Project Reality Forums

I'd like to see an overhaul in the requirements for building different emplacements
So instead of what we have now, it could be like this

1x Crate - Fob
2x Crate - Foxholes/Razorwire/Static Structures
3x Crate - TOW/HMG/AA
4x Crate - Mortars

Also I'd like to maybe see more variety in FOB emplacements.
Maybe include more weapon emplacements and static structures (such as towers etc.)
Who knows what else you could include... maybe a deployable vehicle rearming station?

I like the 1 crate 1 FOB idea and more variety would always be nice but I have not seen many people use the emplacements and statics

building a FOB takes a pretty long time anyway so I think 1 crate 1 FOB should work in my opinion

as for more variety Ive been waiting for different types of defense structures like a small sandbag bunker

I agree with OP, it should get progressively harder.

Please don't increase the logistical 'burden' on the team, it's tedious enough as it is and already detracts a large portion of the team from actually fighting.

As it is, a few mortar rounds/CAS strike and the crates disappear.

Mikemonster wrote: As it is, a few mortar rounds and the crates disappear.

That's because people don't know how to preserve them and just spam the mortars with ammobags even though they aren't firing.

He means that crates are vulnerable and after all the time youve spent putting them together can be gone with a well aimed mortar round or strafe run.

Please don't increase the logistical 'burden' on the team, it's tedious enough as it is and already detracts a large portion of the team from actually fighting.

As it is, a few mortar rounds/CAS strike and the crates disappear.

I think it would be great. it would get transport squad to get more to do instead of waiting in main for one singel request of ammo.

what I think would be great but it would be a huge demand on trans to drop ammo. would be that, these big crates now with ammo should only be needed to build FOBs and all the emplacments.

and helicopters have to drop ammo boxes to get the ammo to squads. people usually just request a new rifleman kit when rearming mortars.

but like I said that would be a HUGE burden for transport squad to drop so much ammo.

As long as hmg nest can be suppressed and taken out by anything apart from a shotgun, it won't be used that much. In a firefight your lucky to survive for 10 second's and during those 10 seconds you won't be able to see anything since your so easily suppressed and you can't "duck". It would be better to have much better protection in it's fire direction and sacrifice flank protection or be able to "duck". You don't see any tanks with heavy side armor and no front armor for a reason.

wire is awkward to place especially on slopes so they don't offer much either, though foxholes give a good 300 degree protection and should be used more often.

For the logistic part I think it wouldn't make much of a difference to make it 1-2-3-4 crates like OP suggests since mortar squads normally have a logi and won't rely on just 2 crates. Only difference is that Tow's won't be built within the first minutes of a game which would be good imo, giving apc's a chance to get behind enemy lines.
Since it doesn't make much of a difference I don't see either why the developers should spend time on changing this unless if it can be done quickly.

More type of defensive assets would be nice, but they need to serve a valuable purpose or they will never be used. A tower built as an asset would just be a big beacon for AT units and even more obvious for snipers since you will be showing yourself on the horizon background. A sort of Vehicle resupply station would be very valuable on big maps though, and worth setting up..... having this could boost the advance of a team and the need for FOB defense would be boosted. Vehicles and infantry would rally on this FOB and advance from there, instead of being hit once... retreat to mainbase... go out.. hit once... retreat to main base. Of course vehicles should have a logitruck to repair, but that's an even higher logistic chore since 1 man needs to stay with that vehicle and will be "constantly" occupied or destroyed since he is in direct line of fire. And very few wants to drive around all round with a logistic truck.

Regarding OPs' suggestion:

Generally yes, I'd agree

BUT

since I had a similar suggestion a while back and also brought it up again in the team discussion recently and since it refers to the same game mechanic (crates to build stuff) I want to include it here.

-----------------------

As it is today, the crate mechanic is pretty gamey. You get 1 crate that holds the materials needed to establish a FOB. But as soon as you get another one (same size and all) you can put additionally:
1 TOW, 1 AA, 2 HMGs, 2 Mortars, X wires and Y foxholes.
To me that never made any sense.

OPs' idea on the other hand would be a way around this but also brings in more "weird" requirements and even more stuff for the player to remember. "Let's build a TOW really fast, follow me up here!" "Hmm, what number of crates do we need again?" "Hmm, idk, 2 maybe...or 3!"

My idea would go around the "2nd crate holds an incredible amount of stuff"-part but still being easy to understand and comprehend. It goes like this:

1 crate = 1 FOB
+1 crate = 2 crates = 1 FOB + 1 emplacement
+1 crate = 3 crates = 1 FOB + 2 emplacements
.
.
.

Imo (and that is really just an opinion) this would simulate reality a bit better, as what we have right now and also a bit easier as what OP suggested.

Ideas, Thoughts?

EDIT: afaik the vehicle resupply emplacement was discussed before and turned down for realism reasons. The argument being, that an army simply does not do this type of stuff "in the field". Form a gameplay point of view, I'd still vote for it though!

i think its good the way it is and no change is necessary

KiloJules wrote:afaik the vehicle resupply emplacement was discussed before and turned down for realism reasons. The argument being, that an army simply does not do this type of stuff "in the field". Form a gameplay point of view, I'd still vote for it though!

Well If not resupply then a static repair station that continues to function unlike the logi repair. that disappear in 2 min or so and has to be dropped again. I don't see why logistic trucks can't resupply vehicles with at least some ammo though. Ground Vehicles needs some love in PR, since they are currently at a huge disadvantage. This could be one way.
3 vehicles defending a flag will be out-flanked easily by 1 HAT with 2 riflemen supplying him. Thats 3 light vs 6 heavy and the 3 light win.... if the HAT guy had just one supply-crate he could also pretty much do it all by himself.

the risk of loosing 30 to 36 tickets when defending vs 2-6 makes vehicles defending almost pointless. 6 light infantry hiding is far superior at defending at a lower cost.

but then it should only be 1 static repair station.

if its more then 1 it will be to easy to repair your tank/apc/IFV and return to battle.

