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Staminia ingame versus RL one.
Posted: 2009-04-12 17:10
by Hotrod525
Hey guyz, i'm not here to suggest more stamia, but only to talk about it, i'm currently doing my military training, and they make us walk like we never walk in our damn life (whit our Rucksack loaded to the max [50lbs]) every morning we jog 50 minutes around the base, we climb 12 floors 10 times a day, we do 18hours shift, plus the physical training in gym... So, i was woundering how come a fully trained soldier wont be able to run more than 30 secondes in P.R. The mod is based on realism, and most of people who are in military would agree whit me. Yes there is a "gameplay issue" but, you cant call you're mod "Reality" if you always adjust the reality for "gameplay". If atleast we could be able to run 1 min or 2, that would be alot more realistic.
If i can run 50 min whit my sergeant shouting on me, i had no difficulty to beleive that a soldier under real fire would run quite more fast and quite more long than 30 sec. In P.R. we can jump 50 times in 1 min, but we cant run... there is something wrong.
Discuss
Re: Staminia ingame versus RL one.
Posted: 2009-04-12 17:21
by Zrix
Don't forget that the soldiers in PR is actually running all the time, just extra fast when you sprint.
Re: Staminia ingame versus RL one.
Posted: 2009-04-12 17:22
by gazzthompson
Mj Pain wrote:I think the devs are on point.
Cooper test - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Official U.S. Navy SEAL Information Web Site
Kustjägare (Sverige) - Wikipedia
The PR Run
Ingame you can run (jogg) 2km in around 12min (10km/h. Navy Seal requirements equals 12km/h but they do it in trousers and boots).
Consider all things that would effect your running ability in reality.
Things like running uphill, downhill and running through forests or in deep sand.
All this while wearing your weapon, ammo, bodyarmour,boots and other gear, then 10km/h isn´t that bad.
One of Swedens top trained units, Kustjägarna test soldiers on a 6.5km run, crosscountry wearing fullgear (20kg). They have to finish in less than 40min (average speed is 9.75km/h). They also have to run a 4.5km obstacle course in less then 42min (average speed 6.4km/h).
Throwing yourself on the ground, get up running some more and then throwing yourself to the ground again will make you go tired very quickly.
In general doing things that takes muscular strenght like full sprinting until you totaly gas out will also effect your jogging pace.
The PR Sprint
Ingame you can sprint 100m in around 20 sec (18km/h)witch imo is ok, again considering things that would effect that time irl. Total sprint time is around 20 sec.
(This is changed to 30sec in PR 0.85)
Sprint reload time is 1min and 40sec but personally i don´t think 1 minute 40sec wait is much after sprinting a 100 meters in 20sec, then doing it again... In 20 sec.
(This is also going to be changed to 1min 20sec in 0.85)
The only thing that should be changed is jumping.
Getting deadtired after 2-3 jumps is not realistic. But then again it´s not realistic to be able to jump that high either. We cant animate climbing over obstacles..so.
I understand why the devs put it in the game but i never have and never will use tactical jumping around techniques (bunnyhopping)
(Btw i´m above 30 and run more than 2700m in 12min. Very Good according to Mr Cooper:mrgreen
that ^^^
also , people always get confused with running and jogging. for example hotrod says he can jog for 50 mins, then later says he can run for 50 mins.
now, im no sport science student , but running and jogging are very different. jogging is PR's normal speed. in which the in game avatar has INFINITE stamina in, which is pretty good IMO.
edit:
Zrix wrote:Don't forget that the soldiers in PR is actually running all the time, just extra fast when you sprint.
QFT, the PR player jogs everywhere , all the time... constantly . thats pretty good stamina IMO
Re: Staminia ingame versus RL one.
Posted: 2009-04-12 17:28
by Cpl.Small
yer, we've had this arguement many a time about soldiers in RL being fitter than PR but if you stop and think about it for a second then you realise that it is actually realistic maybe even a bit unrealistic, being able to jog forever lol
Re: Staminia ingame versus RL one.
Posted: 2009-04-13 08:14
by fuzzhead
just think Hotrod, how long can you maintain a MAXIMUM (the fastest you can possibly run) speed for? Of course this is while in full battlegear with rifle in hand.
Now like mentioned above, try doing this on a sanddune running uphill... or through a marsh or in mud or on rocky terrain (ie not on a perfectly paved road like on your morning jogs through the base)
remember in PR, we have NO penalty for doing such things so giving a large stamina basically means players will always be using sprint, constantly and unrealistically around terrain that otherwise would force someone to move very slowly through.
