Project Reality Forums

I checked to see if this was an *** but i couldnt find anything. Lock it if I'm wrong! but i was just curious if you could change the damage done to a pilot when the helicopter crashes i.e. have like 98% of the time the pilot will automatically die in the helicopter crash but the other 2% of the time the pilot can get out with flashing red health allowing for him/her to apply their field dressing and call for medivac... Its probably a stupid suggestion and a waste of time but i reckon if used with the right players it could emphasize teamwork and rescue missions. Its also kind of more realistic as most helicopters today like the apache and blackhawk have reinforced hulls and other features like collapsible wheel bases etc. which are designed to lessen the force of a crash in order to help the pilots survive.
Griggs

Youre allready a helluva lot more likely to survive a crash landing than in previous versions, thats as long as you crash it right.

Didnt they have an idea that if your helicopter got hit by a rpg it didnt explode in the air, If they dont used a special warhead.

You already have a good chance of landing, if you get hit a lot you will smoke and get disabled, and should try to make a landing. If you crash, then you will obviously just die right away.

You wouldn't obviously die right away. Choppers can take a pretty bad beating and still manage to emergency crash land. With the pilot unharmed or hurt to an extent. The choppers shouldn't always be exploding in mid air though unless the fuel tank was to ignite from being hit too many times.

ive survived plenty of helicopter crashes

The risk of losing more assets in the rescue just doesn't seem worth the risk. Maybe if the Dev's changes the pilot kit to making it's back alive (or surviving the crash for that matter) more vital to gameplay then i'll change my opinion.

Until then, i'll just go down with my ship .

I don't have much of an opinion on this subject as it relates to the game, but in RL, Pilots may very well be able to survive a "crash landing", but when a big transport bird or any other helicopter falls out of the sky and "crashes" due to some sort of catastrophic malfunction seldom are there gonna be survivors. The seated human body just cannot manage the G-forces of a vertical drop. The "re-enforced hulls" mentioned are not intended to mitigate bodily injury that occurs from a crash, it's to prevent hot lead from causing bodily flight system damage. Measures to mitigate spinal cord/neck injury in the event of a "crash landing" would be Shock Mitigation Seats like those being equipped in the Chinooks in Afghanistan. (basically they just weld on some automobile shock absorbers)

Obviously altitude and the slope/angle/composition of the terrain that your gonna be crashing into plays are huge part in your survival.

I agree that in the Game, the helicopters shouldn't just explode out of the sky.

"Shock Mitigation Seats" thats what i meant! I just completely blanked at the time. But the refined general idea now is that you could have a) no exploding helicopters unless they are hit by significant amounts of either RPGs, Heavy MGs or other AA etc. (im pretty sure thats where armoured hulls come in, correct me if im wrong) and b) when you get engine failure the pilot should have at least some chance of walking away injured to an extent but survivable enough that they can make it to a cover spot for evac... Unless you limited pilot kits further making them more vital to gameplay too so therefore there would be some reason to rescuing a downed pilot... I dunno just throwing ideas out.
Griggs

SGT.Ice wrote:You wouldn't obviously die right away. Choppers can take a pretty bad beating and still manage to emergency crash land. With the pilot unharmed or hurt to an extent. The choppers shouldn't always be exploding in mid air though unless the fuel tank was to ignite from being hit too many times.

guys the choppers already do that they get disabled and crash land when they take too much hits and when they keep taking hits they will explode so it is possible to crash land and survive

Well crash landings can't be imitated because of the BF2 engine. If a helo is shot to pieces, then everything dies, not just a piece of the airframe, allowing the passengers to survive (most cases). But, yes, I've been too many pilots make it out of crashes.

Just got shot down last night on Yamalia, jumped out grabbed a Crewman kit off the crate I dropped. Then shot the three Canadians who bum rushed me and hid in the grass untill another chopper picked me up.

'= wrote:H[=ElvishKnight;1312616']Just got shot down last night on Yamalia, jumped out grabbed a Crewman kit off the crate I dropped. Then shot the three Canadians who bum rushed me and hid in the grass untill another chopper picked me up.

Win.


There was a thread a month or so back, where it was a suggestion to have the pilot kit linked to the vehicle's "ticket value". Basically, if the pilot were to survive, (lets say, for 10 minutes or so, so it doesn't stack values) then the chopper would be only worth, say, 3 tickets instead of 6. If the pilot got killed in the process, it would be 6 tickets.


Back to your suggestion, if the chopper takes enough damage it will blow up in mid air. It can, however, be disabled (which happens most of the time) and you slowly coast to your doom. Just try and find a flat spot, and also try to have more forward movement then downwards. Saved my life more then a few times =)

I remember pilots getting shot down and surviving all the time on Ramiel in I think the 0.86 beta. For some reason what always seems to happen now is that my helo gets hit and is damaged, I can try to fly it back or just dump it and get to live. If I fly it back it may explode part way there (which makes pretty much no sense) but it also might get repaired and so save the chopper.

I really don't know why choppers just explode after a while and never seem to lose engine any more, and even if they do they usually explode when they hit the ground.

more and more I want to see the HP of all vehicles go up, but the HP level at which they get disabled systems slightly lowered

[R-CON]Rudd wrote:more and more I want to see the HP of all vehicles go up, but the HP level at which they get disabled systems slightly lowered

This...

