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The community is not intelligent enough...... to have two game mode on the same map!

As far as i can tell we are not intelligent to be able to use the same map for different game modes.
I think unfortunately we need to have specific maps dedicated to Insurgency and Scenario, otherwise 90% of the server population runs around in Conquest Mode like true Muppets.

End of rant; please discuss.

(this is not new ground, but the problem is as bad as ever.. and thats on a Beta test server.. ... let's sort it out!)

EDIT: Sorry if any took offence..by my crudness on this post..my intent was to generate a discussion about this topic.. please do not take my 'intellegence' bit to heart. It was ment as a jab in the ribs not a poke in the eye

what we really need is more documentation on this kinda thing to let ppl know the difference in gameplay, loading screens can also help alot, then ppl have a better chance of getting to grips with what is going on. The main point would be to reach all the squad leaders out there in the community as if you can reach them, they will reach there squad members in game and show them by example how it is meant to be done

yes..that will help.
But i've lost faith. people wont read the opening screen.. they will be too busy picking their noses and eating snot.. then the will run to the nearest Flag i.e Checkpoint as squad leader over and over and over again, with no purpose.

I really dont think two modes on one map will ever really work on public servers, real shame.

BUT PLEASE PROVE ME WRONG!

EDIT:.. One thing that might help: Take away ALL flags from Insurgency. (I've not have seen your scenario mode yet). So there are NO Flags to go running to....

MadTommy wrote:yes..that will help.
But i've lost faith. people wont read the opening screen.. they will be too busy picking their noses and eating snot.. then the will run to the nearest Flag i.e Checkpoint as squad leader over and over and over again, with no purpose.

I really dont think two modes on one map will ever really work on public servers, real shame.

BUT PLEASE PROVE ME WRONG!

EDIT:.. One thing that might help: Take away ALL flags from Insurgency. (I not have seen your scenario mode yet). So there are NO Flags to go running to....

Will I'm usually busy eating Cheese or yogurt while the game is loading, but that’s because I read the guide prior to playing the game.

hairy muff



(cockney)

MadTommy wrote:yes..that will help.
But i've lost faith. people wont read the opening screen.. they will be too busy picking their noses and eating snot.. then the will run to the nearest Flag i.e Checkpoint as squad leader over and over and over again, with no purpose.

I really dont think two modes on one map will ever really work on public servers, real shame.

BUT PLEASE PROVE ME WRONG!

EDIT:.. One thing that might help: Take away ALL flags from Insurgency. (I've not have seen your scenario mode yet). So there are NO Flags to go running to....

hehe, we have talked about removing all flags from the Ins game mode, but going to leave the NVCP flag there, once there for the next OB version to see how things go, just cos we feel we want to give the insurgents more to do than defending and ambushing as they do do a little attacking in r/l. thou the place flag has gone, and the place area is under control of the insurgents now. If the NVCP is still a big problem we will look into removing it 100%.

patience... we all need it in PR but very few have it..

some people just have to attack.

Having a flag actually works pretty well with the current insurgency mode. In order to gather intelligence on the caches, you have to get in a fight, and having a cappable flag like the VCP is better for that than having just the insurgent permaflag at the mosque. People still end up attacking the mosque, and it usually sucks, since the insurgents can just keep spawning there, so you end up with a sort of spawncamp.

Personally, I'll usually set up a cache hunting squad when on Basrah insurgency, and I'll go around looking for caches before even getting intel. I find that I am often the only one to start out of the palace, or even the only one actively looking for caches, but then, you can't squadlead the entire team. Yelling at squadleaders as a commander doesn't usually work either, and in .6, it seems like most people expect the commander to just spam bunkers until there are no tickets left.

daranz wrote:Having a flag actually works pretty well with the current insurgency mode. In order to gather intelligence on the caches, you have to get in a fight, and having a cappable flag like the VCP is better for that than having just the insurgent permaflag at the mosque. People still end up attacking the mosque, and it usually sucks, since the insurgents can just keep spawning there, so you end up with a sort of spawncamp.

Personally, I'll usually set up a cache hunting squad when on Basrah insurgency, and I'll go around looking for caches before even getting intel. I find that I am often the only one to start out of the palace, or even the only one actively looking for caches, but then, you can't squadlead the entire team. Yelling at squadleaders as a commander doesn't usually work either, and in .6, it seems like most people expect the commander to just spam bunkers until there are no tickets left.

So your point is? I'm confused?

You seem to agree and disagree with me in the same sentence.

his point is that you should allow lots of different types of game play into the game mode so there is something for everyone

personally what I do when I'm a SL on the brits team, is I will take my squad scouting around the relevant areas that are likely to have ammo dumps, if you see a bunch of insurgents hovering around an area, you can probably guess there is 1 or more ammo dumps there depending on the amount that are hovering

some times you can walk strait into ammo dumps with no one grading them thou too.

