When using all the non scoped rifles and right click you get iron sight or red dot sight and so on. When in this mode, you walk sloooooooooooooooooooooooooow. IRL you would use these aims when clearing a building. Now they are to slow and you end up clearing a building with your weapon stance down.
I say increase movement speed when aiming with non scoped weapons. That way you can clear a building and do CQB better and more real.
Re: Faster aim (non scope) movement.
Posted: 2009-09-14 09:45
by Smegburt_funkledink
You know the movement when scoped is quicker whilst crouched than stood up, right?
Re: Faster aim (non scope) movement.
Posted: 2009-09-14 14:20
by snooggums
Sgt.Smeg wrote:You know the movement when scoped is quicker whilst crouched than stood up, right?
Yes, and that is very silly.
Re: Faster aim (non scope) movement.
Posted: 2009-09-14 14:50
by Cheditor
snooggums wrote:Yes, and that is very silly.
It's not silly. It makes you a much smaller target. If your clearing a room you dont just go running in. You take your time you do it with a bit of TACTICS in your head.
Re: Faster aim (non scope) movement.
Posted: 2009-09-14 14:58
by gazzthompson
as others have said, if you crouch you move ALOT faster.
Tho IIRC this isnt a feature but has something to do with the devs slowing the overall running speed down and not being able to do it with the crouch scope in, or something like that.
Re: Faster aim (non scope) movement.
Posted: 2009-09-14 16:26
by CAS_117
From other thread.
CAS_117 wrote:Make scopes 3d for 2 reasons:
1. Remove retarded tunnel vision and represent having 2 eyes open (sort of).
2. Have realistic range markers on the guns for ballistics.
Also we did what Mcluv said in Combined Arms, where we removed sprinting, increased walking to a jog which allowed you to move with your gun raised. Then for scopes we decided to add a 1.0x magnification level which represents the combination of shoulder firing and backup irons which are on most rifles.
I`m the chinese soldier at 9:11 shooting edible. Here I can advance with my gun raised ready to fire. In PR or BF2 I would probably have to either charge him with my gun at my hip, hold still with my scope zoomed, or sprint away to dodge the incoming grenade. In this scenario I have the option to move to his position at a moderate speed and can fire the moment he presents a target. He probably forgot that this was possible and decided to throw a grenade expecting I would either sit still and eat it or have to run away unable to fire.
Re: Faster aim (non scope) movement.
Posted: 2009-09-14 17:13
by snooggums
[R-COM]Cheditor wrote:It's not silly. It makes you a much smaller target. If your clearing a room you dont just go running in. You take your time you do it with a bit of TACTICS in your head.
In game currently, walking with the gun up is at a snails pace, crouching is close to walking speed. Try crouching at the height of the game models and move around, then stand on two feet and do the same.
Using crouch to move faster in game may be more effective (kinda like popping up and down behind cover), but please show me a SWAT or military room clearing operation where the first person into the room goes in quickly while crouched. Using unrealistic tactics because they are effective isn't a goal of PR.
There's no reason for the super snail pace that we have for guns raised currently, and no reason for it to be slower than crouching.
Re: Faster aim (non scope) movement.
Posted: 2009-09-14 22:06
by drs79
[R-COM]Cheditor wrote:It's not silly. It makes you a much smaller target. If your clearing a room you dont just go running in. You take your time you do it with a bit of TACTICS in your head.
I wish more players (both on my team, and on the other team) would think this way when entering a building on Insurgency mode, it would save a lot of non-intentional TK's and if an infantry man is going in, it would only harm himself, instead of seeing countless times, 2-3 guys right behind each other storming in only to cry "medic" when a nade trap is tripped.
I have to disagree with faster aim (non scope) Movement. Its fine the way it is, IRL sure you might be able to do it faster, though I don't know if you are basing this on your personal experience or maybe from paintball or airsoft (im not trying to make fun of you).
Slow is smooth, smooth is fast.
Re: Faster aim (non scope) movement.
Posted: 2009-09-15 02:15
by Celestial1
drs79 wrote:Slow is smooth, smooth is fast.
And contradictions is smarts.
I have a personal hate for body movement and physics in any game, and BF2 takes the cake sometimes.
If you were to walk, and then crouch-walk at that same pace, you would find that the crouch-walk is pretty uncomfortable and unwieldy to use; you'd be more likely to do so a bit more slowly compared to walking. However, you can still actually crouch and run, to an extent, which isn't possible in BF2 (but is possible in Red Orchestra).
Rasing a weapon to eye level while doing either won't slow you down at all; your aim may bounce around a small bit, but it won't impede you enough to stop you from doing CQB very much at all. Crouch walking makes your aim bounce even less due to the fact that your body is a bit more compacted, allowing your legs to do more of the walking and your upper body stay mostly stiff.
Re: Faster aim (non scope) movement.
Posted: 2009-09-15 03:42
by Chuc
It's one of those things where if we knew how to control it, we would have made those changes already. But we're still looking..
Re: Faster aim (non scope) movement.
Posted: 2009-09-15 20:01
by Spaz
I really don't like the chances you guys did to the infantry movement in CA, it feels so unnatural and weird. I think the movement in PR feels a lot more realistic, it feels like you have more control of the body.
You guys have done a very good job with the vehicles but please don't change the infantry, there is no point in trying to fix something that isn't broken.
