Project Reality Forums

Hi.
I found some Taliban-made video,where Taliban use this weapon.

Source

So my idea - why not to make this weapon in huge,opened maps like op.Archer.
Actually - BLUFOR have more power thats taliban on 150%(Opened hills,optic sights,uberMG with optics,uber APCs etc.),thats what i say can be make more team balance.
So i think taliban can be choose between 2 SPGs on 1 Milan ATGM.

Lol...seriously, Talibans must have only four/five of them that they took from the French Forces few years ago...I guess they have not infinite ammo for them too.

This isn't realistic to give them a MILAN on a single map really.

lol.... just because you found a video of a taliban soilder using a milan rocket system does not mean it would fit in the mod and it does not mean it is realistic

i also second what hautecloque said

Giving them a Milan would be madness. It won't be realistic, and people would definitely build the Milan instead of the SPG

Better to give them a newer Russian RPG or something like that, the RPG-29 is much stronger then the RPG-7

Just a vid YouTube - ???-29 «??????»

But you should definitely only have new weapons in very small amounts, the RPG 7 is used so much that the chance that you get hit by a RPG 29 or Milan ATGM very small.

lol at the vid poison, I like how tehy use an abrams as a target for the CGI bit
Back on topic, I disagree with this, it's too rare to be considered realistic

[R-DEV]Hauteclocque wrote:Lol...seriously, Talibans must have only four/five of them that they took from the French Forces few years ago...I guess they have not infinite ammo for them too.

I know they managed to steal a few of them a while back, but it's also likely the guy in the video obtained it and was trained to operate it by a ME source.

I didn't know they had been trained by a ME source, thanks for the info.

Actually, they haven't really stolen the MILANs...we let them after a retreat (French Forces were under heavy fire and had to retreat, but they didn't manage to destroy the MILANs before leaving...that reminds me WWII French stuff being reprocessed by the Germans after our defeat :mrgreen

Anyway, MILAN missiles are quite expensive, I don't think any "friend" country would provide the Talibans ammo.

For info, one MILAN missile is 15K Euros.

if the insurgents and taliban factions *would* get those, id suggest then to have Quick Kill or Trophy APS for all heavy assets of the coalition forces and IDF

funny thought, but, amongst other things, im sure PR is way too small for those addons

[R-DEV]Hauteclocque wrote:Lol...seriously, Talibans must have only four/five of them that they took from the French Forces few years ago...I guess they have not infinite ammo for them too.

This isn't realistic to give them a MILAN on a single map really.

Yeah,in general - taliban got some modern weapon like Milan or RPG-29,just in my opinion for some maps they can be make more balance.As I say - BLUFOR got all,taliban got nothing.

I think here balance more thats realism.In facts - IDF in PR got to many NAMER APCs thats M113,To many TAVORs thats M4A1/M16
RusArmy got to many optics sights in AKs and less UGLs thats in RL.
German Army got only too much PUMAs(I don't see any PUMAs in Afghanistan,only Fenneks,Dingo and TPz-1)

Why not to make this for taliban?Get him less ammo loaded in.(1 shoot)

samogon100500 wrote:Why not to make this for taliban?Get him less ammo loaded in.(1 shoot)

Maybe one shot, if the weapon can only be found at one weapon cache during the entire round, and that is definitely not worth it.

I would like to see a new RPG like RPG- 29 or RPG-32 for the Russian HAT kit though. The RPG-29 rocket isn't guided, but its fast as hell.

But on topic: I doubt that this is so important at the moment, the Taliban are supposed to be Taliban, not a Army. They use everything they get, putting every weapon they might get in the game would only make it confusing and waste time

[R-DEV]Hauteclocque wrote:Lol...seriously, Talibans must have only four/five of them that they took from the French Forces few years ago...I guess they have not infinite ammo for them too.

Is there a possibility that there we some pieces sent to the Mujahideen in the 80?

samogon100500 wrote:I think here balance more thats realism.In facts - IDF in PR got to many NAMER APCs thats M113,To many TAVORs thats M4A1/M16
RusArmy got to many optics sights in AKs and less UGLs thats in RL.
German Army got only too much PUMAs(I don't see any PUMAs in Afghanistan,only Fenneks,Dingo and TPz-1)

my experience in PR is: the more heavy assets BLUFOR uses, the more tickets they lose. in my opinion only a couple of PR players are able to use those heavy assets in a way which makes them more effective than ticket-cost intensive. when im on INS side im always relieved to recognize the enemy using its vehicles, because it usually leads to a way faster victory to my team.

is that the balance thing you spoke about?