When you are on the insurgents team you want to try and defend your ammo dumps, without giving there position away, so you really want to cover the most likely routs going towards the area you want to defend, with IEDs etc, so if you do get into a fight, you ain't going to give the position of your ammo dumps away by it which most ppl do I find

daranz wrote:Having a flag actually works pretty well with the current insurgency mode. In order to gather intelligence on the caches, you have to get in a fight, and having a cappable flag like the VCP is better for that than having just the insurgent permaflag at the mosque. People still end up attacking the mosque, and it usually sucks, since the insurgents can just keep spawning there, so you end up with a sort of spawncamp.

Spread out the spawn points for the Mosque, so we can end up somewhere else instead in a room, sorrunded by GB...

Outlawz wrote:Spread out the spawn points for the Mosque, so we can end up somewhere else instead in a room, sorrunded by GB...

already done, also dont forget the spawn cars that you should try to hide and keep safe

MadTommy wrote:So your point is? I'm confused?

You seem to agree and disagree with me in the same sentence.

My point is that even though people are dumb and have short attention spans, we need cappable flags in Insurgency maps, so that we can get firefights that aren't simply baserapes of uncappable flags. And we need those firefights so that the Brits gain intel on locations of caches, which they do by killing insurgents, searching them, and knifing those annoying dudes in red shoes and green shirts.

In other words, the flags help to steer the game in the right direction, at least at the beginning. Yeah, they sometimes do attract a large portion of the team, but I don't think removing them is the solution.

daranz wrote:Having a flag actually works pretty well with the current insurgency mode. In order to gather intelligence on the caches, you have to get in a fight, and having a cappable flag like the VCP is better for that than having just the insurgent permaflag at the mosque. People still end up attacking the mosque, and it usually sucks, since the insurgents can just keep spawning there, so you end up with a sort of spawncamp.

Personally, I'll usually set up a cache hunting squad when on Basrah insurgency, and I'll go around looking for caches before even getting intel. I find that I am often the only one to start out of the palace, or even the only one actively looking for caches, but then, you can't squadlead the entire team. Yelling at squadleaders as a commander doesn't usually work either, and in .6, it seems like most people expect the commander to just spam bunkers until there are no tickets left.

I totally agree with you, and actually I do the same thing...

At the beginning of the round, when I am a Brit, I start looking for caches before getting intel, because I know a few caches positions... And it works great each times.

As an insurgent, I defend 1 ammo dump, and I dont rush like an idiot on NVCP during all the round.

'[R-DEV wrote:Rhino']already done, also dont forget the spawn cars that you should try to hide and keep safe

No no, add more and spread them across the city, I rather like ending up in a shed at ex-south VCP or near Industry...since Insurgents can come out of anywhere

'[R-DEV wrote:Rhino']his point is that you should allow lots of different types of game play into the game mode so there is something for everyone

Ok..and i'd agree. But when 90% of ppl play Conquest on an Insurgency Mode map, i get baffled, annoyed, frustrated etc.. All we had in vanilla was flippin Conquest; up until now 95% of PR servers play only Conquest, the DEV team comes out with some great new Modes.... and wait for it.....Yup you guessed it....the majority play them as Conquest.
:d uh: i think are all suitable emotions i feel, oh yeah and a bit of

Rhino et al... go for it..make the best maps etc you can.. we, as a community, will get it eventually. (you'll find MadTommy running between the mosque & church, (where is my church in Basrah anyway?) praying to whoever will listen)

'[R-DEV wrote:Rhino']what we really need is more documentation on this kinda thing to let ppl know the difference in gameplay, loading screens can also help alot, then ppl have a better chance of getting to grips with what is going on. The main point would be to reach all the squad leaders out there in the community as if you can reach them, they will reach there squad members in game and show them by example how it is meant to be done

Documentation doesnt cover it, I would say honestly that i dont think 50% of players have ever even looked at one page of the player guide, I think out of the 50% who have only about 25% truly took onboard what it advises and implement it in the game!

I think the best way to show poeple how to play the game, everything from squad formation to game modes should be in video format, make it intersting to watch and learn also at the same time a little built in promotion of the high standard of game that PR is

<SS&D>Bys0n wrote:Documentation doesnt cover it, I would say honestly that i dont think 50% of players have ever even looked at one page of the player guide, I think out of the 50% who have only about 25% truly took onboard what it advises and implement it in the game!

I think the best way to show poeple how to play the game, everything from squad formation to game modes should be in video format, make it intersting to watch and learn also at the same time a little built in promotion of the high standard of game that PR is

the thing is if you can get that 50% or 25% to read and take in the guide, they will pass the information on to the other players ingame. All you really need is to teach the ppl who want to play squad leader, and commander all the really dificault stuff and ppl who dont know jack shit should play as a squad member, and less than 25% of players ingame play as a SL so that means if you can reach thous 25% of ppl, you are doing very well

ok.. i'll run around preaching not praying.

MadTommy wrote:ok.. i'll run around preaching not praying.

lead by exsample, dose more than it says on the tin