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Overkilling on assets
Posted: 2009-11-07 03:37
by Bamtoman
I mean overkilling assets by making a normal vehicle to a killing machine
Ex : Huey with a SAW and a HAT on each side = Ac 130, 3 rpgs on a transport car = mega anti-tank, transport cars with many grenade traps on them = HET bomb car (Forgot other overkills I will put them if I remembered them)
Some people argue that this is not realistic and people who do this should be perm banned from all populated PR servers, and some people say this is very effective and it helps out the team if done properly though, even if it is not "reality".
What are you opinions about overkilling?, just curious on other PR players opinions.
People who say this is should be disallowed are crazy
Re: Overkilling on assets
Posted: 2009-11-07 03:42
by gazzthompson
on the old qwai a LB with 2 HATS and a stinger on ruled the map. good times
http://www.vimeo.com/1286157
my first, and abit rubbish, film.
Re: Overkilling on assets
Posted: 2009-11-07 10:44
by Sprats
I think its realistic, nothing is overpowered that much...
anyways gazz, same thing with LBs, 1-2 saws, 1 aa rocket and 1 LAT rocket. we used to call it "attack LB"

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Re: Overkilling on assets
Posted: 2009-11-07 10:50
by rampo
TuOuF wrote:I think its realistic, nothing is overpowered that much...
anyways gazz, same thing with LBs, 1-2 saws, 1 aa rocket and 1 LAT rocket. we used to call it "attack LB"

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My favorite mix is a trans huey on muttrah, 2 Stingers and one SAW gunner on the doors... cant even remember how many FB's we took down that day

Re: Overkilling on assets
Posted: 2009-11-07 14:05
by Rudd
What are you opinions about overkilling?, just curious on other PR players opinions.
its mostly fine imo.
once the hueys get their door guns I imagine that some of this will be forced to stop since I expect there might not be a slot where your weapon is useable in the huey anymore.
Anyway, most of these tactics involve taking important assets and putting them in teh same place, 'eggs in one basket' comes to mind, if lost the team is in trouble, so its balanced anyways. If the guys using the tactic can keep their stuff alive, good for them.
Re: Overkilling on assets
Posted: 2009-11-07 14:09
by Drunkenup
We get alot of those smack tards on the Virginia server. But the tactic here has proven ineffective, most of the time the Huey comes back smoking with 4 corpses on the seats, or it doesn't even come back at all, meaning we lost both HAT kits, and a Huey. When it happens in the LB, well, same thing cept the thing never comes back and the people get kicked.
Re: Overkilling on assets
Posted: 2009-11-07 14:32
by Snazz
Well from my experience you either miss because the choppers flying fast and evading fire, or you get shot down for hovering/flying slowly near the enemy.
So if someone is doing it successfully then I can only give them credit for it.
Re: Overkilling on assets
Posted: 2009-11-07 14:38
by Gosu-Rizzle
Snazz wrote:Well from my experience you either miss because the choppers flying fast and evading fire, or you get shot down for hovering/flying slowly near the enemy.
So if someone is doing it successfully then I can only give them credit for it.
+1 Its not like this is extremely easy and something everyone can do. Most times people will loose more than they gain doing this, so thumbs up to those who can pull it off. (and thumbs down to those who just waste team assets:roll

Re: Overkilling on assets
Posted: 2009-11-07 14:57
by Neo_Mapper
The people who are flaming, are the people who couldnt do it, so they start flaming it is not fair and bla...
These tactics are very hard to be done the right way, so they are effective. it is very rare that it is overkill.
And if they work it is very fun. And thats what this game is about: FUN! dont take it too serios ladies ;D
Re: Overkilling on assets
Posted: 2009-11-07 19:24
by boilerrat