I'm still seeing helicopters completely shredded most of the time upon impact. Seeing as the ability to auto-rotate isn't actually feasible AFAIK, we still need to try and imitate the technical effects of it.

Helicopter crashes are some of the most survivable in the world, even at a height. However I believe as well that the ability to pierce helicopter armour and actually kill the crew inside isn't well replicated. In other words, it should still be possible to kill some of the pilots or passengers in a helicopter using a missile or Auto-cannon rounds whilst only disabling the helicopter so that it crashes and the survivors can get out.

While I realize DCS: Blackshark is still a simulator, it's basically a complete sim. in it you'll find however that most helicopter crashes (not due to overspeeding rotor-disks colliding with each other) caused by enemy fire and engine disabling often result in the helicopter crashing in such a way that the pilot would survive without the need of an ejection seat.

McLuv wrote:This...

I'm still seeing helicopters completely shredded most of the time upon impact. Seeing as the ability to auto-rotate isn't actually feasible AFAIK, we still need to try and imitate the technical effects of it.

Helicopter crashes are some of the most survivable in the world, even at a height. However I believe as well that the ability to pierce helicopter armour and actually kill the crew inside isn't well replicated. In other words, it should still be possible to kill some of the pilots or passengers in a helicopter using a missile or Auto-cannon rounds whilst only disabling the helicopter so that it crashes and the survivors can get out.

While I realize DCS: Blackshark is still a simulator, it's basically a complete sim. in it you'll find however that most helicopter crashes (not due to overspeeding rotor-disks colliding with each other) caused by enemy fire and engine disabling often result in the helicopter crashing in such a way that the pilot would survive without the need of an ejection seat.

Blackhawks are rated to crash land with their troop compartment intact, and I would say the same with the other transport choppers ingame. This would include the ancient UH-1N, and Mi-8. For the sake of realism, I think that the deceleration and altitude lower rates should be lowered, as helos ingame will stop on a dime and lower themselves like that particle accelerator somewhere in Switzerland went out of control and gravity increased 10-fold. Not really the case in real life. Increase the damage taken in by Skids, wheels, and under-bodies of Helicopters. And allow the helicopter to be steered in all axis, unlike as if its locked in one position. Rather, make the disabled helicopter physic basically a jammed down Throttle-down button.

Helicopters don't "glide" down to ground! They DROP OUTTA THE SKY! Unless the rotors/gearbox are in good enough condition to auto-rotate.
And in the event that you survive, it highly unlikely that you will be able to move.

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NASALANGLEY — March 12, 2010 — The second crash test of a small lightweight helicopter at NASA's Langley Research Center in Hampton, Va., was a smashing success, literally -- just as engineers had predicted.
The helicopter smacked hard into the concrete. Its skid gear collapsed, its windscreen cracked open and its occupants lurched forward violently, suffering potentially spine-crushing injuries according to internal data recorders. The crash test was all in the name of research to try to make helicopters safer.

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The passenger compartments might stay intact, that doesn't mean that YOUR SPINE WILL! Not to mention the Turbines and Gearboxes that are gonna come crushing down thru the hull.

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http://www.ire.org/resourcecenter/view.php?number=15844

http://www.ire.org/resourcecenter/view.php?number=21770

wood_badger wrote:Helicopters don't "glide" down to ground! They DROP OUTTA THE SKY!

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NASALANGLEY — March 12, 2010 — The second crash test of a small lightweight helicopter at NASA's Langley Research Center in Hampton, Va., was a smashing success, literally -- just as engineers had predicted.
The helicopter smacked hard into the concrete. Its skid gear collapsed, its windscreen cracked open and its occupants lurched forward violently, suffering potentially spine-crushing injuries according to internal data recorders. The crash test was all in the name of research to try to make helicopters safer.

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The passenger compartments might stay intact, that doesn't mean that YOUR SPINE WILL!

The first video is a example of a South Korean Army Chinook, BREAKING IN HALF, thus severing power, something that can't be replicated in PR, unless the aircraft is hit by a rocket/missile. The second helicopter was a testbed out of a MD-500, basically a civilian version of our MH-6. Sure they might not survive that crash, but the helicopter is a tin can. There are countless events where people survive helicopter crashes, Mogadishu, 93' I think it was, the Second Blackhawk to crash had a crew of 4, that all survived.

Drunkenup wrote:The first video is a example of a South Korean Army Chinook, BREAKING IN HALF, thus severing power, something that can't be replicated in PR, unless the aircraft is hit by a rocket/missile. The second helicopter was a testbed out of a MD-500, basically a civilian version of our MH-6. Sure they might not survive that crash, but the helicopter is a tin can. There are countless events where people survive helicopter crashes, Mogadishu, 93' I think it was, the Second Blackhawk to crash had a crew of 4, that all survived.

The point i'm trying to make is that there are "helicopter crashes" and "helicopter crash-landings" not to be confused with eachother.
However the physics are same regardless of the type of helicopter, and the helicopter is the not the subject here, it's the human body, the spine is highly susceptible to extreme damage during a compression situation like a helo crash.

Plus If you did manage to survive the crash, you are more than likely not gonna be walking away from it.

Anyways this is impossible really to argue, because obviously every incident is different from the next, but comments like "helicopters crashes are most survivable in the world" is just ignorant and unfounded.


Yeah the vid is a poor example, but quite shocking.