Project Reality Forums

What is everyone's opinion on using special kits like the HAT and Combat Engineer on insurgency maps?

It is just that to me is seems every one thinks there is no situation that they should be used. I feel that they (as long as they are used responsibly) should be. I'm not talking about the HAT guy going into the middle of the city and doing some sniping. Or the Engi. going all rambo.

I only bring this up because a few days ago I was on a server where people were bitching about the Insurgency having our AR. Where does it end? Will some people only be happy after we are only able to request pilot kits?



Pretty much guys:
1) No they should never be used
2) They should be used only when needed. (You can see the cache on the other hill. Snipe that sucker)
3) 2 + with permission from commander and while being backed up by a full 2nd squad.

I personally like option 3. Two squads should be enough to defend assets as important as either HAT or Engi.

Its just too much of risk to take some special kits.
HAT=All armor down whit single hit.
ENGY=Every single vehicle can be turned into bombcar


Just dont take them, simple.

Agree on HAT, there should be no reason to see anyone with that kit on Insurgency. Combat Engineers on the other hand can in my opinion be used to clear mined bridges quite safely with the rest of the squad (and usually an APC/IFV waiting to cross) standing guard, and once the bridge is clear, the engineer kit can be dumped in the river, out of anyone's reach.

4) people taking sniper/hat/engineer should be kicked in the nuts

5) People should remove, untwist, then reapply panties.

The HAT is a tremendously powerful weapon. Solution to making sure it doesn't get taken by the enemy? Keep the kit within 2 seconds of a TOW, HMG, or AA. Think you might be overrun? Hop on, when you die, the kit isn't dropped because you died in a "vehicle". Respect the capibilities and limitations of the kit, and it's perfectly fine to use.

CE can be used to clear mines while on a push, or to set counter ambushes on routes insurgents frequent. Lose the kit? Baawwwwww insurgents get mines. Just like with sappers. Bawwww insurgents get extra bombcars. People say this like they don't already kill every insurgent vehicle they come across, especially if they're in a vehicle. Dirtbikes are comically bad bombcars, owing to the difficulty in controling it and the ease of shooting the driver off of it. If a CE enabled bombcar killed something, a normal bombcar would have killed it as well.

Quitcherbitchin and use the lovely advantages provided to you.

Waiwaiwait, sniper? Snipers are excellent assets in ins, their long range lets them to gauge enemy activity (leading to finding hidden caches), their killing power gets their team intel, and everything else snipers are useful for. Of course, there's a difference between a sniper and a climb-the-mosque-tower-without-any-backup/spotter sniper.

Hat=Fine if it stays in the main base and is used for killing technicals that try to camp mains/Gary driving in (Archer).
Combat engineer= Fine if it used for the sole purpose of removing mines that would other-wise seriously impair your team, just going out with it to find mines is silly.
Sniper=Depends on map, but is best if it stays around the main.

In my opinion, the amount of m249s/grenadiers that Bluefor gives away is a bigger problem, when people just take the kit for the sake of having it and then just walk into a city full of insurgents.

I think CE/HAT should be removed from Insurgent maps. The only real use they have is giving them to the enemy. What can you do with a HAT that you couldn't do with guys on the ground pushing through the city like they're supposed to? What is that, you say you want to disarm mines? Are you so daft that you really believe it's simply mines there and no one is waiting to ambush?

Sorry option 1 is the only real choice for players who aren't about getting limited kits. The only tools you really need are all found with spawn kits, stop being soo damn l33t and trying to find a reason to lose a kit that will ruin the game for BluFor.

TLDR: Rifle/Spc/Medic/SL are the only kits needed to destroy a cache, use your brain and quit wasting assets.

By all means everyone has a different playing style. I'm just stating my thoughts on it. Both ways of looking at this have their up sides and down. Sadly there will always be people that use these kits irresponsibly.

Murphy wrote:use your brain

But you don't see, that is one thing people that say "Never!" aren't doing. If a HAT or CE is used properly it can save countless tickets.

Saarna wrote:engineer kit can be dumped in the river, out of anyone's reach.

That is true. I've seen it done like that, but I've always though of it as an exploitation. And that sir to me seems cheap.

mat552 wrote:Quitcherbitchin and use the lovely advantages provided to you.

Word.

I think what I'm trying to get at is if you pull up your squad screen and see someone with a HAT; do not go right off telling him how much of a noob he is. Take a moment and try and see what he is doing. That noob might be clearing mines for the APC that is about to roll in and save your squad. He could also be about to snipe that cache that you have been getting raped trying to get to.

Lutefisk wrote:And the sniper rifle is used for taking out targets at a distance, this is good except for the fact that the insurgents have unlimited amount of tickets rendering your kill useless (and dont try with that high priority target thing, we all know that the insurgents can just respawn without any penalties at all).