We have all seen photos like this, its a real thing so we shouldn't complain.
It is Project
Reality right?
Re: Overkilling on assets
Posted: 2009-11-07 19:57
by Eddie Baker
boilerrat wrote:We have all seen photos like this, its a real thing so we shouldn't complain.
It is Project Reality right?
Passengers (not crew-chiefs or door gunners firing mounted weapons) firing machine-guns and rifles from loaded helicopter passenger compartments is a non-issue with regards to authenticity or reality; it can be done. But it is a desperation behavior, since uncontrolled brass could spray into the cockpit; that's why door guns have a tube directing the brass downward and/or outside the helicopter, and why snipers in helicopters have brass catchers and/or just fire through the starboard door.
But in real-life you would have to be an extreme idiot to fire a recoilless launcher from such a position because of back-blast, even if both side-doors were open.
Re: Overkilling on assets
Posted: 2009-11-07 21:01
by Bringerof_D
it's not particularly unrealistic. its more improvising what PR doesnt give you. yes you can fire anti tank missiles from a helicopter, theres nothing stopping someone in real life doing it besides the fact that its rather unsafe. as for the SAW thats pretty normal.
transport car with grenade traps, well thats just another bomb car, infact this is more realistic then the other bomb cars as the player needs to prep the car and set it all up. some people just complain too much because they dont ahve the ability to do it themselves.
Re: Overkilling on assets
Posted: 2009-11-07 21:16
by Eddie Baker
Bringerof_D wrote:it's not particularly unrealistic. its more improvising what PR doesnt give you. yes you can fire anti tank missiles from a helicopter, theres nothing stopping someone in real life doing it besides the fact that its rather unsafe.
"Rather unsafe" being that even if the weapon is pointed completely parallel to the main rotor of the helicopter with both doors open, that the back-blast will deafen, render unconscious or kill anyone not beside you and disrupt air underneath the main rotor of the helicopter. Fire-from enclosure launchers still have backblast, it is just reduced, and there is still a danger area. In the case of the game, they are pointing the weapons downward, meaning that the back-blast is being directed into the ceiling of the cabin and or the rotors. Your statement should read "Yes you can fire anti-tank missiles from helicopter if you want to die and take everyone else on board the helicopter with you." So, no, it is in no way realistic in-game to fire anti-tank missiles from the passenger compartment or assault benches of a helicopter and not kill everyone on that helicopter.
Re: Overkilling on assets
Posted: 2009-11-07 21:20
by Sidewinder Zulu
[R-DEV]Eddie Baker wrote:"Rather unsafe" being that even if the weapon is pointed completely parallel to the main rotor of the helicopter with both doors open, that the back-blast will deafen, render unconscious or kill anyone not beside you and disrupt air underneath the main rotor of the helicopter. Fire-from enclosure launchers still have backblast, it is just reduced, and there is still a danger area. In the case of the game, they are pointing the weapons downward, meaning that the back-blast is being directed into the ceiling of the cabin and or the rotors. Your statement should read "Yes you can fir anti-tank missiles from helicopter if you want to die and take everyone else on board the helicopter with you." So, no, it is in no way realistic in-game to fire anti-tank missiles from the passenger compartment or assault benches of a helicopter and not kill everyone on that helicopter.
What about from a transport Littlebird, though?
I mean, the passangers in that are physically outside the cabin, so they wouldn't really be putting anyone in danger unless someone was sitting behind them.
Then again, a Littlebird weighs a lot less than a Blackhawk, so I suppose the recoil/backblast would have a greater effect on the control of the helicopter.
Certainly, it would be suicidal to fire a SRAW or Javelin from a Littlebird IRL, but what about an AT4?
Would that work?
Re: Overkilling on assets
Posted: 2009-11-07 21:29
by Eddie Baker
Sidewinder Zulu wrote:What about from a transport Littlebird, though?
I mean, the passangers in that are physically outside the cabin, so they wouldn't really be putting anyone in danger unless someone was sitting behind them.
Then again, a Littlebird weighs a lot less than a Blackhawk, so I suppose the recoil/backblast would have a greater effect on the control of the helicopter.
Certainly, it would be suicidal to fire a SRAW or Javelin from a Littlebird IRL, but what about an AT4?
Would that work?
Not only no but f*** no. See above.
On the assault benches of the MH-6 the back of your launcher will be
inches away from the fuselage of the helicopter and the main rotor no matter where you point it, where on the bench you're seated or even if you use a "modified" grip. Even with an AT4-CS (the fire from enclosure version) that is too close. The back-blast overpressure will slam into the fuselage of the helicopter and main rotor (back-blast is conical; it travels upwards, too). Your body and/or the fuselage will give, ripping you and probably your buddies off of the bench, the overpressure will enter the cabin through the removed side doors, shattering the windscreen and deafen if not outright kill the pilots.
Physics is not man's friend. It is a zoo or circus animal that is waiting for the opportunity to devour and rape (not necessarily in that order) its keeper.
Re: Overkilling on assets
Posted: 2009-11-07 21:46
by Conman51
'[R-DEV wrote:Eddie Baker;1177855']Not only no but f*** no. See above.
On the assault benches of the MH-6 the back of your launcher will be inches away from the fuselage of the helicopter and the main rotor no matter where you point it, where on the bench you're seated or even if you use a "modified" grip. Even with an AT4-CS (the fire from enclosure version) that is too close. The back-blast overpressure will slam into the fuselage of the helicopter and main rotor (back-blast is conical; it travels upwards, too). Your body and/or the fuselage will give, ripping you and probably your buddies off of the bench, the overpressure will enter the cabin through the removed side doors, shattering the windscreen and deafen if not outright kill the pilots.
Physics is not man's friend. It is a zoo or circus animal that is waiting for the opportunity to devour and rape (not necessarily in that order) its keeper.
just a OT question about the seats....are you attached to them in anyway, because i always see people just slip off once they get close to the ground..and i always see taht arm thing sticking out the side, i thought that was some kind of seat belt attachment
Re: Overkilling on assets
Posted: 2009-11-07 22:04
by Eddie Baker
Conman51 wrote:just a OT question about the seats....are you attached to them in anyway, because i always see people just slip off once they get close to the ground..and i always see taht arm thing sticking out the side, i thought that was some kind of seat belt attachment
Don't know, never ridden one and never will. I've seen this question asked in other forums and the most clear answer I saw was "there are seat-belts for guys on the planks- sort of." Considering that this answer came from an
orthopedic surgeon assigned to 160th SOAR, I didn't want to hear the details behind that.

