Project Reality Forums

SAW SAW SAW,s Everywhere, I think they,re waaay to effective compared to other weaps. maybe lower rate of fire or aim..or time delay on firing from prone...less body armour, plz whatever it takes to stop players spamming it

One word, SNIPER.

real life aint balanced...

another two words: flank, m203

SAW is balanced; can't heal himself, has no long distance vision and absolutely no means to beat anybody in close quarters. You need players for every depth of the battlefield, this one caters to your defense as well as holding the middle ground.

acadiancrusader wrote:another two words: flank, m203

no just flank them with your m16 and shoot them in head or knife them. No need for a m203.

The support kit itself is unbalanced. The lmg's themselves are fine, they do exactly what they are supposed to do, mow down anything that gets in their field of fire with a massive field of fire(and effectively lay down supressing fire). What needs to be changed is the way the support class can rearm itself. Why conserve your ammo and pick your shots(somewhat) when you can unload without any qualms because you have unlimited ammo?

Without this, the way people just unload would ruin them after only a few kills.

lonelyjew wrote:The support kit itself is unbalanced. The lmg's themselves are fine, they do exactly what they are supposed to do, mow down anything that gets in their field of fire with a massive field of fire(and effectively lay down supressing fire). What needs to be changed is the way the support class can rearm itself. Why conserve your ammo and pick your shots(somewhat) when you can unload without any qualms because you have unlimited ammo?

Without this, the way people just unload would ruin them after only a few kills.

this is something that i definately agree with. the unlimited ammo thing is absurd. infact, the military teaches ammo conservation. people simply shoot far too much ingame as there are no consequences for doing so. you have supply crates and support classes to rearm everyone. it really is rediculous. if the support class was limited to just a couple (or whatever real world equilivant is) ammo bags, it would be far better.

actually, the ammo bag is kinda rediculous in itself... the saw, mag-based rifles, shot-gun shells, 50cal, etc,... are all different. but for some reason, the happy-magic-all-purpose-ammo-bag doesn't seem to care about that fact.

i hope that this is something on the list for the devs to address down the line.

and i emphasize 'down the line' as i don't want to come across complaining about something that really isn't THAT important, compared to other aspects of the game.

obviously there is a long list of things that the devs need to tackle, and that list needs to be organized with priority in mind. we, as PR community members, need to remember this. we can find/talk/***** about sooooo many things in the game. we just need to remember that devs can only do so much at a time. priority of issue is something that us non-devs often forget.

I'd be happy if their was a way to limit ammo bags like you would limit grenades, only give them 3 bags or so and holding it does nothing for rearm. Reality, people run out of ammo.

I've posted this in another thread, but I was discussing this last night with my good friend Sandman, who's getting a little peeved by it:

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Simple Solution to the Support Ownage (unless there is no way of limiting classes)

1. Take away body armour. Why on earth give them body armour? At least we might be able to shoot them first before the have the abillity to spam the dive animation glitch
2. Make them not able to sprint at all
3. Implement the code with the sniper and m203's that you have to stay still before it becomes accurate (to simulate getting out the tripod)
4. Completley nerf fireing from the hip, or when standing

I don't mind the power and accuracy. The problem is that people are abusing it. Theres too many, and all i even see from them is rambo's who dive prone and drop you before they even hit the ground. The dive animation needs the same treatment as hopping and sprinting (the gun tucks into their body)

Its really starting the damage the playabillity of the game, and the sustainabillity of a large community, including clans. Imagine clan matches. You will just get a whole squad of gunners, and there is nothing you can do about it.

You can only take the realism of the game to a certain point. Its still a game, its open to abuse, and the engine has massive limitations.

To be honest i think its good that they own wen lying down, but wen they are used while standing and walking they are far too accurate. They look pretty heavy and hard to use on the move.

AT is ok... Support rearming may stay... Just let's take out their nades....

Peter-SAS - points 2&4 can make them camping all the time in one place... one they are rushing at least...

lonelyjew wrote:The support kit itself is unbalanced. The lmg's themselves are fine, they do exactly what they are supposed to do, mow down anything that gets in their field of fire with a massive field of fire(and effectively lay down supressing fire). What needs to be changed is the way the support class can rearm itself. Why conserve your ammo and pick your shots(somewhat) when you can unload without any qualms because you have unlimited ammo?

Without this, the way people just unload would ruin them after only a few kills.

I'm sorry to break this to you -- but..

