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So, I was playing on Qwai River the other day, and I was China. The round was a stalemate. The usual scenario - US going for Fishing village while China went for Government office. The only problem was, The actual government office was sealed off by barbed wire and mines on every possible entrance. And the US had about 10 soldiers in the main complex. So for most of the round, the whole Chinese team was sitting outside of the gov office, lobbing grenades over the walls, and basically laying siege. The flag wasn't moving at all though as they had a Bunker in the gov office. We tried these methods of getting in.

1.Grapple hook - got like 3 people in, but we all got killed off in no time.

2.Backed the butt of the APC into the gov office through the barbed wire evading the mines, so the men could jump out from the back behind the wire. But this didn't work out too well. You can only do this for so long.

3.Jdam. This worked out... killed the US and then blew up the wire, but the US just put more wire and sealed it all off.

I then went AFK, and found that we had government office. I dunno how we did it, but that's not the point. Literally for 30 min we were trying to just get into the gov office. now... compare this to fishing village which is this flag's equivalent on the Chinese side. Fishing cannot be blocked off with wire as gov can. And is much easier to take. This aspect frustrated me alot about the round.

We need to make more openings in gov office that cant be blocked by wire, OR will the new wire and tank trap static prevent the wire from being used in this way? (because the of the tank traps) (will they be too big or something). I think this is an issue because China is at a bit of a disadvantage here.

Heh, I remember a time where it was just my squad holding off pretty much the entire Chinese army. We held it for for the entire round. It was very hectic and many times we came close to losing it but we always managed to push them out.

By the way, you can build up a destroyed firebase with only one person. Once you start shoveling you can't ever let go of the button. A lot of people have this misconception that it takes two. Why do I bring this up? It helps when you can have five people repelling the enemy while another builds up the firebase for reinforcements.

Putting the PLA Car against the wall is an easy way to get over the wall.
But yeah, Government is easy to defend with the razor wires.

Yes, but once the Chinese get Gov't Office it's very difficult for the US to retake it; they must cross the open rice paddies or drive down a very exposed road to get there.

Nyte's my favorite solution, I've used this countless times.

-REad

Goverment office is extremely easy to defend compared to Fishing village.
As US i have no interest in capping the flag unless there's someone allready waiting on Temple/Estate..

Isn't the idea of wire to do exactly as you said?

I then went AFK, and found that we had government office. I dunno how we did it, but that's not the point. Literally for 30 min we were trying to just get into the gov office. now... compare this to fishing village which is this flag's equivalent on the Chinese side. Fishing cannot be blocked off with wire as gov can. And is much easier to take. This aspect frustrated me alot about the round.

We need to make more openings in gov office that cant be blocked by wire, OR will the new wire and tank trap static prevent the wire from being used in this way? (because the of the tank traps) (will they be too big or something). I think this is an issue because China is at a bit of a disadvantage here.

yes the Chinese are at a disadvantage so why do you think they have tanks?

1 tank + small enclosed space + lots of infantry + heat rounds = death
even though the US get TOW Humvee's they are not really a match for a tank and can be taken out with ease.

Shotgun wrote:Isn't the idea of wire to do exactly as you said?



yes the Chinese are at a disadvantage so why do you think they have tanks?

1 tank + small enclosed space + lots of infantry + heat rounds = death
even though the US get TOW Humvee's they are not really a match for a tank and can be taken out with ease.

No.. No.. No.. TOW HUMVEE greater than tank. The TOWs have speed. They overpower the tank most of the time. And what? A tank in close quarters? They kinda suck at that.... Can't move the big gun around that fast you know? ...

by small enclosed space i meant the area that the cap zone at govt offices is in

M_Striker wrote:No.. No.. No.. TOW HUMVEE greater than tank. The TOWs have speed. They overpower the tank most of the time. And what? A tank in close quarters? They kinda suck at that.... Can't move the big gun around that fast you know? ...

TOW Humvees are very vulnerable, and very much defeatable by a tank. It's just that most people with TOW Humvees go tank hunting while the tanks are happy to stay zoomed in on one of the flags, paying no attention to what's going on around them.

On the other hand, it WOULD be nice to have some sort of means to clear the barbed wire for the 20-odd other people stuck besieging the government office...

a tank can easily take on a tow humwee especially with the new tow's we are getting in .85 (which i'm looking forward to) but a dedicated and professional tow squad will be more than a match against the tanks (not own them as currently with one shot one kill) it will be more of a fair match, but with ambushes the humwees can do some serious damage still.

TOW Humvees are way better than poor Chinese tanks. Not only as the missile is easier to fire and Humvee is faster, the missile can destroy tank with 1 shot, even if it just hits the front armor. :I

RedAlertSF wrote:TOW Humvees are way better than poor Chinese tanks. Not only as the missile is easier to fire and Humvee is faster, the missile can destroy tank with 1 shot, even if it just hits the front armor. :I

I kinda dissagree, tank shot is faster to shoot,faster in travel speed, easier to aim as it goes right where u shoot it, hummer is goner with one shot no matter where you hit it.
Tank has multiple roles that it fits perfectly, TOW has just one.

Single Tank can/will cripple the whole US team, it comes down to skill even with these instakill tows/tanks.

Qwai's a joke really as I don't take it seriously. It feels that even if changes were made, it'd end up to be fruitless. It needs to be redesigned with more logical geography in mind aswell.

