP, air transport, land transport.

Thanks for Your comments guys!

I remember when the CO had to set a bunker and the squads only other spawns were either rallies or main

Particularly on amphibious or helicopter transport maps, I have always been torn regarding FOBs, since receiving reinforcement via helicopter is imo more fun and realistic than spawning on a FOB.

Though I disagree that fobs lead to the team spreading out, to build or look for fobs since fobs themselves create central spawnpoints that help keep teams together. Too many FOBs can result in problems, (aside from the insurgent team, where more FOBs make the experience better for for everyone there imo)

Though Good points and an interesting discussion.

I personally disagree wholeheartedly with each of your points and your sentiment in its entirety - mostly for the reason (applicable to each point) that fobs add a dynamic nature to the battle... because while it's true we now have AASv3 [random] and AASv4 [routes], there are only so many flag locations and points of interest to fight over, and these would easily become stale in my opinion. FOBs add a whole other dynamic to gameplay [which you seem to regard as a negative thing], a new area to assault/defend, creating points of interest and gameplay.

FOBs keep up an important reason why I can still play PR after having played it for ~6-7 years now... I know the vast majority of what the enemy team is doing is entirely up to player decisions, there are very few 'no-go-zones', they can choose how offensive/defensive they will play, the rounds are long enough that tactics can entirely change mid-way through, and each game will generally play out differently despite it being the exact same map.

The same can't be said for many other games in this day and age, nor the past for that matter!

Bad1n wrote:"Just give up and spawn on closest fob"
When You have 4 fobs built You dont care if You are dead, you can spawn and die again and again. I have seen squads rushing enemy positions just becouse fob was near and to die was not a problem. What I wanted to say is that PR is great when you feel like you are really out there and you just dont want to die and you try to be careful and smart to stay alive. I remember how old rally points were bad for gameplay and now fobs do the same thing.

This comes down to the players, not the FOBs.

Bad1n wrote:Hi all!

I searched forums but didnt find similar thread, sorry if there was one before.

I would like to make a discussion of this, not sugestion. So here are few things about fobs that bothers me when I play:

"No, We are not taking objective, We are looking for fobs"
Maps are big and have multiple interesting flags to fight over, but usually squads dont attack objectives becouse they know that if they want to secure a flag they have to go around and search for fobs. I think it woluld be much better if instead of searching for fobs all the time we could just focus on objectives and make game more dynamic.

"Just give up and spawn on closest fob"
When You have 4 fobs built You dont care if You are dead, you can spawn and die again and again. I have seen squads rushing enemy positions just becouse fob was near and to die was not a problem. What I wanted to say is that PR is great when you feel like you are really out there and you just dont want to die and you try to be careful and smart to stay alive. I remember how old rally points were bad for gameplay and now fobs do the same thing.

"There is so many of them!"
Fighting over one objective for an hour becouse both teams have fobs built all around the flag. You attack objective kill enemies and know that they will be back in 2 minutes and will keep comming again and again. You know they will be spawning and pouring on you like zergs until you are dead and then you will be doing same thing. Not realistic. Wouldnt it be better if you secure an objective and know that guys you killed are in main now and you actually won the fight and secured objective?

"Half of our team is building fobs"
People complain about squads on a secret mission 1000m from target. They build fobs or look for enemy ones. I dont think its good for gameplay to put so much focus on logistic matters when team lacks soldiers on front lines. Building fobs, destroing fobs, defending fobs, mortars, supply trucks, transport helicopters - thats a lot of important tasks but not actually fighting.

"There must be enemy fob somewhere"
I dont like the feeling that probably enemy have fobs all around me. I go for a flag and start to think: maybe i just missed one? Maybe enemies will start coming from behind? I will beter go and check that bush over here, and that dich, and that compound. I would like to focus more on flag but I just cant becouse if I miss enemy fob I will die. And even if I think I destroyed enemy fob there always is one enemy guy left and one crate, hidden in the bushes, just waiting until my squad is done and move along so he can rebuild that fob. I did that myself few times.

Fobs are great but there is to many of them. Trans helis, APCs and light vehicles are important only for first 10 minutes of the game becouse then fobs take their function. I would rather like to have one (maybe 2 for 4km maps) that way fobs would be something special and important. Squad would have to think twice before building fob. Defending it and attacking would be better and more intense aswell. And of course I ment AAS mode not insurgency (Multiple fobs fits great to insurgency).

Thats it, I think I made my point. Thanks for reading this and tell me what You think.

I totally agree with this post!

I pointed this out multiple times here in the forum.
FOBs lower the value of life and results in action gameplay, less "reality" tactics and "zergin".

But to disable all FOBs is not a good idea. Because not good organized teams have otherwise no chance against high organized ones. I personally would limit the FOBs to max 1 or 2 and spawncounts on them (resupply with ammunition crates, or so).

Decreasing the FOB value, increases transportation teamplay and asset value. APC for example will not only used for killing, it will be used as its name says: Armored Personal >>>Carrier<<<

In conclusion: lowering the spawn scope and action behavior of player through decreased FOB avalability.

I disagree. I don't liked the FOB system when it appeared but soon I understood it was a great addition to the teamplay.

Can't FOBs be disabled for certain maps only to improve gameplay?

A map like Muttrah, which is relatively small and has tons of trans really doesn't need FOBs.
All it really does is make the gameplay on that map slower, because usually advancing through the streets is so slow you'll meet the same defenders two or three times before you reach their flag/FOB.

Some other maps like Kashan on the other hand would be very annoying for infantry to play without FOBs, because transport is either limited or it takes too long to reach the front.


Also, I kinda like the idea that only the commander would be able to build an FOB. Squads often attack a position by helicopter and quickly build a makeshift FOB before they set out, so they can instantly respawn if their attack fails. Disabling squadleaders from building would not only increase the commander's role, but would also decrease the amount of 'makeshift' FOBs and wouldn't directly cripple the ability to build defensive structures at important points.

First World Problems

I like the intention of the FOB system, but sometimes it becomes annoying and unrealistic when there's an endless stream of people constantly respawning and walking back to the near objective, which kind of makes the actual fight for the objective obsolete since the FOB becomes the main target.
Cutting off supply lines (-> Destroy FOBs) is therefore more important for capturing an objective than the fight for the Objective itself, which is kind of wrong, isn't it?

But I have no solution for this, except for maybe "No FOBS in xxx Metres Objective Radius". I find the overall FOB system fine.

FOBs add logistics to the mod, a really fun and realistic part of PR.

Imagine Kashan Desert, no FOBs, all transport helicopters have been destroyed. You must wait at the main base for 10 mins, hopping that the next pilot is good.

FOBs also simulate reinforcements AND more people. Because armies aren't only 32 players.

Pvt.LHeureux wrote:FOBs add logistics to the mod, a really fun and realistic part of PR.

Imagine Kashan Desert, no FOBs, all transport helicopters have been destroyed. You must wait at the main base for 10 mins, hopping that the next pilot is good.

FOBs also simulate reinforcements AND more people. Because armies aren't only 32 players.

Here is the best example that APCs dont even get suggested for transportation.