Project Reality Forums

Anyone else thing the recoil is a little much on the 5.56 round? I pose this question to people that have actually shot them. I don't really like the muzzle climb either. I shot many of 5.56 rounds with very rapid fire and in no case did I have to "pull" the barrel down. The recoil went back, not up, and I could continue to fire quickly and relatively accurately...not just CQB. It would bounce a little but in no way consecutively climb. You could easily double tap targets with it.

The 3 round burst just seems way off, I've never done that irl but I can't imagine a little 5.56 round causing that much climb. I know the 3rnb is used for CQB situations as well as on moving targets where you can disperse several rounds in their direction....not only at 20ms but further out, ESPECIALLY in a prone position. Right now the 3rnb is only useful in CQB areas. Yeah I'm sure some people can do the pull down thing but for that small of a round it would not be necessary as there is little to nil muzzle climb. The deviation associated with the 3rnb burst coupled with the muzzle climb just seems off to me.

btw I'm fine with adjusting other areas of the game to give larger calibers their stopping-power model as well. I don't want to see the 5.56 just dominate in anyway.

Right now, the recoil levels are pretty good in terms of how relative they are to each other (G3 is smidge too much though). So if the G3 had a little lower recoil and less recoil was employed to the 5.56 weapons, it would have to be done proportionally to each other series of rifles.

The problem with three-round burst is that it's tricky to get it to act the way we'd like it too. From what I've heard in RL a good rifleman can achieve :

1st round: hit
2nd round: Relatively close
3rd round: Off (depends on range)

That would be a ***** to try get in game without overpowering the AR15 series.

All good points for sure. I also agree that the recoil in-game now is very good as far as being relative to each other.

As for fixing the 3rnb can we greatly reduce the muzzle climb? I think the deviation will keep people from making rock-n-roll effective.

I know the whole 5.56 vs G3 thing is touchy. I think that if we made the 3rnb effective then we would most certainly need some extras from the G3 to model it's stopping power. Some sort of hit-effect would be needed to give it a chance against the smaller round guys. That 3rnb would be deadly in EJOD situations where combat is at 100yds or so very often. The G3 would be hurting. I mean this is why most modern armies go for the 5.56 though...its long range accuracy and ability to put a lot of ammo down field quickly in urban environments. That 7.62 rnd is just too big to compete at close ranges.

Eitherway balance is very important here and I'm the last guy to say that.

I find that the M16A4 and L85 are both very controllable. Given, lots of muzzle climb, but Jaymz and Jonny have got that covered.

double click with your M16 IMO is better and more controllable than 3rnd

I use single shot now, burst is just a waste of ammo since they added deviation.

i dont know what all this complaining is about... have u ever shot a 5.56 rifle in burst or full-auto with a scope? u cant aim a sh**.
i think this recoilsystem is the best i have ever seen so far and is quite near to reality.

and now little suggestion for the people who never use single shots: above a distance of 30-40m its absolutly stupid to use fullauto or burst because even in reallife u loose all ur accuracy.

The whole reason the military adopted the 3-rd burst mode on the M16A2 was due to the VN grunts wasting assloads of ammo and burning up weapons. That's what happens when tripped-out stoners try to use a firearm with minimal training.

In the modern military the only time you are trained to use 3RB is during MOUT or when you are providing suppression/covering fire. Under most circumstances, if your SL sees you with your selector on burst, you will get a boot upside your helmet pretty damn fast. I personally NEVER used it because in my opinion the burst had too high a ROF, meaning you had to change mags more often while suppressing. I find it much better to use rapid single shots.

I have to agree with the OP about recoil. I shoot these in game and I wonder if the players are modelled after a little girl. Recoil is pretty bad, but I can also agree with the DEVs about balancing issues and game limitations.

i use burst in close quarters and for suppresion, the recoil is manageable i find.
hpwever i fimnd 3 rounds of full auto have less recoil then a thre round burst.

If I remember correctly, off the top of my head the ROF for an M4 in auto was around 600 RPM. ROF with M16A2 in 3RB was about 900 RPM. Bullet deviation in real life while firing the 3RB meant first 2 rounds usually hit (center mass followed by neck), while the 3rd would almost always miss. That was at about 50m. In MOUT ranges will be much closer, with 3RB being a probable 3-rd hit. The higher ROF in burst meant less recoil due to speed.

How about we tone down the recoil and the muzzle climb for 5.56 weapons?? I don't mind if we tone down the other guns as well...but lets at least model these as realistically as possible.

Ok so the M16 is going to have very little recoil like it does IRL. Well lets also make the G3 very accurate like it is IRL...which is most likely more so than the 4MOA M16. I wouldn't mind seeing a G3 hit to the Vest take all your stamina away too.

Yes these guns need balancing but imo there can be balance through realism. Its already tough enough for some people to kill a guy due to the deviation...no need to unrealistically increase the recoil.

I understand extra recoil is to "simulate" the back recoil but its just to much. I as a 13yo 125lb weenie could shoot a 5.56 round faster than the soldiers in PR can. We use to mess with those things like .22's....cutting metal fence posts in half with them and stuff. Just pop pop pop pop. Kids. Eitherway I'm not a fan of nerfing them, especially now that they have deviation.

I'd also GREATLY reduce the muzzle climb...at least then the 3rnb burst would be accurately modeled. I don't think it'd be over powered due to the deviation associated with it.