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Imagine a 49x49 round, Fallujah West, american team. You are a squad member, you respawned with your entire squad at the main base and you need to go to a very far place
Your squad grabs a logi truck and a HUMVEE. You realize that it's 5 + 2 vehicle seats
The APC is gone, others HUMVEEs were taken
You have 7 seats for 8 soldiers

Solution:



Just kidding


That's not really a issue, however it affects a little with the squad gameplay
A simply, basic solution is to add a third seat to a logistic military truck

Something like this



A repair station and 2 big supply crates should give enough room to at least one person in a logi truck. Imagine him taking care and 'checking' the supplies
A logi truck (3 seats) and a HUMVEE (5 seats) would give perfect mobility for the squad


+
Help with mobility
Avoid double trips

-
'Too much effort for small gameplay change' (I guess?)



I would like to hear opinions about it

indeed, a rear facing passenger has quite obvious advantages aside from alleviating the 5 man humvee issue

I like the third seat idea. You can actually have a squad be properly mobilized. Not having some guy to wait at main until the humvee can come back and get him.

That is not a bad idea

For the Russian/MEC/PLA etc, Brit/Ger and French logi trucks you could even fit three people in the Front. Just the US M-35 there isn't three seats in the front, unless someone feels like sitting on the gear stick or on someone's lap

I actually do not like this idea that much. I am not directly against this idea, but in combination with rally points it gets a bit different. Before 1.0 where the squad members required to place RP got increased to 2, it was quite regular tactic to just spawn in SL + 1 soldier, take a logi, rush somewhere and spawn rest with rally. If we give the logi 3 seats this tactic would be useful again and thus instead of increasing it to just 3 we rather increase it to 8.
It is a nice idea, but not in combination with rally point mechanics

Ye that is a valid point Mats, although isn't it 3 squad members near you required now iirc? If not, possibly we should up it to 3 seeing as we have 8 man squads now too?

+1


34567

I like this idea.

If we give the logi 3 seats this tactic would be useful again and thus instead of increasing it to just 3 we rather increase it to 8.

I had not thought of this. Damn exploiters!

[R-DEV]Mats391 wrote:the squad members required to place RP got increased to 2, it was quite regular tactic to just spawn in SL + 1 soldier, take a logi, rush somewhere and spawn rest with rally.

But isn't that possible with any other vehicle?
the only difference is they will not have supply crates, that's all

[R-DEV]Rhino wrote:Ye that is a valid point Mats, although isn't it 3 squad members near you required now iirc? If not, possibly we should up it to 3 seeing as we have 8 man squads now too?

If that's the case, Rhino solved it already . With a higher man squad its more than necessary to increase the number of squad members nearby to 3 in order to set a RP

This is an awesome idea. I'm surprised nobody has thought of it up until now. Props

[R-DEV]Mats391 wrote:I actually do not like this idea that much. I am not directly against this idea, but in combination with rally points it gets a bit different. Before 1.0 where the squad members required to place RP got increased to 2, it was quite regular tactic to just spawn in SL + 1 soldier, take a logi, rush somewhere and spawn rest with rally. If we give the logi 3 seats this tactic would be useful again and thus instead of increasing it to just 3 we rather increase it to 8.
It is a nice idea, but not in combination with rally point mechanics

Theoretically if they are taking a logi somewhere, like a flag, they more than likely will put down a fob with the crates in the logi, get a rally up (hopefully away from the fob), squad members spawn in and dig and they move on - if that's even what you were talking about.

-SPITFIRE- wrote:But isn't that possible with any other vehicle?
the only difference is they will not have supply crates, that's all

If that's the case, Rhino solved it already . With a higher man squad its more than necessary to increase the number of squad members nearby to 3 in order to set a RP

Yea it is possible, sadly. But in my experience it was most effective with the logi. With a logi you could get your RP back for free after placing FOB + get defensive assets up.
I am always for making RPs less useful or harder to place. So if that would be a consequence of just adding one seat to logi, i am all for it

Fir3w411 wrote:Theoretically if they are taking a logi somewhere, like a flag, they more than likely will put down a fob with the crates in the logi, get a rally up (hopefully away from the fob), squad members spawn in and dig and they move on - if that's even what you were talking about.