Intel. Kills get you intel. That's the bit that matters.

Not that I'm saying there should be a sniper on each blufor team. It's just that it's perfectly understandable when there is.

Has anyone tried filling a transport humvee with special kits and drive around the roads of Karbala, yelling "Problem, insurgents?" while trolling with all the cool toys they can't get? I certainly haven't, but it could be interesting.

Powerfull kits come with a great responsability.

Although alot of people have already pointed out the fact that using them on insurgency gamemode is unconventional, it's also important to keep in mind that in certain scenarios the combat engineer kit as an example, can become vital when a minefield is hindering armor from delivering support to infantry squads.

The trick is to think alternative while still keeping it rational.
Making a list of all the possibilities would be too long.

A simple example is that the armored units, deploy their smoke to cover the exposed engineer while he clears out the road for mines. This allows the infantry squads to keep progressing towards their primary objectives without having to fallback to the armor, while still providing the required cover for the engineer. However, the lack of CQB ability of the armor would naturally bring the engineer in grave danger if multiple enemies managed to get within shooting range of the minefield. This is where the 50.cals ontop of the tanks come into play. The drivers of the armored units can add surpressive fire which gives the tank gunners time to deploy High Explosive rounds. In the mean time, the smoke would allow the engineer cover to escape to his or her vehicle.

The fact is that you will never have a 100% success rate, but by diminishing the dangers to the best of your ability, the kit is less likely to fall into the wrong hands, and instead be an important lifeline for your team.

Staker wrote:Has anyone tried filling a transport humvee with special kits and drive around the roads of Karbala, yelling "Problem, insurgents?" while trolling with all the cool toys they can't get? I certainly haven't, but it could be interesting.

Would be perfect on a 1channel mumbler server.

US: We have a HAT,CE,AA and sniper in here.
Ins: Get out
US: No, aren't you going to blow us up?
Ina: .....Get out, please?

Vanya wrote:Would be perfect on a 1channel mumbler server.

US: We have a HAT,CE,AA and sniper in here.
Ins: Get out
US: No, aren't you going to blow us up?
Ina: .....Get out, please?

So you consider denying the enemy an asset by dumping it in a river an exploit, but it'd be all well and good to drive around in a Humvee chock full of high value kits, because they'll disappear into thin air should the occupants be killed?

I'd say whatever happens on inside of game should be according to what happens in real world. Thus Project Reality.

Saarna wrote:So you consider denying the enemy an asset by dumping it in a river an exploit, but it'd be all well and good to drive around in a Humvee chock full of high value kits, because they'll disappear into thin air should the occupants be killed?

Ill be sure to add Jk next time.

Lutefisk wrote:I wouldnt want to bring this up but you can do fairly exactly the same things that a sniper can with an officer kit, to be honest the only difference between a sniper and a officer is the gun (and the fact that the officer can make fob's, have more patches, grenades and such). And the sniper rifle is used for taking out targets at a distance, this is good except for the fact that the insurgents have unlimited amount of tickets rendering your kill useless (and dont try with that high priority target thing, we all know that the insurgents can just respawn without any penalties at all).

The sniper really only does good in AAS, since then the enemy team looses tickets and since they are usually more organized its easier to unorganize them by killing people.

You do know that for every kill you get intel-points, thus making it for your team easier to find a cache??

Well I would do it like this:
-Guy taking HAT instant ban/kick.
-Engineer kick if going to play 1337 C4-Ninja, otherwise fine.
-Sniper, same as Engineer.

I have to agree with some guys here, SAWs and Grenadiers cause much more problems, than the special kits. I mean I have seen hundreds of times the INS team with like 5 SAWs, those being an impassable defense for BluFor forces. There are always exploits and stuff like that, we'll have to live with it, same goes for the hardcoded players.

quaazi wrote:Waiwaiwait, sniper? Snipers are excellent assets in ins, their long range lets them to gauge enemy activity (leading to finding hidden caches), their killing power gets their team intel, and everything else snipers are useful for. Of course, there's a difference between a sniper and a climb-the-mosque-tower-without-any-backup/spotter sniper.

Ohh I got my hate for snipers in insurgency when I tried Commanding for my first time...

"Sniper Squad, please move to the marker and provide me with intel".

"Negative"

"Sniper Squad... Why not? What are you even doing there?"

"We are getting kills".

Elektro wrote: Although alot of people have already pointed out the fact that using them on insurgency gamemode is unconventional, it's also important to keep in mind that in certain scenarios the combat engineer kit as an example, can become vital when a minefield is hindering armor from delivering support to infantry squads.

I'll be honest, I've never seen such situation before...

"Sniper Squad... I need you to move to the location and give me intel."

"NO COMMANDER. WHAT DO YOU WANT US TO DO? GET KILLS OR GET INTEL??"

Me = mental facepalm = resign

The more the better?