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As we all know the main purpose of the rifleman's specialist shotgun is door breaching... at least 95% of door breaching happens on insurgency maps, but I was thinking what about other maps with AAS mode against regular armies? The breaching slug is useless in CQB most of the time (because it's for breaching, duh! ) and there are almost no doors to breach... in other words, shotgun is now useless on any AAS map.
So, I would like to suggest breaching ammo for shotguns on insurgency map only and buckshot ammo for shotguns on any other map for CQB purposes. It would make Rifleman Specialist kit more useful on other maps then insurgency and would make all the "shooty" fans happy

It's just a suggestion for improving game play and Rifleman Specialist kit. I can't say if it's realistic suggestion or not because at the moment, in the current asymmetrical warfare conflicts, shotguns are mainly used in the army for breaching... I can't say about symmetrical warfare since there is no big conventional war going on at the moment so it's hard to predict if it would still be used by conventional armies in CQB (or jungle warfare) but I can say it was used in the past AFAIK.


What do you think?

I dunno, there are still AAS maps such as Asad Khal with breachable doors, albeit only a few. In any case, how else will we destroy the houses on Kashan by shooting the load-bearing tables?

Run into it with a nice, overweight tank?
A Slugshot in the specialists kit would not make much sense imo, because he is a specialist, not a warrior

Why not take the rifleman specialist and make him full CQB? Give him a good CQC weapon, possible grapple, a m84 stun grenade (for room entering), give the shotgun varying slugs (satisfy door breaching and shotgun fans), HE grenades (for room clearing), more readily accessible melee weapon, some field dressings, and some smoke grenades.

The benefits would be numerous, especially on jungle and urban maps.

GreedoNeverShot wrote:Why not take the rifleman specialist and make him full CQB? Give him a good CQC weapon, possible grapple, a m84 stun grenade (for room entering), give the shotgun varying slugs (satisfy door breaching and shotgun fans), HE grenades (for room clearing), more readily accessible melee weapon, some field dressings, and some smoke grenades.

The benefits would be numerous, especially on jungle and urban maps.

no tahst over kill


@OP i dont like that suggestion becasue it puts down the iron sight rifleman, the only advantage the iron sight rifleman would have over the specialist is greanade, i thinkthe specialist should be a limited spawnable kit

Correct me if I'm wrong, but most armies don't use buckshot for conventional frontline troops. So I don't think it'd be all that realistic.

how about a cqb class than greedonevershot,, get rid of the m4 and give him a p90 or something like that, i think stungrenades might be too hard to do but a p90 would be ownage, lots of people use the mp5 on ejod

the special forces use the buckshot for close courters shooting

Scared_420 wrote:how about a cqb class than greedonevershot,, get rid of the m4 and give him a p90 or something like that, i think stungrenades might be too hard to do but a p90 would be ownage, lots of people use the mp5 on ejod

lol mate try CSS its still a good game The CS 1.6 community is also healthy so try that too, but I would shoot myself in the foot if PR because a more realistic CS.

On a lighter note. Tried looking up some info regarding the use of shotguns as antipersonnel weapons.

Didn't find much into it. How ever I recall in the book House to House, one of the Staff Sergeants used a Mossberg 590 in Fallujah.

House to House very good book btw.

Conman51=US= wrote:the only advantage the iron sight rifleman would have over the specialist is greanade

Actually it's grenades, smoke grenades and ammo bag ... anyway, the ironsight rifleman still has it's advantage over specialist ...and we could decrease the magazine count for the specialist because he has secondary weapon to make that advantage even bigger

It's just an idea and a very small change, I was only wondering how to make rifleman specialist more useful and how to put shotgun in to more use on other maps then insurgency without making radical changes.
He could carry only 16 buckshot shells (including those already loaded in the weapon) so it's not such an overkill for AAS maps IMO and of course making specialist kit limited to one per squad would also improve it

We intend to increase amount of breachable doors in future.

how about make buck shots shells able to breach so you hit 2 birds with 1 stone

Well, in the game now, large buildings become castles, that are almost impossible to clear. Anyone who has attacked the Kozelsk trenches knows that it is impossible to make it in when then have ARs, Medics, and the attackers cannot sight their weapons quickly or have huge kick back. Kill someone with a nade? Their medic will save em. Try and rush through? The AR will open up on your entire squad.
The other day I found a squad using crewman kits instead of rifleman on Muttrah (sorry confused it with Ramiel somehow), just for their machine guns.

Adding a CQC kit would ease these troubles and add a new aspect to the game. Give em the shot gun as a room clearing device and as a breaching device, and it will be an extremely useful kit.

Imagine a small squad with one Medic, a SL, and 2 CQCs. They stackup at the locked doorway of some large building crawling with enemies, and prepare themselves to enter. One CQC throws in a flash in through the window while the other breaches the door. With his shotgun out, he unloads fire into the room as he rushes in. The other CQC follows with (P90/MP7/whatever) in hand and opens up as the SL and Medic follow. Over Voip they yell "Clear!" as they search each room and takedown the enemies. All the enemies have been destroyed with their rally overwhelmed and the Team begins taking the flag now that the cap radius is clear.

Sure it was ramiel? Ramiel infantry would still have M4's with crewman.

Buckshot wouldn't be really used by infantry if they have a frickin assault rifle. Should just give specialists flashbangs as well and then its more useful than just having a grappling hook.

My opinion is that the rifleman specialist is a confused kit atm. Confused because he is generally at the front of the squad as he carries the tools to scale obstacles and break down doors, yet besides the equipment to do these things he is poorly equipped for CQB.

Okay he has an iron-sight rifle but he has no grenades and whilst using the other items of gear he is more vulnerable to hostiles.

Therefore I would like to see one of 2 things, either;

• Remove the trip flares, which are basically never used, and replace with grenades, or;
• Give the shotgun slug ammunition instead of buckshot and make it so both can breach doors

Either of those would vastly increase his effectiveness as pointman for the squad, without making the kit overpowering compared to the other rifleman kits.

i agree that the trip flares are useless. If he got 2 grenades instead of the trip flares i would never take another kit again. I love the riflemen specialist but i only ever find myself using the grappling and assault rifle. He should have some aspects of a riflemen and be a little unique at the same time.

I like the trip flares..they are very handy IMO. How ever, I agree that this kit needs something. Grenades would be very nice, but that would just make this is a riflemen kit with a hook.


I can't really think of anything we can stick on this kit that would make sense, be unique, and be functional...

Great idea,and maybe put in not just slug ammo,put in Gauge-12 too or something,cuz i really like the shotgun,but,its just 7 shots for breach slug............

The British Army is apparently equipping each lead scout in the 'Green-Zone' with a Benelli M4 semi-automatic shotgun with an EoTech Holographic sight and buckshot/slug ammunition. From what images I've seen, it looks like the scouts don't carry an L85A2 rifle.


Sources:

Fire Power Demo video by yvonneparsons - Photobucket

SOLDIER JUN 09