This is pretty much it. Rush to a middle flag or advantageous position, place fob, place RP and get 8 shovels instead of 2.

This is not such a big issue nowadays maybe since a lot of servers do not allow rushing anyway. I see this mostly becoming an issue in more competitive games where teams are more likely to exploit such things.
Lets not focus too much on how things could get exploited tho. If we did a lot of things might have never made it into the game. In the end players always find a way to get most of every feature

It's a good suggestion and the discussion has been constructive so far. But I personally would be against this change. As Mats said this allows people to deploy without using proper trans, helping squads rush (which is still an issue IMO) as well as enabling a three man sniper, HAT, whatever squad to go wherever they like with all the crates they need. On one hand these squads that rush or are just looking to get kills, without considering the rest of the team might be more likely to build FOBs and help out. But it is just as likely that they will leave a logi in te middle of nowhere, or get killed, with the same effect.

As for the OPs original issue of transporting 8 man, the reality is that you have 1 guy hold spawn. Is it a pain, certainly, but it means the squad members have to follow orders if they want to avoid walking and further, it means the squad can't just rush into action. They need to wait for a second trans run or deploy an RP, encouraging the squad to move to an objective in an organised, thoughtful manner, not just bum rushing with 8 guys all gung-ho and what not. Two seats in a logi is part of the long and prodigious history PR has of using mechanics to encourage teamplay and co-operation as much as is possible whilst making sure we all have a good time.

Cheers, Murkey.

Many jeeps got upgraded to 8 seats at 1.0/1.1/1.2 right? Including the humvees.

I believe the problems Mats point out are severe enough to be against this myself.

[R-DEV]Mineral wrote:Many jeeps got upgraded to 8 seats at 1.0/1.1/1.2 right? Including the humvees.

It depends on the jeep, most armed ones don't hold 8 people, only really the unarmed "support" jeeps hold 8.

HMMWVs are still only 5 people in them since that is there max operating capacity since its too risky to sit a guy over the fuel tank or something alone those lines iirc.

The Land Rover WMIK only holds 3
But in the case of working with a logi you take Two WMIKs and 1 logi for an 8man squad.

[R-DEV]Mineral wrote:I believe the problems Mats point out are severe enough to be against this myself.

Bumping the requirement of squad members up to 3 as I mentioned before would solve that problem.

The idea sounds really good at first, but Mats and Murkey did make me think about it for a second time. And I'm against the idea.

Murkey wrote: As Mats said this allows people to deploy without using proper trans, helping squads rush (which is still an issue IMO) as well as enabling a three man sniper, HAT, whatever squad to go wherever they like with all the crates they need.
Cheers, Murkey.

Never seen a 3 man sniper squad so far. Most of the time its a solo sniper wasting the logi and this is possible with the current setup aswell.

I like the suggestion, simple and efficent.

Murkey wrote:helping squads rush (which is still an issue IMO) as well as enabling a three man sniper, HAT, whatever squad to go wherever they like with all the crates they need.

I fail to see what avoid them from doing it with the 2 seats logi truck

[R-DEV]Mats391 wrote: Rush to a middle flag or advantageous position, place fob, place RP and get 8 shovels instead of 2.

About Rally Points, Rhino said that if thats the case, they would increase the squad members nearby to 3 instead of 2




I just don't understand why adding a new seat can corrupt the game that much
Most of the CONs listed here can actually be done with 2 seats logi truck

The thing with the sniper/HAT squad is that you need a three man squad minimum to get these kits nowadays. While it obviously doesn't make it impossible to use a logi as ones own personal battle wagon, it discourages such behaviour having 3 guys in the squad and only 2 seats.

While this suggestion is more about logis than rally points, changing the number of squad members required for a rally has implications for other aspects of the game. Especially if a squad is running with only 5 or 6 guys in total.

Cheers, Murkey.