PoisonBill wrote:Maybe one shot, if the weapon can only be found at one weapon cache during the entire round, and that is definitely not worth it.

I would like to see a new RPG like RPG- 29 or RPG-32 for the Russian HAT kit though. The RPG-29 rocket isn't guided, but its fast as hell.

But on topic: I doubt that this is so important at the moment, the Taliban are supposed to be Taliban, not a Army. They use everything they get, putting every weapon they might get in the game would only make it confusing and waste time

1)Am about stationary deployable weapon.
2)RPG29 = RPG7 with Tandem warhead but can be shoot at 500m(RPG-7 Tandem - 200m) anyway we have that in small quantity,And RPG-32 - makes only for export.
3)Yo know - i think ATGMs could be better thats suicide bomber cars.I will see suicide cars in city combats,but not on desert with mountains.Generally suicide bombers attack FOBs or City centers,but not heavy vehicles on the move.

Furst wrote:my experience in PR is: the more heavy assets BLUFOR uses, the more tickets they lose. in my opinion only a couple of PR players are able to use those heavy assets in a way which makes them more effective than ticket-cost intensive. when im on INS side im always relieved to recognize the enemy using its vehicles, because it usually leads to a way faster victory to my team.

is that the balance thing you spoke about?

Am understand your point of view - I never use any heavy vehicles on insurgency.Actually I think taliban got any weapon for fighting in city or mountains with fores,but hes jus a mowing frags for BLUFOR on maps like Op.Archer.

CroCop wrote:Is there a possibility that there we some pieces sent to the Mujahideen in the 80?

I've never heard a whisper of Milans being sent to the Mujahideen via any source, and even if they had the lifespan on most missiles is such that they wouldn't even have been operational in 2001 when the US invaded. Much more likely that a country like Iran or Pakistan procured them for the Taliban.


I don't think the Milan is a very reasonable choice for the Taliban because even though they clearly have working copies of the weapon, they're very rare. Limited numbers of both launchers and missiles means they're not a significant part of combat over there. It'd be like giving the US forces the XM-25, simply because a few of them are deployed in-theater.

Well IDK I heard only rumors that the CIA actually supplied them with MILAN ATGMs alongside the Stingers (since Stingers were already advanced tech I wouldnt be surprised if they also gave them MILANs...but still this is just my opinion based on a rumor so it doesnt hold onto steady ground)

Also does someone know if there were any reports on usage of the Sagger by the Taliban? I tried looking up on that but other than a few rumors about Pakistani's training and supplying the Talib's with them, I havent found anything concrete

The DEVS will use weapons that we know for a fact that the taliban are using very often not somthing thats used very very rarley and hard to obtain for the taliban.

Not merely a rumor, CroCop; you are correct, Milan launchers and missiles, and the training to use them, were supplied to the Mujaheddin during the 1980s. It has been fairly well documented in books about the conflict, but here are some whispers for you, Bloodbane, courtesy of Lester Grau (author and editor of one of the books I mentioned), Liveleak and Time Magazine.

Afghan guerrilla warfare: in the ... - Google Books

Afghanistan: An End in Sight? - TIME

LiveLeak.com - 1980's era Milan missile against Soviets. No comments blocked or deleted.

The knowledge base may still be in the Taliban to use the ones captured in 2009 from the French contingent. And even if it isn't there, both Iran and Pakistan use the Milan, too, and could no doubt re-acquaint them with it.

Sorry for slightly ot: Is PR trying to stay "up to date"? Do you introduce new weapons when they are issued to the armies you represent? Or are you "historical" portraying fighting at a certain date?

The issue isn't so much one of realism; as mentioned, many of the factions like Russia, China, and the IDF are certainly better equipped in-game (ex: a scope on almost every Russian and Chinese assault rifle) than a line unit of similar function would be IRL. The DEV's have set PR "in the near future"/parallel which gives them more freedom when it comes to equipment and maps.

The issue with introducing MILAN's for Taliban is one of balance. Imagine there is an established-asset- threshold for every map. This represents the limit of scope on how powerful the fighting factions' assets can be in relation to their opponents'. If you give Taliban the MILAN on Archer, you are exceeding the current threshold. In order to maintain a similar level of balance as before, you then also need to give Bluefor a F-16 or A-10 or Apache. See where this is going...

I guess the actual question we should be asking is not whether it's realistic, but whether the current balance on Taliban map(s) is favorable. I think it is.