Sprinting down a paved road in combat / while under fire, is in most every circumstance, a Very Bad Idea
Re: Staminia ingame versus RL one.
Posted: 2009-04-13 10:23
by PFunk
Jumping in relation to stamina is my only beef. I think we either need to get one free jump every 20 to 30 seconds which drains no stamina or we ought to have foxholes with open slots in the rear which we can walk into and out of.
Re: Staminia ingame versus RL one.
Posted: 2009-04-13 11:08
by nick20404
You have to account for adrenalin also. Imagine if you were completely out of breath walking down a street and you come under fire, you are gonna haul *** out of there no matter how out of breath you are.
Re: Staminia ingame versus RL one.
Posted: 2009-04-13 11:14
by SgtFailure
For the adrenaline, why not increase the stamina by 30% each time u get shot by a bullet? ( i know that is a stupid idea) but the thing is, how is adrenaline going to be simulated in PR, i mean you dont get adrenaline when you are taking a stroll on the streets right? unless you are under fire of course..
Re: Staminia ingame versus RL one.
Posted: 2009-04-13 11:25
by Chuc
So.. bullets make you stronger?
Re: Staminia ingame versus RL one.
Posted: 2009-04-13 11:28
by SgtFailure
[R-DEV]Chuc wrote:So.. bullets make you stronger?
Haha if it does, u can see insurgents running around the streets with signboards telling people to shoot them. Anyway, if adrenaline is going to be simulated in PR, is there anyway to really simulate it?
Re: Staminia ingame versus RL one.
Posted: 2009-04-13 11:32
by PFunk
[R-DEV]Chuc wrote:So.. bullets make you stronger?
Maybe just make it so that while you are affected by suppression you receive a slightly lower rate of usage on your stamina while sprinting, to encourage taking cover. Thats just a slightly less insane version of that idea. Not really thrilled about it myself in any form unless overall speed was reduced, then some kind of 'under fire bonus' would make lots of sense.
Re: Staminia ingame versus RL one.
Posted: 2009-04-13 11:36
by nick20404
[R-DEV]Chuc wrote:So.. bullets make you stronger?
Everyone needs there daily dose of lead!
Re: Staminia ingame versus RL one.
Posted: 2009-04-13 11:49
by Neo_Mapper
SgtFailure wrote:For the adrenaline, why not increase the stamina by 30% each time u get shot by a bullet? ( i know that is a stupid idea) but the thing is, how is adrenaline going to be simulated in PR, i mean you dont get adrenaline when you are taking a stroll on the streets right? unless you are under fire of course..
mh likes it...
Its not realistic, but a nice way to simiulate and to improve gameplay and this is what project reality is doing, isn't it?
Improving the gameplay experience while keeping it realistic (well,... or the other way 'round
)
well now it comes to the engine limitation, do you think that there is any way of changing the stamina with being shot at or loosing health?
Re: Staminia ingame versus RL one.
Posted: 2009-04-13 11:53
by fuzzhead
For the adrenaline, why not increase the stamina by 30% each time u get shot by a bullet?
I can see it already, whole squads shooting at each others feet to travel quickly across a map... go go gadget legs!
Re: Staminia ingame versus RL one.
Posted: 2009-04-13 11:59
by nick20404
It would be nice if while getting suppressed by an enemy you gain a lil stamina just enough to run to cover.
But really if you get hit by a bullet it will most likely make you fall to the ground before giving you more energy.
Re: Staminia ingame versus RL one.
Posted: 2009-04-13 13:49
by Gore
Not this again.
Re: Staminia ingame versus RL one.
Posted: 2009-04-13 13:52
by Axel
^ I concur, you fellow try to jog around for a day.. it's not easy.
Re: Staminia ingame versus RL one.
Posted: 2009-04-13 13:56
by SgtFailure
[R-DEV]fuzzhead wrote:I can see it already, whole squads shooting at each others feet to travel quickly across a map... go go gadget legs!
then the whole team will be full of medics, people with negative score and the "Cease Fire" command all over the screen
Anyway, i like the gaining the minimum amount to sprint when being suppressed.(instead of the bullet **** i gave previously) no high hopes for it though.
Re: Staminia ingame versus RL one.
Posted: 2009-04-13 14:14
by Nemus
If we simulate adrenaline boost then we have to simulate fear too.
I mean when suddenly a grenade explodes near you and bullets start flying over your head most propably you wont have an adrenaline boost but something else boosted in your pants.
(Bad smell is harcoded?
)