Project Reality Forums

I would like to see a lot bigger penalty in the death timer after a player makes suicide with his own weapons. Whether it is by shooting a RPG to the window frame or blowing an IED/C4 too close, no matter what.

With jihad cars there should not be additional penalty, the player that is taking the role of the suicide bomber is ready to die and trying to do it. As I understand it, suicide bombers are not in any way normal combatants, they have been doctrinated to do their thing.

I would say the rest of the people in battlefield are trying to survive and using an RPG to an enemy that is in close combat range is not very realistic, in reality I would say that they would surrender rather than blow themselves up.

This being a game, I don't thing that having some sort of surrender system would work that well. Having a very long death timer after suicide (several minutes) would probably have some positive effect to the players behaviour in intense close combat situation:

1) Having them trying to select a different weapon
2) Run away
3) ...or the best, start thinking about the game in more realistic manner and avoid letting the enemy get to close combat range in the first place.

atshii wrote:I would like to see a lot bigger penalty in the death timer after a player makes suicide with his own weapons. Whether it is by shooting a RPG to the window frame or blowing an IED/C4 too close, no matter what.

With jihad cars there should not be additional penalty, the player that is taking the role of the suicide bomber is ready to die and trying to do it. As I understand it, suicide bombers are not in any way normal combatants, they have been doctrinated to do their thing.

I would say the rest of the people in battlefield are trying to survive and using an RPG to an enemy that is in close combat range is not very realistic, in reality I would say that they would surrender rather than blow themselves up.

This being a game, I don't thing that having some sort of surrender system would work that well. Having a very long death timer after suicide (several minutes) would probably have some positive effect to the players behaviour in intense close combat situation:

1) Having them trying to select a different weapon
2) Run away
3) ...or the best, start thinking about the game in more realistic manner and avoid letting the enemy get to close combat range in the first place.

I know it might be insulting, but I think that the insurgents shouldn't have a death timer. Their tactics are well-known which include sometimes killing themselves.

For conventional armies: Yes! Definitely hate it when you get killed again by a guy shooting his H-AT too early!

I would like to see a lot bigger penalty in the death timer after a player makes suicide with his own weapons. Whether it is by shooting a RPG to the window frame or blowing an IED/C4 too close, no matter what.

I 100% disagree. As brummy stated, insurgents don't operate by the standard rules. While they're probably not going to be blowing themselves up with RPGs, they certainly use suicide bombs on a regular basis. For RPGs I can kinda see where you're coming from. I agree that you shouldn't be able to be revived, but most of the time that you get killed by explosives you are unrevivable (at least that's what I've found).

For conventional armies, and even the militia, I agree suicide bombing should be punished. It just doesn't happen very often, and people diving under a tank to blow it up instead of taking it out the right way is very unrealistic. Although I will be the first to admit that I have the C4 and run method as a primary in my anti-tank playbook.

brummy.uk wrote:I know it might be insulting, but I think that the insurgents shouldn't have a death timer. Their tactics are well-known which include sometimes killing themselves.

In Iraq, insurgents are mostly ex-Iraq military or tribal fighters, am I correct? Sure there are foreign mujahedin (sp) ready and maybe looking for a chance to die fighting for their cause, but they are already represented in the game with jihad cars. I would say normal insurgents are not trying to die but to survive the fights in same way as any soldier. Sure some people cornered in a fight may make battle to the bitter end, but most are looking to be alive the next day too.

IEDs are not meant to be used in suicide attacks, why would they be when suicide vests are much better in that regard (if "better" can be used in this context). Devs have pretty much decided so, because in 0.7 IEDs don't "stick" to vehicles any more, which hinders their use in suicide attacks.

BloodBane611 wrote:I 100% disagree. As brummy stated, insurgents don't operate by the standard rules. While they're probably not going to be blowing themselves up with RPGs, they certainly use suicide bombs on a regular basis. For RPGs I can kinda see where you're coming from. I agree that you shouldn't be able to be revived, but most of the time that you get killed by explosives you are unrevivable (at least that's what I've found).

Sure suicide bombings make the news all the time (fortunately not so much lately), but I don't think suicide bombs are actually used that much in battles like those in which PR is played. Could you throw some links to info if you think they are used in that manner?

The situations where they are used are chosen carefully, because there truly is not that many applicants for the job for them to be used carelessly, from a logistical point of view. The ever chancing situation in battlefield does not help and when target soldiers are already alerted, the chance to get to close enough is not that good, when compared to bombing a checkpoint or getting into a base with hidden suicide vest.

