Project Reality Forums

For 0.8, the APC's that have a commander seat in real life should get the same driver view as the tanks. At least all driver seats on the APC's should get the ability to look backwards, in order to reverse easier and cover the rear when the gunner is busy engaging targets in front.

In other words: simply making it more practical for the driver to drive the APC. It's not unrealistic or hard to do in anyway as far as I know...

At least all driver seats on the APC's should get the ability to look backwards

A big YES at this one.

No, because there's no back window on an APC - at least not one that the driver can see.

But I do know that at the very least, the American APC has those side view mirrors. If those could be angled properly, and given a reflective surface, I bet that would suffice, and be more realistic.

Guys inside of APCs shouldn't really be able to see out at all?, more like the BMP

The mirrors are what i mean. Afaik there are no really working mirrors in the BF2 engine, only fake ones. So the only way to simulate them being used would be a second camera perspective at the position of the mirror. Wouldnt be too unrealistic either.

darkwarrior666 wrote:No, because there's no back window on an APC - at least not one that the driver can see.

But I do know that at the very least, the American APC has those side view mirrors. If those could be angled properly, and given a reflective surface, I bet that would suffice, and be more realistic.

Dr2B Rudd wrote:Guys inside of APCs shouldn't really be able to see out at all?, more like the BMP

I don't think this is the kind of realism the devs are trying to achieve. It's just details...

Playability, survivabilty and teamworkability V.S minor detail. Hmm...

I totally agree APC should have a 360 view like main battle tank.

its not that its not there on real APCS, the only reason you can only see in front right now is because in the APC you're using the forward window with periscope attatchment. i do believe APCs of this sort do have cameras on the turret or somekind of backing up camera

Farks wrote:I don't think this is the kind of realism the devs are trying to achieve. It's just details...

Playability, survivabilty and teamworkability V.S minor detail. Hmm...

I always hate people who bring up these kinds of arguements. I swear, if an entire update of PR was dedicated to 'minor details', I swear you'd all go 'daaaamn!'

I mean, all the new weapon animations are 'minor details'. New factions(unless they have something different to bring to the table, like USAr, Militia n Insurgents) are 'minor details', since all the organized militaries are pretty identical. Shiny new 50 cal models are 'minor details'. New Humvee models are 'minor details'. Yet I never hear anyone shooting the devs down for any of that.

And from my (somewhat limited) knowledge of modding, the 'minor details' are far easier to do than the 'playability, survivability and teamwork' factors. True, lots of 'minor details' will stack up and eventually become as big as the 'major' ones, but us players quite enjoy those little things. I'd love to shoot with a more detailed weapon model. I'd love to see digital camo on US soldiers. I'd love to see working mirrors on Humvees, Technicals, and other light armed transports. These little details improve the overall package, and help the 'reality' feel just as much as over 9000 gameplay balances, so don't knock it.

Spec_Operator wrote:The mirrors are what i mean. Afaik there are no really working mirrors in the BF2 engine, only fake ones. So the only way to simulate them being used would be a second camera perspective at the position of the mirror. Wouldnt be too unrealistic either.

What about the scopes on several sniper rifles? They reflect (or seem to) the view behind the player. I dunno if that is a fake mirror or if it only refelects somethings or what...

It just reflects a set image, depending on what area of the map you're in I remember reading, its not a true reflection of what's behind you

As far as i know the reflection on the scopes is the same no matter where you are. At least to me they never seemed to show what was actually behind me.

Edit:
(Too late)

Edit2:
Yes, right, i remember that too, the mapper can place funny thingies and the scope shows stuff from their perspective or so.

darkwarrior666 wrote:I always hate people who bring up these kinds of arguements. I swear, if an entire update of PR was dedicated to 'minor details', I swear you'd all go 'daaaamn!'

I mean, all the new weapon animations are 'minor details'. New factions(unless they have something different to bring to the table, like USAr, Militia n Insurgents) are 'minor details', since all the organized militaries are pretty identical. Shiny new 50 cal models are 'minor details'. New Humvee models are 'minor details'. Yet I never hear anyone shooting the devs down for any of that.

And from my (somewhat limited) knowledge of modding, the 'minor details' are far easier to do than the 'playability, survivability and teamwork' factors. True, lots of 'minor details' will stack up and eventually become as big as the 'major' ones, but us players quite enjoy those little things. I'd love to shoot with a more detailed weapon model. I'd love to see digital camo on US soldiers. I'd love to see working mirrors on Humvees, Technicals, and other light armed transports. These little details improve the overall package, and help the 'reality' feel just as much as over 9000 gameplay balances, so don't knock it.

I do not see how you can draw these parallels, and you're also contradicting yourself in the argument you're making. I suggested that APC drivers should get the ability to somehow view backwards in order to reverse easier and also check the rear for enemies. Then some people said that it might be unrealistic (which is not the case on all APC's in PR anyway). What I then said and meant was that it would just be a minor, realistic detail not being able to look backwards, and giving the drivers the ability to look backwards would increase the effectivness of APC crews. It's also not gonna affect the PR gameplay or realism negative in anyway, since it, like said, makes APC's more effective. And your contradiction is that you say that a whole update with minor things such as new anims, etc, would increase the realism feel in the mod. But just before that, you appearently spoke out against my idea, which itself is one of those improvements!

I don't see the contradiction...

It's called a misunderstanding, not a contradiction. Anyone with enough intelligence to navigate this forum would agree with you if they had a clear understanding of what you said.

Forum egos aside...

I dislike driving tank/apc/ anything immensely with that stupid 360 camera thing.
If that's how it works irl then so be it... if not then I want that camera right where my dam head is

gclark03 wrote:I don't see the contradiction...

It's called a misunderstanding, not a contradiction. Anyone with enough intelligence to navigate this forum would agree with you if they had a clear understanding of what you said.

Who do you say missunderstood? Me or him, or somebody else? ??:

i agree. And if you dont want to give the driver a 360 View. Give him a back looking cam like in the jets...

Same for the Trucks. (And there it is realistic to can watch backwards)

So often someone run over a friendly because you havent any chance to see what is behind you.

I dont talk about if it is realistic.

But i think in RL the dont let drive things like an apc backwards and the driver isnt able to look were he drives...or what is behind him...

So i think the back cam view is a great deal. And when the mirror works, bring them in. If not, let be the back view cam the placeholder.

I usually just ask if anyone's behind me on VOIP. Or shout "Taking fire, falling back" and wait for a very short pause before getting out of there. The only time I need to reverse is when I'm under fire, so people usually jump in sharpish, or jump out and to cover - no one hangs around outside an APC after it's taken an RPG round.
As a result, I don't have a problem with running people over.

if its like taht in RL then yes otherwise no....i say that beacucse i think that single seaters would start using it because they are now just as alert as if they had a gunner looking around and watching the back the reason single seaters go for tanks is b/c they can identify a target around them faster then in a APC..if we give them the 360 view its kinda like a tank



although this isnt that much of a deal i think it would influence single seat armor in the wrong direction

I think it's a good idea to give them the ability to have a limited reverse view. It's realistic that they can look back, but it needs to be done with a limited field of view just like they have. Sight lines around an apc are pretty bad, so while he should be able to look behind, much of the vehicle would block the drivers view.