Re: Overkilling on assets
Posted: 2009-11-08 00:39
by boilerrat
[R-DEV]Eddie Baker wrote:Passengers (not crew-chiefs or door gunners firing mounted weapons) firing machine-guns and rifles from loaded helicopter passenger compartments is a non-issue with regards to authenticity or reality; it can be done. But it is a desperation behavior, since uncontrolled brass could spray into the cockpit; that's why door guns have a tube directing the brass downward and/or outside the helicopter, and why snipers in helicopters have brass catchers and/or just fire through the starboard door.
But in real-life you would have to be an extreme idiot to fire a recoilless launcher from such a position because of back-blast, even if both side-doors were open.
I understand about the backblast, I was trying to prove the point that people do it IRL even if it isn't safe.
Re: Overkilling on assets
Posted: 2009-11-08 00:48
by Cassius
Bamtoman wrote:I mean overkilling assets by making a normal vehicle to a killing machine
Ex : Huey with a SAW and a HAT on each side = Ac 130, 3 rpgs on a transport car = mega anti-tank, transport cars with many grenade traps on them = HET bomb car (Forgot other overkills I will put them if I remembered them)
Some people argue that this is not realistic and people who do this should be perm banned from all populated PR servers, and some people say this is very effective and it helps out the team if done properly though, even if it is not "reality".
What are you opinions about overkilling?, just curious on other PR players opinions.
People who say this is should be disallowed are crazy
I agree on the HAT out of huey part, but while in name they had that bad copy of MG42 (M60) Door gunners were used with great success manning either beforementioned machinegun or an m16.
However it is not done anymore. Just shoot the fool down.
Re: Overkilling on assets
Posted: 2009-11-08 04:52
by BloodBane611
Helicopters are fragile little things that will fall out of the air if you look at them wrong. Why would you piss one off by firing a rocket from it?
*edit* Just to add something constructive:
Even soft launch rockets have significant backblast. Its kind of necessary to accelerate a heavy projectile to close to (or above) the speed of sound. A serious anti-tank system, like for instance the javelin, has to accelerate a 25 pound projectile 20 or 30 feet out of the launcher before the primary motor system can fire. That's a big bang.