ExeTick wrote:but then it should only be 1 static repair station.

if its more then 1 it will be to easy to repair your tank/apc/IFV and return to battle.

Yes 1 would be enough, otherwise the vehicles would leap from repair-station to repair-station which isn't the real purpose of it, but rather a fall-back station to repair or defend from.

KiloJules wrote: 1 crate = 1 FOB
+1 crate = 2 crates = 1 FOB + 1 emplacement
+1 crate = 3 crates = 1 FOB + 2 emplacements
.
.
.

Indeed, it would be more realistic.
However, the foxhole(s) should not be considered as emplacement. I think that a crate is not required in order to build a hole. Thus, a foxhole could be deployed without a crate. And if the only crate of a FOB disappears, it would be still possible to deploy a foxhole.

Frank Jeager wrote:Indeed, it would be more realistic.
However, the foxhole(s) should not be considered as emplacement. I think that a crate is not required in order to build a hole. Thus, a foxhole could be deployed without a crate. And if the only crate of a FOB disappears, it would be still possible to deploy a foxhole.

I agree, even though foxholes appear to require sandbags, in reality they will be dug in the ground which ain't possible with the bf2 engine. Foxholes should go hand in hand with a FOB, therefore not require additional crates.

Another static similar to the foxhole could be a vehicle foxhole although it won't be realistic it would simulate for example a tank that is "digging" in. This could protect it's chassis only exposing the turret and front or rear. Not all vehicles have this ability though so possibly this should be vehicle based like the logistic truck deploy-able bridge. A tank-driver "deploy" the tank, but it only works if near a FOB.

i seriously think Devs should look into the 1 crate 1 emplacement idea.

mortar crews will have several crates regardless so it shouldnt be a problem that they would need 3 crates to build 2 mortars.

as for the deployable repair station, im not too sure about that one. i could think of ways in which it might be exploited.

EDIT: if this idea were to be implemented i think that on some maps we would need to compensate specific teams with an additional logi truck.

1 crate one emplacement sounds good to me. Logistics is part of the game and with 100p you wont have an excuse anymore regarding lack of players.

A deployable repair station that doesn't disappear like the droppable one, would mean armor would place one and stay next to it to avoid getting destroyed. I don't think that is a good idea or realistic for that matter.

I thought the current crate 'demand' system works quite well, as you can build either two secret FOBs, or one with AA/TOW.

You can't exploit the current 'two crates gets you everything' system, because in order to actually build all the cool stuff (TOW/AA) you actually need a full squad (far too tedious otherwise).

I think it would be good to have another type of emplacement that is a covered foxhole, that requires 2x crates but spawns another inside itself, if possible.

Basically a covered foxhole simulating an underground bunker, with a protected crate included inside it.

Although I think this should already be an option to choose vs the standard 'molehill' FOB. (Standard one is is very high profile and very vulnerable to any attacks).

About the crate issue.
If the Devs can balance it maybe, or create a special kind of crate for it, maybe we can add ZPUs to FOBs. I submitted a thread about it but Rhino explained to me that it was unbalanced, which is quite true.
In any case I also agree that FOBs can get serious firepower too easily. I mean take the supply truck, park, dump the supplies and there you go instant pwnage.
Thing is I don't think razor wire can be placed on the same level as TOWs and IGLAs. The multiple supply crate like 1 for FOB 2 for etc. is nice. But what I liked even more was the idea of 1 crate 1 emplacement. This will encourage players to set up dedicated Logi squads and stop dumping those damn trucks after they build their FOB.

Is this all possible or are there engine limitations?

Onil wrote: A deployable repair station that doesn't disappear like the droppable one, would mean armor would place one and stay next to it to avoid getting destroyed. I don't think that is a good idea or realistic for that matter.

well a critical hit to the armor will still destroy it since the repair station will not be "good" enough to repair the damage when it starts burning. But if it gets tracked it will be able to repair over time unless if the enemy is smart enough to take out the repair asset first or if they hit a critical part of the tank.
I agree it isn't the most realistic thing but many thing's can't be realistic and be good game-play at the same time. Getting into armor shouldn't be a disadvantage though as it is now and this feature could help out. Alternative is to make armor disabled without actually being blown up much earlier so that a logi truck get's a chance to "rescue" it, but that would mean the developers would have to rewrite all vehicles in PR, but I think they got better things to do.

godfather_596 wrote: The multiple supply crate like 1 for FOB 2 for etc. is nice. But what I liked even more was the idea of 1 crate 1 emplacement. This will encourage players to set up dedicated Logi squads and stop dumping those damn trucks after they build their FOB.

So your one of the few willing to drive a shuttle-bus for 2 hours with a dedicated logi-squad? Iv'e done that myself when I see it makes sense, but preferably not 1 entire round as it gets very repetitive and the reward is a simple but sufficient ..thank you sir!. It will work on small maps or maps with air supply.... but otherwise you will see all the infantry...armor....cas squads filling up, and everyone asking for supply but no-one willing to be a dedicated driver. What you might get is a lot of argument at the main base over which squad gets there own personal supply truck. Adding more logi-trucks to the maps will out-balance the "scarce ammunition" feeling that PR has implemented with good success. You would then see 2 man squads of sniper+HAT take there own logi-truck and start raining death from a good position as if they where a CAS squad.