Re: Faster aim (non scope) movement.
Posted: 2009-09-15 20:14
by McBumLuv
Spaz wrote:I really don't like the chances you guys did to the infantry movement in CA, it feels so unnatural and weird. I think the movement in PR feels a lot more realistic, it feels like you have more control of the body.
You guys have done a very good job with the vehicles but please don't change the infantry, there is no point in trying to fix something that isn't broken.
Yup. Pretty much what is lacking is anyone with sufficient time and modeling/animating skills.
Here's from another thread.
McLuv wrote:Problems:
1) While using magnified scopes, players experience tunnel vision with the black screen covering everything not seen through the scope.
2) Ironsights are at a severe disadvantage at distances otherwise easy to engage at in real life due to the resolution limitation of the computer screen.
3) CQC lacks for both iron sight and magnified sights due to the fact that it is impossible to shoulder the weapon or look through the sights/backups while clearing rooms. Players must either be jogging with the gun at their hip, or must be going at a crawling pace while possibly suffering from tunnel vision due to the magnified optics.
Solutions:
1) Hollow out the magnified scopes à la Red Dot, zoom in the entire screen while leaving only roughly 50 % of the screen's area taken up by the scope, and then adding FH2 style blur.
2) Add a slight, slow zoom to ironsights to all for focusing of the eye. A zoom of 1.3-1.5 times taking a second or two to complete is an excellent solution.
3) Redo the infantry jogging/sprinting mechanics. Decrease the current walking/jogging pace to one suitable for clearing rooms, a faster walk. Decrease the current sprint to be slightly faster than the current jog, but then get rid of loosing stamina by jogging.
Animate it so that when walking the play shoulders his/her weapon and looks through the sights/backup irons. Alternatively, the speed changes don't need changeing to at least implement this last function, but they would make it both much more functional and useful when clearing buildings and realistic.
Without the proper resources, though, CAS tried getting much of that done through a purely technical and coder's point of view. What we have in the end is a less-than polished infantry mechanic. It's a workaround, and I hate workarounds.
What I'd love to see is Chuc maybe doing what I've listed for at least one weapon, with the scope and irons, just as a proof of concept.
Chuc, would you be up to it?
Re: Faster aim (non scope) movement.
Posted: 2009-09-15 20:44
by snooggums
[R-DEV]Chuc wrote:It's one of those things where if we knew how to control it, we would have made those changes already. But we're still looking..
I'm not sure I understand this post. Do you mean that the scoped speed while walking is something that is not able to be changed as far as you know, as in the walking while scoped is either stuck at that speed? Or that crouching is also supposed to be at the same slow pace and you haven't figured out how to adjust that?
I guess I'm asking:
If the devs could adjust walking and crouching speeds while scoped and not scoped independently would the following be true:
Walking and running are what the devs want and would stay the same.
When a score is raised the player walks slower than normal movement, but a little faster than they do now.
When scoped and crouched the player would move the same speed or slightly slower than walking with scope up.
That's what I would expect would be the case.
Re: Faster aim (non scope) movement.
Posted: 2009-09-16 00:24
by Chuc
Mcluv - I'm a busy guy, but when I have the time..
snoog - What I meant was that as far as I know, we havn't been able to work out how to adjust walking speeds when sighted in.
Re: Faster aim (non scope) movement.
Posted: 2009-09-16 00:31
by Rabbit
Is there no way to add a "sprint" to zoomed in, or is that a re suggestion that i have not seen.
Re: Faster aim (non scope) movement.
Posted: 2009-09-16 01:43
by McBumLuv
[R-DEV]Chuc wrote:Mcluv - I'm a busy guy, but when I have the time..
I know, I know,
But thanks for the hope
Re: Faster aim (non scope) movement.
Posted: 2009-09-16 12:13
by CAS_117
Spaz wrote:I really don't like the chances you guys did to the infantry movement in CA, it feels so unnatural and weird. I think the movement in PR feels a lot more realistic, it feels like you have more control of the body.
You guys have done a very good job with the vehicles but please don't change the infantry, there is no point in trying to fix something that isn't broken.
So why all the threads? Obviously at least 3 people on the forums so far would like some change to CQB lol. What you call unnatural I constantly wish I had whenever I play PR and BF2 nowadays, because when I am in CQB situation I have 2 situations: Charge in hip firing, or charge in and hope they haven't sighted up yet, wait for a target, drop to a knee or prone dive, and sight in. And they always have sighted up .
No more of that. In CA I can advance on the enemy with 4x zoom at a decent walking pace, or move up crouched at a faster crouched walk in CQB mode with scopes, or irons. Either way am completely comfortable knowing that I can hit my target below 30m while still keeping a decent pace to cover all my arcs, and in urban situations peek quickly around corners without dropping my sight. This cost me the ability to sprint over 6m/s, but I never slow down, and can still turn at an instantaneous rate so as far as I'm concerned life is pretty good.
Re: Faster aim (non scope) movement.
Posted: 2009-09-16 13:09
by snooggums
[R-DEV]Chuc wrote:Mcluv - I'm a busy guy, but when I have the time..
snoog - What I meant was that as far as I know, we havn't been able to work out how to adjust walking speeds when sighted in.
Ah, haven't played regular BF2 to notice they were the same, thanks for the clarification
.