Let's just put alot of armored assets on a 1km map. Then slap them in the middle of an area which has 3 different bottle-necks to cross the river, then reduce the view distance to 350 meters or so. No point to equip yourself with a Sniper Kit anyway, even if it's for recon. It's very difficult to effectively determine an overwatch location without getting dangerously close to enemy movement.

While we're at it, let's throw some Light Attack/Transport helos on a confined airspace where armored units are present. Despite the fact that the choppers are ill-equipped to defeat armor and would otherwise never be present in such a hostile environment to begin with.

On top of that, let's add a bunch of wide-open ricefields that don't render at long distance. Then put a random sink-hole lake next to the U.S. base so vehicles/infantry can get stuck in with no way out.

Personally, it's just a map that should have been taken out a long time ago or refined furthur. Even though I enjoy assymetrical asset balancing, it simply was done in the wrong taste here. Like stated before, we need a mapper to redesign Qwai river. Maybe one day someone will have the good sense to increase the view distance to atleast a bare minimum of 500 meters. Then we'll talk about asset revamping.

Qwai River honestly has a Vanilla BF2 twist to it that somehow people never seem to realize to this day. It simply does not compare to other maps we have now. Fix it or can it, this map is getting old fast.

Matter of fact, while we're at it someone do us a favor and get rid of "The Road to Kyongon Ni" until it's up to PR standards. The flora and geography of these older maps are horrendous. To be honest, I'd be so bold to say that "Mao Valley" and "Steel Thunder" are still better maps than these if memory serves me well.

Warrem, i think you're unfair.
Qwai along with Jabal's been here since like v0.3, and compared to the maps around then you can't speak of vanilla twist.
Agree they're slacking behind with the incredible maps we've gotten in the new releases, but i'm still amazed at how ahead of their time they were, and how good they've held up.
And i still think they both play out really well! Alot of worse maps in rotation..

M.Warren wrote:Qwai's a joke really as I don't take it seriously. It feels that even if changes were made, it'd end up to be fruitless. It needs to be redesigned with more logical geography in mind aswell.

Let's just put alot of armored assets on a 1km map. Then slap them in the middle of an area which has 3 different bottle-necks to cross the river, then reduce the view distance to 350 meters or so. No point to equip yourself with a Sniper Kit anyway, even if it's for recon. It's very difficult to effectively determine an overwatch location without getting dangerously close to enemy movement.

While we're at it, let's throw some Light Attack/Transport helos on a confined airspace where armored units are present. Despite the fact that the choppers are ill-equipped to defeat armor and would otherwise never be present in such a hostile environment to begin with.

On top of that, let's add a bunch of wide-open ricefields that don't render at long distance. Then put a random sink-hole lake next to the U.S. base so vehicles/infantry can get stuck in with no way out.

Personally, it's just a map that should have been taken out a long time ago or refined furthur. Even though I enjoy assymetrical asset balancing, it simply was done in the wrong taste here. Like stated before, we need a mapper to redesign Qwai river. Maybe one day someone will have the good sense to increase the view distance to atleast a bare minimum of 500 meters. Then we'll talk about asset revamping.

Qwai River honestly has a Vanilla BF2 twist to it that somehow people never seem to realize to this day. It simply does not compare to other maps we have now. Fix it or can it, this map is getting old fast.

Matter of fact, while we're at it someone do us a favor and get rid of "The Road to Kyongon Ni" until it's up to PR standards. The flora and geography of these older maps are horrendous. To be honest, I'd be so bold to say that "Mao Valley" and "Steel Thunder" are still better maps than these if memory serves me well.

you sound mighty negative there Warren,
make a better one

hx.bjoffe wrote:Warrem, i think you're unfair.
Qwai along with Jabal's been here since like v0.3, and compared to the maps around then you can't speak of vanilla twist.

Some maps may have been around since the v0.3 build, but it has run it's course. It is in need of being upgraded or decommissioned, per se. Regardless if it the map itself was ahead of it's time, the gameplay that transpires out from it now is like Vanilla.

Wide-open uncovered rice fields... Vehicle camping... Sandbagged Gov't Office entry ways... Nade spamming over the walls... Engineers huddled up against the Mine-flag repairing the door into the bunker only to get hit by an anti-tank rocket. Just completely amazing gameplay right there. Only thing it's missing is a circus tent, then the show would be official.

Yes, there are worse maps out there. Kinda like Seven Gates, but that's another story. Oh well, we need fillers in the map rotation anyway. Afterall, I'm sure Qwai River still be around another... Let's say 2-3 more releases?

[R-DEV]Nickbond592 wrote:you sound mighty negative there Warren,
make a better one

I may complain or be negative at times, but it's with reason. Unless you'd rather ask Outlawz opinion. Then we'd both be banging our heads on the wall for the next hour. You know, some ridiculous arguement would stem up about the Oil Tower positioned south of the Government Office that serves no purpose to the setting.

M.Warren wrote: Kinda like Seven Gates, but that's another story.

i like seven gates...ive had some of my best round on that with incredible 2 squad team work

i think what your against is the big open spaces..but that happens in the real world..the world was NOT created to be a war zone...i like all the maps now.and a agree w/ you a little on qwai and kygon ni...but i do think taht the OP might make the map a little diffrent and better