For conventional armies, and even the militia, I agree suicide bombing should be punished. It just doesn't happen very often, and people diving under a tank to blow it up instead of taking it out the right way is very unrealistic. Although I will be the first to admit that I have the C4 and run method as a primary in my anti-tank playbook.

I would say this sort of C4 use is something that should be discouraged very much, as has already been done with the delay for explosives in 0.7. IEDs and C4 are meant to be placed and the user waits for the target to come to them, not the other way around. Using them in the manner above is exactly againts what the PR is about, IMHO. C4 throwing was great for vanilla and should stay there.

Sure, this is a game, so players will use all means available to them sometimes in very un-realistic manner, but I think PR devs have chosen to take the game towards the reality (without forgetting gameplay) so I hope they will implement chances towards that goal in the future too.

atshii wrote:In Iraq, insurgents are mostly ex-Iraq military or tribal fighters, am I correct? Sure there are foreign mujahedin (sp) ready and maybe looking for a chance to die fighting for their cause, but they are already represented in the game with jihad cars. I would say normal insurgents are not trying to die but to survive the fights in same way as any soldier. Sure some people cornered in a fight may make battle to the bitter end, but most are looking to be alive the next day too.

IEDs are not meant to be used in suicide attacks, why would they be when suicide vests are much better in that regard (if "better" can be used in this context). Devs have pretty much decided so, because in 0.7 IEDs don't "stick" to vehicles any more, which hinders their use in suicide attacks.

Can you elaborate on your experiences in Iraq which led you to these conclusions?

TRANSLATION: Stop talking out of your ***. Its painfully obvious you have little to no idea of what youre talking about

atshii wrote:In Iraq, insurgents are mostly ex-Iraq military or tribal fighters, am I correct? Sure there are foreign mujahedin (sp) ready and maybe looking for a chance to die fighting for their cause, but they are already represented in the game with jihad cars. I would say normal insurgents are not trying to die but to survive the fights in same way as any soldier. Sure some people cornered in a fight may make battle to the bitter end, but most are looking to be alive the next day too.

IEDs are not meant to be used in suicide attacks, why would they be when suicide vests are much better in that regard (if "better" can be used in this context). Devs have pretty much decided so, because in 0.7 IEDs don't "stick" to vehicles any more, which hinders their use in suicide attacks.

Can you elaborate on your experiences in Iraq which led you to these conclusions?

TRANSLATION: Stop talking out of your ***. Its painfully obvious you have little to no idea of what youre talking about

Heres one for you....
I think you should have a LONGER spawn wait time if you employ such tactics as suicide bombing whether it be in a jihad car or truck or by any other means.

My reasoning....
If you are a suicide bomber....IMO....you have already prepared yourself for the gravity of the situation. You have already come to grips with the fact that you are leaving this earth and moving on to the after-life.
Gone from this world......forever.
You know that you blowing up yourself is final. The end.
It is also spiritual, you are SACRIFICING yourself to the greater good of your cause what ever it may be.
Also....it is your goal to take out as many infidels as you can with your last bang.

I propose this....
If you are going to employ the suicide attack by any means....you should be prepared to make the sacrifice. You should also make sure it is done for the greater good of your team by making your own death worthy by taking out as many enemy as possible.

You can do this by implementing a 3 minute spawn time for suicide bombers...if they kill no one.
2 minutes if they kill 1 enemy.
1.5 minutes if they kill 2 enemy.
1 minute if they kill 3 enemy.
30 seconds if they kill 4 enemy.

And if they kill 5 or more... they get immediate respawn and a message in the upper left that is visible to all players that says "Player X has just earned 70 virgins" or something to that nature.
Maybe in the insurgency maps have them earn a weapons cache back that can be placed on the map by the successful suicide bomber or something.

I think the suicide bomber tactic is valid....just make it where it is employed and awarded more efficiently and so it is used for the betterment of the entire game ad not just spamed by "joe average" on his 1st day in PR.

hippo_76 wrote:Can you elaborate on your experiences in Iraq which led you to these conclusions?

TRANSLATION: Stop talking out of your ***. Its painfully obvious you have little to no idea of what youre talking about

If you have first hand information from Iraq or Afganishtan, please bring out how things truly are. My post started with a sentence ending with question mark, so I would like to get corrected if possible.

I just find it pretty unbelivable idea that most or even a small part of the ex-Iraq military and tribal fighters would have turned to insurgents to whom survival does not matter. Most of the Iraq military units dissolved without a fight, so I would say they value their life.