The job of the real life Support Gunner is very well depicted in the Mod. I would hate to see anyone start making posts regarding their own opinion of balance (which is very subjective and varies from person to person) and then try to noob down the Mod, just like the noobs did to vanilla BF2.

We're not here to make up opinions regarding balance and stuff. That's why there're Military Advisors in the team...to get Real Life Facts, among other things.

If you get killed a lot by support kits, or by any other kit....try better teamwork and timming, etc...it does work. And NO....they DONT have unlimited ammo.

Hope this clears up some things for you.

They have to throw down the ammo or hold it for a length of time in order to rearm, so just kill them when they are doing that .You can tell that there is a serious lack of teamwork here because if you have a good diversity of classes in your squad, you don't have to worry about one SAW/MG gunner.

Too many people are going lone wolve or have too many snipers in there squads as it is. When they statrt to learn you need to use some tactics and have balanced squads, then they will learn what this mod is all about. And MGers do have armor in real life.

instead of taking out his ammo bag or making it limited, an easier way would be to make his ammo bag rearm a lot slower than it is right now. And to provide more incentive, u can provide more points for rearming ppl than killing ppl. I mean, the only reason these support guys spray bullets like throwing hot chips in Brazil carnival is because their ammo bag recharge a lot faster than they can possibly exhaust it. When that's not true, and when rearming teammates net more points, then there'll be less ppl doing it.

And here's something i just thought recently that i am not sure if it might works.

Is it possible to code in a point system where a soldier gets point for shooting or shooting and killing someone who is wounding a teammate? Basically the idea is to make the support guy do his job, and to reward ppl who prevents the opposing side from finishing off a fellow teammate. I know this has a lot of factors that needed to be taken into account, and needs some work before it can even be considered balanced but just a thought.

hmm, im leaning more towards taking AWAY the ammo bag from the support class alltogether, and giving it to another class... such as assaulter.

In real life, the LMG gunner will carry 2-3 boxes himself, but every rifleman will also carrys a few boxes himself FOR the lmg's.

Hmm, considering that maybe we can change one of the seldom used classes into just a pure rifleman. M16 w/ iron sight, nades and ammo bag (x3) lets say. Make the 'assault' class into a rifleman with 203... no more no less.

We should start moving to more realistic loadouts I think...

Lets chart this out


Squad Leader : M16 - ACOG sight for spotting, smoke nades, pistol.
Rifleman : M16 - Iron Sights, a few nades and some ammo boxes.
203 Gunner: M16 - Iron Sights+203, 1 nade and ammo for himself.
Support Gunner - M249, 2x ammo box.
Medic - M16 - Iron Sights, medical bag (limited to 2-3 revives per person per life as stated in another thread).

And AT soldier I am not sure, I would give him an AT rocket that does high damage, maybe 1 hit kill on any lightly armoured vehicles, plus an M16 iron sight with a few mags. In real life any soldier carries a good supply of ammunition for his personal weapon no matter WHAT his speciality is.

Eh, any pickings on my idea?

nope.. i liked it

i was wondering though, if the supply crate is not put into the game, and considering the focus on trying to stay alive rather than getting frags, it's likely we will hit a point where we run out of ammo. I know it's realistic and all to be low on ammo, but to be in a condition where u have no ammo is painfull.

i was wondering if there could be something that can replenish ammo without limit, but with very slow reload for each person. A bit like how the supply in Natural Selection mod works but slower.

well think for a second, in all honesty HOW many times have you run completely dry of ammo in a fight, without dying first?

The only instances I can think of is when using a sniper, i am ALWAYS running dry on ammo before I die. That is a special case though.

Otherwise I can only think of being dry on certain TYPES of ammo, such as 203 Nades, or grenades in general.

I think most of the time players simply want more nades to spam, they still have 4 mags left in their ammo pouches.

It all depends too, I am a fairly cautious person, I almost ALWAYS have my weapon on single-shot, unless I know someone is going to be around the next corner. Someone else who uses auto or 3rd burst might be out of ammo after a 30 second fire fight.


*shrug*

00SoldierofFortune00 wrote:And MGers do have armor in real life.

If your going off of that then its safe to say that every unit in the front lines (which would be every kit in BF2) is issued Body Armor. I don't think you would find one soldier in a combat enviroment that would not have at least a flak vest and a kevlar helmet. (spec-ops asside) Hell I was in the Air Force and well away from any combat areas and even I was issued a Kevlar brain bucket and a Flak vest.

are there any classes that DONT have body armour?

they should.. all of them..